Gas and Bloating and Burps, Oh My!

[moreorless]

terrible burps, gas and bloating (Aerophagia) now

Here is an article that may help with managing and/or preventing aerophagia - wiki/index.php/Aerophagia

On this forum I have read that the bi-pap is helpful for people suffering with aerophagia, but when I read about it on other resources on the net, the results are mixed....

A pressure of 8.0 cm is relatively low. If your pressure is 8.0 cm, it is unlikely that a BiPAP will help with aerophagia. But, you will never know without a trial. Maybe your doctor can order a one-week trial if you don't soon get relief.

going to read that link somehow this is probably happening to me horrobile gas and bloating

[ChicagoGranny]

horrobile

I like this word.

[nicholasjh1]

Here is the link to the machine I have. There is no data on it, it is the "brick" of CPAP's
https://www.cpapman.com/manual-machines ... -1485.html

I called my doctor earlier because I was thinking the same thing you were, that I don't want to have to change machines numerous times. If I need a bi-pap, I should just get it now. I didn't know that about insurance companies having to pay for an upgrade, I will look into that.

On this forum I have read that the bi-pap is helpful for people suffering with aerophagia, but when I read about it on other resources on the net, the results are mixed....

Should I wait and see if it gets better? Does that actually happen? It's pretty painful. I took a nap for one hour yesterday in the afternoon, and I could barely make dinner because I was so bloated and in pain.

Also, could it be effecting my AHI if the air is going in my stomach? It's certainly effecting my sleep quality because I keep waking up to burp and pass gas.

Brother, I cannot believe I am having this conversation, but I am very thankful to you kind folks for the support and having it with me.

My aerophagia got better. I followed some online advice for it which was to raise pressure. This helped presumably because rather then having to wait for the machine to raise pressure and "force" the airway open, at a high enough pressure the airway just remains open. You are more likely to get aerophagia if your airway collapses because the air tries to find someplace else to go. In addition the sphincter protecting your esophagous(sp?) can strengthen over time due to CPAP usage.

[Pugsy]

My aerophagia got better. I followed some online advice for it which was to raise pressure. This helped presumably because rather then having to wait for the machine to raise pressure and "force" the airway open, at a high enough pressure the airway just remains open. You are more likely to get aerophagia if your airway collapses because the air tries to find someplace else to go. In addition the sphincter protecting your esophagous(sp?) can strengthen over time due to CPAP usage.

Your thinking is a bit flawed....these machines don't do a darn thing when the airway collapses. They don't raise the pressure trying to "force the airway open" at all. Instead they sit by and twiddle their little thumbs until breathing resumes and the airway opens up and then they will try to evaluate things and best prevent that from happening again if using auto adjusting pressures.

Now if a person happens to have the airway collapse they might gulp more air in an effort to gasp and breathe and that MIGHT make the aerophagia worse if that air ends up in the gut.
Air in the belly has 2 choices for exiting the body...big burp or the other end once it is in the stomach or gut.

And where did you get the idea that the LES can strengthen because of cpap usage?
Now maybe if the LES was damaged due to stomach acids and maybe if the GERD stops with cpap therapy then maybe the LES might heal up and not be so weak...and maybe it heals up with scar tissue and can't close well at all.
All that is a big maybe depending on what might have damaged the LES and/or if it is damaged.
Awful lot of maybes going on there.

CPAP doesn't help everyone's GERD...it's like everything else...big YMMV sticker.

More pressure is NOT the remedy for 99.9999% of the people who are having severe aerophagia issues.

[ChicagoGranny]

99.9999% of the people

Pugsy, How sure are you?

[Pugsy]

ugsy, How sure are you?

Had to leave room for the one weirdo outlier who wants to argue about it. Just not in the mood or frame of mind for another time consuming and not particularly fruitful discussion on something that is primarily common sense because those that don't have any won't recognize the main problem anyway.

[ChicagoGranny]

Some days, it seems like whack-a-mole here. You no sooner knock one piece of incorrect advise back into their hole, and two more pop up.

[nicholasjh1]

My aerophagia got better. I followed some online advice for it which was to raise pressure. This helped presumably because rather then having to wait for the machine to raise pressure and "force" the airway open, at a high enough pressure the airway just remains open. You are more likely to get aerophagia if your airway collapses because the air tries to find someplace else to go. In addition the sphincter protecting your esophagous(sp?) can strengthen over time due to CPAP usage.

Your thinking is a bit flawed....these machines don't do a darn thing when the airway collapses. They don't raise the pressure trying to "force the airway open" at all. Instead they sit by and twiddle their little thumbs until breathing resumes and the airway opens up and then they will try to evaluate things and best prevent that from happening again if using auto adjusting pressures.

Now if a person happens to have the airway collapse they might gulp more air in an effort to gasp and breathe and that MIGHT make the aerophagia worse if that air ends up in the gut.
Air in the belly has 2 choices for exiting the body...big burp or the other end once it is in the stomach or gut.

And where did you get the idea that the LES can strengthen because of cpap usage?
Now maybe if the LES was damaged due to stomach acids and maybe if the GERD stops with cpap therapy then maybe the LES might heal up and not be so weak...and maybe it heals up with scar tissue and can't close well at all.
All that is a big maybe depending on what might have damaged the LES and/or if it is damaged.
Awful lot of maybes going on there.

CPAP doesn't help everyone's GERD...it's like everything else...big YMMV sticker.

More pressure is NOT the remedy for 99.9999% of the people who are having severe aerophagia issues.

I wouldn't say 99.9999%, you have nothing to back that up. I do agree that if it is positional etc, then yes raising pressure would not help. It may not help in many cases... However if you are getting aerophagia during collapsed airway, then raising the minimum pressure to cause less events can help, it certainly helped with me, and it helped immediately. from horrible pain and farting basically all day, to virtually no issues. In any case it's something easy to try, now admittedly for the OP it sounds like the issue is positional, so higher pressure probably won't help them.

[Pugsy]

I wouldn't say 99.9999%, you have nothing to back that up.

Never said I did but then you can't back up your claim as to the contrary either.
Let's call it a draw and just say each person has a right to politely disagree and state our contrary opinions to which we are both certainly entitled to voice.
I won't throw in 40 years experience in the medical field and 9 plus years as a cpap user as any sort of back up to my opinions.
Doesn't really matter anyway. You found something that works for you and like most people think that it should work for the bulk of the rest of the world. It would sure be nice if things worked out that way and there weren't so many YMMV stickers to muddy up things.

FWIW...you are the only person that I have heard that says more pressure helped but I think I know why it seems to have helped you.
Count your blessings...you are the outlier and got lucky.
What you might do is the next time you want to offer your experience is confirm that someone is needing to reduce apneas first and that the apneas can be fixed with more pressure. Sometimes people do have central apnea...we can't fix central apnea with more pressure and for some unlucky people more pressure can actually make the central apnea worse. Sometimes "more pressure" is a bad idea and it's best to know what you are fighting first and secondly can it be fixed with more pressure safely.
I am sure you don't want to offer advice that might potentially make someone's apnea worse or harm someone. No one wants to do that.

[nicholasjh1]

I wouldn't say 99.9999%, you have nothing to back that up.

Never said I did but then you can't back up your claim as to the contrary either.
Let's call it a draw and just say each person has a right to politely disagree and state our contrary opinions to which we are both certainly entitled to voice.
I won't throw in 40 years experience in the medical field and 9 plus years as a cpap user as any sort of back up to my opinions.
Doesn't really matter anyway. You found something that works for you and like most people think that it should work for the bulk of the rest of the world. It would sure be nice if things worked out that way and there weren't so many YMMV stickers to muddy up things.

FWIW...you are the only person that I have heard that says more pressure helped but I think I know why it seems to have helped you.
Count your blessings...you are the outlier and got lucky.
What you might do is the next time you want to offer your experience is confirm that someone is needing to reduce apneas first and that the apneas can be fixed with more pressure. Sometimes people do have central apnea...we can't fix central apnea with more pressure and for some unlucky people more pressure can actually make the central apnea worse. Sometimes "more pressure" is a bad idea and it's best to know what you are fighting first and secondly can it be fixed with more pressure safely.
I am sure you don't want to offer advice that might potentially make someone's apnea worse or harm someone. No one wants to do that.

I F'd up in my original message... It doesn't mean that I should be shamed or that you should post a clearly wrong 99.9999% post. It could be that this method could work for 20%... if you never suggest it, the aerophagia will never be solved that way... and you'll be fulfilling your own prophecy.

I never said it would work for everyone... I even say that in my last message. I have no idea of the occurance because I haven't performed a scientific experiment on it. All I know is I found the advice online, and it worked for me... so it worked for at least 2 people, no doubt it's worked for more and in fact it may work for quite a few... not .0001%... since we have no idea how many have tried this counterintuitive method... It's not common sense or against common sense just because it "seems" like a higher pressure would cause more aerophagia, we all know common sense is often wrong. In addition, I even go so far as to say that it probably won't work for the original poster as their description sounds like more of a positional problem. I get that higher pressure could cause central apnea. I'll be more descriptive in future messages...

[Pugsy]

It doesn't mean that I should be shamed

I am truly sorry you feel that I shamed you. That was not my intent. Education was my intent and I guess as usual what I had in my head doesn't translate so well when I type it.
So I apologize if you feel that I wronged you. I know you just want to help but what you offered could be potentially dangerous without more information available. That's all I am saying. Be careful with the "more pressure" advice at least until you know what is going on with a person. Ask for more information if none is given. What if the only apnea the person had was 2 centrals over 8 hours?

And all this over the poster you responded to...hasn't been back here in over a year...
and never posted about any apneas because she had a brick so we don't know if she had any apneas that needed more pressure or not or whether she was maybe having a bunch of centrals or what. There's a reason I ask for AHI and event category breakdown before offering pressure advice that might include increases.

[ChicagoGranny]

My aerophagia got better. I followed some online advice for it which was to raise pressure.

From what you have said in some following posts, I don't think your aerophagia was reduced because you raised the machine pressure. Instead, raising the machine pressure reduced the unacceptable number of apneas you were having. Once you were not longer experiencing apneas, there was no struggling to breathe and consequently no swallowing of air.

[nicholasjh1]

My aerophagia got better. I followed some online advice for it which was to raise pressure.

From what you have said in some following posts, I don't think your aerophagia was reduced because you raised the machine pressure. Instead, raising the machine pressure reduced the unacceptable number of apneas you were having. Once you were not longer experiencing apneas, there was no struggling to breathe and consequently no swallowing of air.

... Sounds like we're saying the same thing....

[ChicagoGranny]

... Sounds like we're saying the same thing....

I don't think so. You were saying raise the pressure to prevent aerophagia.

I say you raise the pressure to prevent apneas. A side effect of reduced apneas is sometimes a significant reduction in swallowing of air.

[nicholasjh1]

... Sounds like we're saying the same thing....

I don't think so. You were saying raise the pressure to prevent aerophagia.

I say you raise the pressure to prevent apneas. A side effect of reduced apneas is sometimes a significant reduction in swallowing of air.

Which prevents aerophagia.. If you go back to my post it's exactly what I described... raising the pressure causes less apneas which ends up reducing aerophagia... I just didn't say swallowing... It's still cause and effect. I said "at a high enough pressure the airway just remains open. You are more likely to get aerophagia if your airway collapses because the air tries to find someplace else to go." Finding someplace else to go may include swallowing... It could also just happen from a weak sphincter and apneas... a weakish (but not super weak) sphincter could also let less air in with less apneas wherein the lower amount of apnea's are caused by higher pressure. So not only did I cover what you're saying I thought much more deeply about the subject... so why are you arguing about it?