Heated tube? Devilbiss? Worth it?

[Georgie]

Hello, I’m starting a new thread as I don’t think anyone would read to the end of the last one (newbie ready to throw in towel) and I would really like a couple of answers.
1. How important is a heated tube? In my house it drops to about 40 - 45 for about two weeks in winter. Can you lag a tube with cloth/foil assuming you have heated humidifier? Does having the machine lower than bed help with water droplets?
2. I’m asking above as have eye on Devilbiss Sleep Cube Auto Adjust Plus which does not have said tube. Does anyone have opinions about this machine, please?
I’m looking at this machine as, after my insurer coughs up, the amount I would be out of pocket would be an acceptable risk.
And I say risk as I am still having a really hard time on my second one-month trial (well, maybe a smidgeon less hard) and I want to be able to walk away from it all if need be without losing a lot of cash. But I would like to keep struggling with my own machine if there is a chance of improving my quality of life. It was bearable pre-cpap, but now apres-cpap it has dwindled to crap levels.

So, sitting on fence but still grasping towel.

Ps will arrange to send data if thought beneficial.

[Pugsy]

Condensation in the hose or mask won't hurt you but it sure is annoying and will disrupt your sleep.

We went for years without a heated hose integrated into the machine though...there are ways to reduce condensation without using a heated hose.

See this thread for various options..posts number 2 and 3
viewtopic/t94035/Pugsys-Pointers-3Deali ... -road.html

Having the machine lower doesn't stop the condensation from happening but it can let a person use gravity to help drain the water down into the water chamber. Sometimes it drains easily but I have found that most of the time it doesn't drain well enough or fast enough to prevent the noise and/or cold shower and waking a person up.

I keep my house fairly cool in the winter but nothing like yours..around 55 F maybe and I have to use a heated hose or I get so much condensation that no one gets any sleep. A little bit of water can create a whole lot of noise.
If you use any humidity at all you are very likely going to have significant condensation. Now you can try a hose cozy and using gravity to help out and it might be enough.
But there is one little thing that has nothing to do with water when it comes to cold bedroom air. Air that is really cool going to your nose or face can be really uncomfortable.

What kind of insurance do you have? What is your co pay? The reason I ask is most insurance companies pay by HCPCS billing code and not brand or retail pricing. That machine you mentioned isn't a full data machine. It only offers hours of use. If you run into problems there's nothing available to help you figure out what might be going on. I wouldn't recommend it.

Any copay that you have to pay is going to be based on the amount allowed by your insurance company and they allow the same for any brand cpap/apap machine that uses the E0601 billing code.
You should be able to get a full data machine with a heated hose for the same amount of money as the cheaper DeVilbiss you are looking at.

You might want to read this.
https://maskarrayed.wordpress.com/what- ... me-part-i/

Insurance companies pay the same where the machine is the most basic brick with none of the extra stuff or the top of the line APAP machine.. Might as well get the top of the line because your co pay will be the same when using insurance.

[Georgie]

Thank you Pugsy.
Unfortunately the info about insurance doesn’t apply as I am in Australia. Here my insurer will pay three quarters of the cost (up to A$900). Machines are expensive here. The Resmed AirSense 10 which I am trialling now is upward of A$2000 and a good mask is over A$300. Of course you can get cheaper prices for shopping around. I will take into account what you said about the Devilbiss.

[Sleeping Ugly]

I bought a heated hose and I love it. The heated air is very comforting and also has a therapeutic effect for me. It helps keep my nasal passages clear. For me, it was worth the money to get one. I also bought a "hose cozy" for it, which is a long, felt (I think?) tube that the hose slips in. It helps retain the heat better and it is soft on the skin.

[Pugsy]

Ahh...didn't know you were down under.

In that case...consider your out of pocket expenses with your insurance and the retail pricing in your area with the prices you would pay for a machine from here
http://www.secondwindcpap.com/

There are a lot of forum members here who live in Australia or New Zealand who have bought from secondwind because the prices are so much better even with the conversion rate.
Shipping is approx $80 US to Australia...or that's what I have paid when I have shipped a machine to Australia.
No taxes or duties because it is medical equipment.

The DeVilbiss machine you are looking at...I know it is cheap but it's cheap for a reason and while I am sure it blows air just fine...it doesn't have any data available and that can mean a make it or break it in terms of success with this therapy.
You wouldn't even have any way of knowing if leaks were big and maybe impacting therapy.
These cheap machines have a place...for back up or travel but not as a primary machine for a newbie to cpap therapy.

At Secondwind...look at the ResMed S9 AutoSet or Elite...They are the prior models of the AirSense 10 you are trying.

Be sure to look for ELITE or AUTOSET....those are the full data models. If money is tight the Elite is usually a bit less expensive..
It's a fixed pressure machine but not the end of the world to have no auto adjusting capability...the DeVilbiss you were looking at also is a fixed pressure only machine despite the word "auto" in the model name. It doesn't refer to apap auto mode..it's auto something else like auto adjusting for elevation or whatever. Not auto adjusting pressure as in apap mode machines.
If you can get the AutoSet for about the same price as your out of pocket in the Aussie system...get it.

[chunkyfrog]

My DevillBiss Intellipap Autoadjust does have data available--
some online after one enters the code seen on the screen in the morning,
And more if you use the data module (sold separately) with sd slot and their software.
Maybe OP has a different model . . .
The Sleepcube moniker is unfamiliar--maybe Oz terminology?

[Tovi]

My understanding is even with a heated humidifier, without a heated tube, you're getting cool air. Some people don't mind, but I personally couldn't sleep that way. It's not the difference between the room temperature and you. It's the difference between the air and your body temperature. In nonCPAP breathing, your body has a chance to warm up the air a bit before it goes into your lungs, but not so with a CPAP.

[chunkyfrog]

No, not so, but the air is still not close to body temperature.
That would be like sticking your head in a sauna. Not my choice!
I notice that my nose does not get painfully cold with my heated hose;
but in winter, with a regular hose, my poor nose suffers.

[SnoringInOregon]

Condensation in the hose or mask won't hurt you but it sure is annoying and will disrupt your sleep.

I'm not too sure of "won't hurt you".

I have an Airfit P10 mask. It has very fine mesh vent holes. One night I turned up my humidity and had rainout in the hose and in the mask. The water nearly blocked the vent holes. This is a very comfortable mask, but it's a very bad mask design in terms of how condensation can so easily block the vent holes.

My leak rate (Dreamstation, so it's a total) went from about 28 L/min during a typical night to a low of under 6 L/min. The lowest leak rate lasted for about 30 mins. My flow rate went crazy high to compensate. Eventually the leak rate recovered, as the condensed water presumably was slowly expelled thru the mask mesh.

I survived (obviously), but had a morning headache, which is very unusual for me.

I'd hate to see too many more of those nights in my SleepyHead data. Needless to say, I turned down the humidity the next night.