Trilogy AVAPS vs ASV - Move the Debate Here

[chunkyfrog]

No, unfortunately, they do not.
He is the troll most likely to break the forum.
If they do not ban him, he will attack everyone but his own aliases.
Whatever. I will miss you guys.

[Lucyhere]

Naw... nothing is going to happen to the forum.

If people STOP responding to him he will eventually be talking to himself. There is no point in explaining the same things over and over. He wants to believe what he wants to believe and on top of that, he is a hater.

a proud Libtard!

[Goofproof]

finally added asv boy to the foe list. are there like no mods on this site?

If you would read posts here on this site you would know how things are done here, try it. You don't qualify as a newbe after a year and over 200 posts. Jim

[robysue]

No, unfortunately, they do not.
He is the troll most likely to break the forum.
If they do not ban him, he will attack everyone but his own aliases.
Whatever. I will miss you guys.

The forum has weathered Calist, sickwithapnea, and others. xxyzx is less disruptive than sickwithapnea (in my opinion), and while he's a vicious as Calist, he's not a coherent. Calist, who was banned for being caught in a lie about his claimed employment as a sleep tech, was far more dangerous simply because he was claiming to be a sleep tech and his writing wasn't as incoherent as sickwithapnea nor as amateurish as xxyzx.

At this point I do plead guilty to responding too often to xxyzx, but I do try to make sure that my responses are designed to correct misleading information that xxyzx repeatedly posts. I do my best to NOT resort to calling him names while correcting his misinformation.

[robysue]

read the resmed description
read the philips
ASV is a fully functional non invasive ventilator

I HAVE read the Resmed and philips descriptions AND posted links to that information.

ASV is one mode of non-invasive ventilation. AVAPS is a totally different mode of of non-invasive ventilation. The two modes of non-invasive ventilation are appropriate for very different respiratory problems. And, as others have pointed out, ASV is totally inappropriate for patients with severe COPD.

The Trilogy can run in either mode, plus other modes non-invasive ventilation, plus it can also be set up as an invasive vent.

An AutoSV machine, on the other hand, can only be used in ASV mode. It cannot be set up in AVAPS mode.

[Okie bipap]

At this point I do plead guilty to responding too often to xxyzx, but I do try to make sure that my responses are designed to correct misleading information that xxyzx repeatedly posts. I do my best to NOT resort to calling him names while correcting his misinformation.

I really won't matter. Anyone who disagrees with what he says is a "libtard" at best, or a "libtard bully". Some people cannot accept the fact that something they say may not be correct. Unfortunately, as some people seek advanced degrees, they learn more and more about less and less. Bachelor degrees offer a more general education. Master programs are more specialized, usually concentrating on one or two subjects. PHD programs are highly concentrated on one subject, and many people lose site of other things when they focus on the one area of study.

[chunkyfrog]

It is not our job to analyze his disorder, but we could avoid speaking to him directly.
That is difficult, as his misinformation can cause harm if not corrected.
I am afraid that "agreeing to disagree" may leave some vulnerable to his "genius".

[Madalot]

It is not our job to analyze his disorder, but we could avoid speaking to him directly.
That is difficult, as his misinformation can cause harm if not corrected.
I am afraid that "agreeing to disagree" may leave some vulnerable to his "genius".

Agreed. He posts an awful lot and some of it "sounds" legitimate (and may be - I don't follow him that closely). But there's enough inaccuracies to be concerned, that's for sure.

And I know he's wrong about the Trilogy in AVAPS. And based on the information, DOCUMENTED INFORMATION, posted by respected sources here, he should acknowledge it. And he can't/won't. But as you said, we can't analyze his disorder. He's definitely, as my hubby would say "half a bubble off."

[poppi2]

...At this point I do plead guilty to responding too often to xxyzx, but I do try to make sure that my responses are designed to correct misleading information that xxyzx repeatedly posts. I do my best to NOT resort to calling him names while correcting his misinformation.

You (and Pugsy) spend a lot of time and effort documenting his errors and misinformation. My worry is that you and others like Pugsy will say "enough is enough" and quit the forum. I would understand, but hate to see it. Earl

[robysue]

At this point I do plead guilty to responding too often to xxyzx, but I do try to make sure that my responses are designed to correct misleading information that xxyzx repeatedly posts. I do my best to NOT resort to calling him names while correcting his misinformation.

I really won't matter. Anyone who disagrees with what he says is a "libtard" at best, or a "libtard bully". Some people cannot accept the fact that something they say may not be correct.

When I respond to one of xxyzx's posts that has actual, factual errors in it, my goal is not to persuade xxyzx to change his incorrect opinions. Rather I try to write in a civil fashion that addresses the errors rather than who made them, and I'm writing for future visitors and newbies who run across one of the threads he hijacks so that they're not mislead into thinking what he's saying is correct.

Unfortunately, as some people seek advanced degrees, they learn more and more about less and less. Bachelor degrees offer a more general education. Master programs are more specialized, usually concentrating on one or two subjects. PHD programs are highly concentrated on one subject, and many people lose site of other things when they focus on the one area of study.

As someone who has earned a PhD in mathematics, I know first hand how easy it is to lose site of anything but your own narrow specialty.

[chunkyfrog]

Some of the smartest people I know have "offbeat" spelling; as different parts of the brain handle different tasks.
Some people with autism have amazing intellect, but no people skills at all.

[robysue]

...At this point I do plead guilty to responding too often to xxyzx, but I do try to make sure that my responses are designed to correct misleading information that xxyzx repeatedly posts. I do my best to NOT resort to calling him names while correcting his misinformation.

You (and Pugsy) spend a lot of time and effort documenting his errors and misinformation. My worry is that you and others like Pugsy will say "enough is enough" and quit the forum. I would understand, but hate to see it. Earl

There are indeed times when I and Pugsy decide we have to have a break. But so far, we always come back eventually.

I can't speak for Pugsy. But I can say that I have learned to take breaks, even months long breaks from this forum when I just can't deal with stuff like trying to correct xxyzx's misleading posts anymore. Or when too many of the helping threads devolve into name calling rather than persistent correction of a troll's misleading statements.

[Madalot]

I am very grateful to posters like Robysue & Pugsy (among many others) for taking the time to correct the information, while trying very hard to ignore the behavior of the person posting it.

In this specific situation, the inaccurate information could do a lot of harm to someone who doesn't know. If someone were to take the information to heart (ie that the Trilogy in AVAPS is the same as an ASV) they might refuse the Trilogy due to its high cost (and trust me, it costs) and demand an ASV that could cause them serious physical harm.

Yes, I'm grateful to those that fight to keep the information here as accurate as possible. And it's tough when dealing with people that believe they are smarter than everyone else and refuse to acknowledge facts in front of them or admit when they are wrong. Very tough indeed.

[raisedfist]

Am curious since it was discussed - how exactly can the Respironics Trilogy be set up like an ASV? I don't use the Trilogy anymore (bought a lightly used S9 ST-A with iVAPS from secondwind) so I can't just look through the menu at the clinical menu at the moment.

I know that with AVAPS-AE mode we have the Auto-EPAP range that we can set, and of course the pressure support min and max, but what specific mode allows it to behave like an ASV - to measure your actual ventilation rate (not a target or ideal rate) and then work to prevent over/under shoot of minute ventilation?

[Madalot]

Am curious since it was discussed - how exactly can the Respironics Trilogy be set up like an ASV? I don't use the Trilogy anymore (bought a lightly used S9 ST-A with iVAPS from secondwind) so I can't just look through the menu at the clinical menu at the moment.

I know that with AVAPS-AE mode we have the Auto-EPAP range that we can set, and of course the pressure support min and max, but what specific mode allows it to behave like an ASV - to measure your actual ventilation rate (not a target or ideal rate) and then work to prevent over/under shoot of minute ventilation?

There is no specific mode for ASV. I checked last week. There may be ways to use other modes to mimic ASV, but I admit I don't have the knowledge base to figure it out.

Also, AVAPS is an added feature, not a mode in itself. I use S/T mode with AVAPS enabled. But the fact that there are specific machines for AVAPS is proof in and of itself that ASV and AVAPS are NOT the same thing.