O.T. (Sort of): Food for Thought

[Slartybartfast]

A number of folks on this board have come forward from time to time to say that they have lost weight, and that has (or has not) affected their OSA. A surprising number of them sang the praises of low carb dieting as the means to their success. Two months ago I gave it a whirl and am 30 pounds lighter without really even trying. So I began reading everything I could on the subject. Lots of videos on youtube, too, if you search on "low carb."

Anyway, this morning I happened to see this article in the Los Angeles Times, so i thought I'd pass it along.

http://articles.latimes.com/2010/dec/20 ... s-20101220

[Vader]

A number of folks on this board have come forward from time to time to say that they have lost weight, and that has (or has not) affected their OSA. A surprising number of them sang the praises of low carb dieting as the means to their success. Two months ago I gave it a whirl and am 30 pounds lighter without really even trying. So I began reading everything I could on the subject. Lots of videos on youtube, too, if you search on "low carb."

IDK

I was a vegan for a little over twenty years. No meat. That means NO chicken! also no eggs, no fish.
I was eating LOTS of carbohydrates.

Since switching to a wide range of foods(which I believe we were designed to do) that includes meats, grains, veggies, fish, dairy, etc., I have gained 30 lbs , over the years.
I'm not refuting the new claims, I'm just saying I've known a lot of vegetarians & vegans, who naturally consume lots of carbs, and not one that I know is overweight. Go figure....

[archangle]

I'm not refuting the new claims, I'm just saying I've known a lot of vegetarians & vegans, who naturally consume lots of carbs, and not one that I know is overweight. Go figure....

You have a point, Vader. I wonder if it's just that if you're determined enough to stay vegan, you're determined enough to eat right. Are most of the vegans eating leaves, sprouts, and twigs? Lots of fiber stuff. Remember, fiber doesn't count as a "carb" even though they are carbohydrates.

How many vegans live on mashed potatoes with margarine, white rice, vegan corn chips, cookies, and fries? How does their weight work out?

[Vader]

You have a point, Vader. I wonder if it's just that if you're determined enough to stay vegan, you're determined enough to eat right.

The ones I knew, like myself, did eat right.

most of the vegans eating leaves, sprouts, and twigs?

LOL I don't think so....

many vegans live on mashed potatoes with margarine, white rice, vegan corn chips, cookies, and fries? How does their weight work out?

I have no idea. I can only go by what I did, and some others I knew. We ate sensibly (that is if you can call vegan/vegetarianism "sensible") However,I do think growing numbers of people, regardless of diet lifestyle, DON'T eat sensibly.

[Mike6977]

How many vegans live on mashed potatoes with margarine, white rice, vegan corn chips, cookies, and fries? How does their weight work out?

Poorly.

You can stuff your face on a "vegetarian" diet of twinkies, potato chips, etc., sit around watching reruns of Oprah and Judge Judy . . . and you'll get fat fast.

To stay thin, the key is to exercise and eat as many unprocessed, uncooked foods as possible. Green vegetables, fruits, nuts.

Some whole grains are OK, depends on the person, just like lactose intolerance.

And once in while, I indulge in a little sashimi.

________________________________________________________________

For exercise, the best thing you can do is find a sport that you love.

Tennis, racquetball, volleyball, swimming, dancing at Studio 54 with Grace Jones, or just walking in the forest or on the beach with a friend.

Something social, something you'd look forward to doing, even if it had no health benefits at all.

__________________________________________________________________________

Here's a puzzle:

Eskimos can live well off an absurdly high-fat diet of whale meat and blubber. How is that possible?

When a group of Western researchers tried that diet, they devolved scurvy.

Trying to figure what went wrong, the researchers came up with the answer: the whale meat they'd been eating was frozen, then thawed out.

That was enough to destroy the vitamin C, which only lasts a little while in fresh whale meat.

When the researchers switched to fresh whale meat, they did fine.

Eating raw, unprocessed and fresh is key.

[Alshain]

The problem is not carbs, it's the processed carbs. White flour is made because bugs don't like it making it easy to store. There is a reason bugs don't like it though, it has no nutritional value at all! They bake away 2/3's of the piece of grain leaving only the endosperm, the most worthless part, while discarding the germ and bran and then they have to add back nutrients or "enrich" it because the law says it's too unhealthy. But these nutrients added aren't as effective as the real deal.

What makes matters worse? The FDA does not restrict the term "Wheat". Technically, white flour is made from wheat. So if you color it Carmel and call it wheat, that's not illegal. You have to read the ingredients, if you see "Enriched" anywhere at all, that means it was so unhealthy they had to legally add back nutrients. Don't bother. (Note that the name "Whole Wheat" is restricted, meaning the whole wheat grain was used instead of just the endosperm, but you can use that term and not be 100% whole wheat).

Wheat germ and wheat bran contain high amounts of fiber which allows the body to digest easier (it keeps you regular!) and even though your eating the endosperm too, the bran and germ negate that effect by escorting it quickly through the bowels instead of having it stored for later use.

You want to lose weight?

1. Avoid Enriched Flours, they should make up no more than 10% of your flour intake. (Subway, although healthier than McDonalds, has nothing but Enriched flour bread)
2. Eliminate High Fructose Corn Syrup. Reduce cane sugar. Treat yourself, it doesn't have to be awful, but make it very occasional, not every day or every meal.
3. Don't fall into the "Diet" food trap, things marked "Diet" are not good.
(By the way, those last two mean you have to eliminate Soda... period).
4. EXERCISE! CARDIO CARDIO CARDIO!
5. Optionally increase Protein intake. Protein builds muscle, muscle burns fat, which brings us to...
6. Optionally consider a weight lifting or resistance training regimen.
7. Count your calories. There are plenty of tools to help you do this.

I've researched this to death, and these simple rules will cause you to lose weight. I'm living proof of that. However the honest truth is that dieting will help with 15-20% of your weight loss, exercise does the real work. You must get off the couch and do something.

[Resister]

Yep--I'm low carb all the way and have lost 20 pounds over the last 10 weeks. Of course I cheat on Sundays......oh boy, do I cheat.......

[ozij]

Thank you, Slarty.

Very good food for thought - and those reading this thread can add me too to the list of people who tried low carb and found themselves losing weight without trying.

I tried low carb because Gary Taubes' "Good Calories Bad Calories", a thorough review of research of the subject, had me convince of how bad carbs were for my health. For me, weight loss when I switched to low carb was a co-incidence. I am maintaining low carb eating and intend to eat like this for the rest of my life.

[jabman]

IO to lost weight on low carb eating, 42 lbs since last year. but for me it is not a diet but a life change because I was dxed with diabetes.

[Slartybartfast]

I agree that it's the processed foods that are the worst. I've since restricted my hunting and gathering to the perimeter of the store, except for a few items. When I first started doing that, I was shocked at the huge amount of floor/shelf space devoted to processed foods. The wife is kvetching about the monotony of the low carb thing. I keep telling her there are LOTS of essentially starch-free veggies out there that take care of that. A diet of meat and cheese is boring and soured lots of folks off the Atkins diet years ago. But drizzle melted cheese over a handful of broccoli and and chopped bell peppers and suddenly dinner becomes interesting. Chop up a barbecued chicken breast and toss it into a bowl with a bunch of green leafy stuff and drizzle on blue cheese dressing (not the "low fat" type, ether) and you've got lunch. I'm loving it!

Agreed, the weight loss wasn't the goal, feeling better with more energy, no carb-crash just before lunch. In fact, now that i mention that, I remember as a kid in elementary school how I watched the clock, stomach rumbling, hands sweaty, feeling light-headed, weak-kneed, waiting for lunch. The high sugar/starch breakfast cereal Mom gave me lasted only a couple of hours, then I was feeling the effects of what I now know was hypoglycemia. Felt horrible until I ate a sandwich with either peanut butter or ham/cheese, something with some fat and protein in it. Then felt fine the rest of the day.

[archangle]

The problem is not carbs, it's the processed carbs.

Hogwash.

Whole wheat flour is only a little less fattening than white flour. Subtract out whatever percent of whole wheat is fiber and that number of "carbs" is just as bad as an equivalent number of carbs from white wheat in terms of blood sugar and the fattening effects. The fiber may have other good effects, but the fattening potential is the same. 40 grams of sugar from fresh squeezed orange juice is just as fattening as 40 grams of high fructose corn syrup from a soda.

The fattening problem with processed foods is the high number of carbs, not whether they're natural or processed. And the other tricks they use to get you to eat a lot of it. "Can I supersize that with an extra jumbo fry and megadrink for only 50 cents more?"

How do you traditionally fatten up a cow for slaughter? You feed it all natural, whole kernel, unprocessed corn. Works like a charm.

[Otter]

Whole wheat flour is only a little less fattening than white flour.

True.

Subtract out whatever percent of whole wheat is fiber and that number of "carbs" is just as bad as an equivalent number of carbs from white wheat in terms of blood sugar and the fattening effects. The fiber may have other good effects, but the fattening potential is the same.

Actually there is a difference. For at least some people, the white bread will trigger a larger insulin spike. One of the "other good effects" of the fiber is to slow the absorption of the starches in the bread, and that in turn slows the production of insulin in those of whose genes haven't caught up with agriculture yet. Yes, both kinds of bread have about same amount of carbohydrate and calories, and they both add the same amount of energy to your system, some of which will be stored as fat. But the more insulin you have, the faster that energy reaches your cells. This means that a little more of it will be stored as fat. That's probably trivial unless you get up from the table and go work out or do some heavy labor. But those huge insulin spikes will eventually cause insulin resistance. Insulin resistance will give you a wicked sweet tooth, because your cells won't be able to take in sugar unless you spike your insulin again. And eating just to spike your insulin will make you fat. Also, insulin resistance makes portion control and other sensible dietary changes very difficult, because at the cellular level, you'll actually be starving until you get your insulin up high enough to let the sugar out of your blood and into your cells.

Of course whole wheat bread will do the same thing. It's little better than white bread, but anyone having problems with insulin resistance (soda and doughnuts are irresistible) or type two diabetes should probably avoid grain in general.

Juice and soda will both spike insulin much more than any kind of bread. When Coca-Cola first hit the market, it was sold in six ounce bottles. This made sense to people, because they were used to drinking other sweet drinks, like fruit juice, in small amounts. Then Pepsi started selling bottles that held twice as much, and I suspect that's when the current epidemic of obesity began. More sugar water leads to more insulin resistance which leads to a very strong desire for more sugar water. Try to stop, and some of your cells will starve, even if you're eating well, until your body figures out how to make do with less insulin. Soda is addictive, withdrawal is a bitch with rabies, and hardcore users tend to become increasingly spherical.

[Otter]

The problem is not carbs, it's the processed carbs. White flour is made because bugs don't like it making it easy to store. There is a reason bugs don't like it though, it has no nutritional value at all! They bake away 2/3's of the piece of grain leaving only the endosperm, the most worthless part, while discarding the germ and bran and then they have to add back nutrients or "enrich" it because the law says it's too unhealthy. But these nutrients added aren't as effective as the real deal.

Yes. Less processed foods generally have more vitamins and minerals, and they're usually easier to absorb too. Hence, you don't need to eat as much of them to satisfy your non-caloric needs. If everything eat has a shelf life of 50 years, you're going to have to eat a lot of it to get all your RDAs.

5. Optionally increase Protein intake. Protein builds muscle, muscle burns fat, ...

Eating protein also stimulates the production of glucagon, which has the opposite effect of insulin.

[Otter]

Eskimos can live well off an absurdly high-fat diet of whale meat and blubber. How is that possible?

When a group of Western researchers tried that diet, they devolved scurvy.

Trying to figure what went wrong, the researchers came up with the answer: the whale meat they'd been eating was frozen, then thawed out.

That was enough to destroy the vitamin C, which only lasts a little while in fresh whale meat.

When the researchers switched to fresh whale meat, they did fine.

Eating raw, unprocessed and fresh is key.

Yeah, but every time I go whale hunting, these yahoos flying the jolly roger throw butyric acid at me.

[Mike6977 as Guest]

Yeah, but every time I go whale hunting, these yahoos flying the jolly roger throw butyric acid at me.

Only if you're Japanese and in whaling fleet.

Put on an Eskimo suit, slide into a kayak, and you'll be fine.