Not sure what to do

rested gal · Post by **rested gal** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 11:00 am

LINKS to discussions about the Aussie heated hose - to prevent rainout

NyNurse33 · Post by **NyNurse33** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 12:19 pm

See that's what I don't get...how come you got rainout with a room temp of 78? I got it with a room temp of 70 too. How will the aussie heated hose help, the room isn't cold. Unless the heated hose also helps with room humidity as well, provided that is my problem.

bairdbeth · Post by **bairdbeth** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 1:16 pm

I think that the condensation came from the fact that my exhaled breath is still warmer than the incoming air. It also maybe that when I exhale, my breath is very moist? When it hits the incoming air pressure and my mask, which is colder, condensation forms. It was not in my hose, just in the mask( until last night, buti t was cold here and no heat or Aussie on). The Aussie sends warmer air through the tube which also warms up my mask. Thus when I exhale, the temp is even. (I am a newbie, but I think this is plausible?) I will for sure be plugging in my Aussie tonight!

Snoredog · Post by **Snoredog** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 2:32 pm

my suggestion:

1. Unplug the power cord on the back of the machine.
2. Place your left hand on top of the humidifier below the knob, lift up on the front of the machine on the right side, about 1/2" from the bottom you will see where the machine seperates from the humidifier base, extert a little pressure, the front of the machine will pop up. (caution: Do NOT ask your DME to perform this task, it is way over their head).
3. Get out the little square bracket that came with your machine, insert the bracket on the back of the machine where the hole is, it should snap right in place.
4. Connect the hose to the back of the machine.
5. Set the humidifier base aside, put the machine back down, plug the power cord into the back of the machine, (secure with duct tape so it doesn't vibrate out).

Use it that way tonight and report back your findings.

If you still get rainout you have other problems with your home's environment and should call a HVAC person to have it checked out. If the air is cold on your nares get the aussie heated hose.

oldgearhead · Post by **oldgearhead** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 2:58 pm

I think that the condensation came from the fact that my exhaled breath is still warmer than the incoming air.

I have also reached this conclusion. Its your 37C expelled air coming
in contact with the 23C mask surface. I do believe a heated hose is
the only answer.

With my Hybrid on (large surface area) , and humidifier in passover mode, I need the "Aussie' on to stop it.
However, because that is not the case with my CL2, mabe your M needs to be checked out.

ThunderSnorem · Post by **ThunderSnorem** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 7:49 pm

Anonymous wrote:The only conclusion/explanation that I can come up with is the M humidifier actually works as designed (I am not trying to blast resmend products, I use their masks) while the resmed did not heat as well in the 1 to 3 positions (I think I read here recently that someone else noticed that as well). So, it may be that the M humidifier actually functions properly while the resmed did not.

I run my S8 HH at about 5.5, with 6 being the max. At that rate it almost empties the humidifier during a nights sleep, but I do not get rainout. I can sense the humidity, tho. Resmed needs to be turned up pretty high to pump out the humidity. My guess is that if NYNurse was running her original S8 HH at 2 or 3, she was getting little humidity.

Resmed's humidifers just need to run higher than others. Don't go by the numbers, go by your comfort and the humidity you actually receive.

NyNurse33 · Post by **NyNurse33** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 7:58 am

Well I had a pretty good night, I had barely a trace of condensation in the tubing that is with the swift. I kept the hose in bed with me underneath my covers and with my "bed buddy" (store bought rice pack). I pre-heated the hose with the bed buddy too. I kept the hose secured to my PJ's with a little hair clip and scrunchie. I left the humidity on "1". I did have some air leaking out of the other side of the swift nasal piece, but I fixed it this morning. The swift is just a little uncomfortable in my left nare (the side the tubing goes too). I have been using ayr saline nasal gel and am aware of the other lubricant options, but I just don't think this discomfort will vanish. The was why I never gave the swift a chance to begin with, but did now, b/c it does give me less rain out. I now have to figure out how I can do the same thing last night, with my CL2. The problem may be with how the hose connects to the mask (on top of the head), when I kept the hose above me on a hook on the wall, it didn't matter, but now I've got to get it to go down the side of my face to my PJ's and then under the covers. Snoredog-Good idea, but I know I won't do well with out humidification, I know I just need to keep the hose warm, with my body heat for now, and an aussie soon. I also think the design of the CL2 allows for water to puddle in the nasal pillow piece. I would be fine if I was sleeping on my back, but the minute I turned to my side, it would all empty in my nose. Hopefully doing what I did last night, will prevent that much water from puddling in the mask. I do believe warmer breath has alot to play into it as well. Thanks guys for your help...again!!

Bellcrest · Post by **Bellcrest** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 8:56 am

NyNurse33
I use CL2 with my humidifier set at 5. No problem with rainout at all. Of course I do have my very favourite item........the aussie heated hose.

I need lots of humidity or my nose bleeds. I can not do with out the aussie heated hose. In fact, bought one for my son in law because he was complaining about my daughter opening the bedroom window and causing him to have rainout. Now he loves me too. .

I don't know how anyone who like to keep their bedroom on the cool side can live with out the aussie heated hose. It is a godsend for me.

TurboHonda · Post by **TurboHonda** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 11:53 am

I've followed the discussion on rainout and have experienced it myself. The bottom line can be summarized as follows:

1. Condensation is not a matter of one particular temperature but of a difference between two.

2. Condensation is the opposite of evaporation.

It's been my experience that the less water that is evaporated, the less condensation will appear. When I had excessive mouth leaks, the water consumption went up, hence more condensation.

We want condensation to occur. That's the purpose of the humidifier. By evaporating water, which is added to the pressured air we are breathing, needed moisture is delivered to our nasal passages.

The trick is to capture the condensation in the body, rather than in the mask or hose.

Condensation in the hose is from air that hasn't reached us yet. Warm air and cool hose. Heated or insulated hoses will help.

Condensation in the mask is partly from exhaled moist warm air against a cool mask. Our face and breath will help warm a mask or nasal pillow, if it's not too large.

rested gal · Post by **rested gal** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 11:57 am

Perfect explanation, imho, TurboHonda. Thank you.

krousseau · Post by **krousseau** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 2:07 pm

Anyone know what the role of the humidity in the environmental air has to play in this. I'm assuming if the humidity in the air is 90% it isn't going to pick up as much water in the cpap humidifier (at any given temp) and at a lower humidity it would pick up more water. So do you always end up with say 95% humidity in the air you finally breathe in-whether you start at 70% or 85% humidity-Or does the cpap humidifier just add (say 10%) to the starting humidity of the air?

I've had my humidifier turned up to max because of a cold with bronchitis the last week. The humidifier has been delivering about 400 ml of water to my respiratory tract and it is amazing how much that has helped. A couple nights I had been coughing all evening-I prewarmed the water before filling the tank so it would give out max humidity right from the start. I'd cough a couple times then be fine all night. Rainout was not a problem with the indoor temp at 55 F-tubing in a regular sleeve and under the covers. I have no idea what our humidity is but it is still fairly dry.

TurboHonda · Post by **TurboHonda** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 5:56 pm

[quote="krousseau"]Anyone know what the role of the humidity in the environmental air has to play in this. I'm assuming if the humidity in the air is 90% it isn't going to pick up as much water in the cpap humidifier (at any given temp) and at a lower humidity it would pick up more water. So do you always end up with say 95% humidity in the air you finally breathe in-whether you start at 70% or 85% humidity-Or does the cpap humidifier just add (say 10%) to the starting humidity of the air?

I've had my humidifier turned up to max because of a cold with bronchitis the last week. The humidifier has been delivering about 400 ml of water to my respiratory tract and it is amazing how much that has helped. A couple nights I had been coughing all evening-I prewarmed the water before filling the tank so it would give out max humidity right from the start. I'd cough a couple times then be fine all night. Rainout was not a problem with the indoor temp at 55 F-tubing in a regular sleeve and under the covers. I have no idea what our humidity is but it is still fairly dry.

Goofproof · Post by **Goofproof** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 6:02 pm

[quote="Snoredog"]my suggestion:

1. Unplug the power cord on the back of the machine.
2. Place your left hand on top of the humidifier below the knob, lift up on the front of the machine on the right side, about 1/2" from the bottom you will see where the machine seperates from the humidifier base, extert a little pressure, the front of the machine will pop up. (caution: Do NOT ask your DME to perform this task, it is way over their head).
3. Get out the little square bracket that came with your machine, insert the bracket on the back of the machine where the hole is, it should snap right in place.
4. Connect the hose to the back of the machine.
5. Set the humidifier base aside, put the machine back down, plug the power cord into the back of the machine, (secure with duct tape so it doesn't vibrate out).

Use it that way tonight and report back your findings.

If you still get rainout you have other problems with your home's environment and should call a HVAC person to have it checked out. If the air is cold on your nares get the aussie heated hose.

NyNurse33 · Post by **NyNurse33** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 7:01 pm

I knew I should of went to school to be a meterologist instead.

Goofproof · Post by **Goofproof** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 9:08 pm

NyNurse33 wrote:I knew I should of went to school to be a meterologist instead.

If you do go into that and get a job at it, be sure they give you a office with a window. I don't think the meterologists in Indiana have any windows. Jim

Not sure what to do

CL2 and rainout

Rainout = Condensation