Mask Sits on Bottom Lip

[Meridianzzzzz]

Ok, so I originally had my mask sliding around from sweat and oil. I now have some liners and my skin is not so irritated and the mask is definitely not moving so much in general. Is is still sliding from just under my lower lip to on my lower lip where amazingly it stays sealed. I think my lip balm is creating some bizarre suction action! LOL

I'm wondering if maybe the mask is too small? If I place it where the nose portion is higher and not pressing on the outside of my nasal passages, then the mask springs two big leaks on either side of chin during the night, because I end up moving it around to avoid tiny leaks up near my eyes.

If I place the nose area lower, where it does press on my nasal passages but prevents the tiny eye area leaks, then I get the sliding up to my lower lip thing. What about a strap to keep the mask pulled down?

Do you think I should try a different mask? I have about 20 days left to swap out and try different ones with my DME company. I'm using the Quatrro FX for her in size small. What would you recommend as a next step? I am a side and back sleeper and I cannot tolerate the pads etc that sit on the forehead, it makes me feel too hemmed in. I'm not claustrophobic but the forehead straps makes me feel like that. I am managing 6-7 hours with the mask on and my AHI at 1 or 2, but I tend to get leaks and frustration around 5am and tear everything off for those last few hours of sleep. The problem is this is prime time for my apnea, especially during REM. My brain was pretty much constantly awake from 4-7 during my study. Soooo, any input is appreciated.

Thanks!

Meridian

[old dude]

I use the Quattro Air which is similar in size and shape to the FX. These masks run small, period. I would hazard a guess that your mask is too small for sure. I have a large face, and a size large barely works for me. I need an XL which of course they don't make.

So here's what I would suggest:

1. Get a Quattro Air. Yes, it has the forehead piece but the mask is so light and minimal you don't know it's there. It's like wearing no mask at all. Get it large enough to be sure it fits.

2. Lose the lip balm. You need nothing on your face that's the least bit greasy.

3. Try losing the liners. Unless you're very allergic to the silicone seal, they are superfluous with this mask anyway.

4. Wash your mask seal every morning without fail with warm water and Johnson's Baby Shampoo. You must do this.

5. Also, you must wash your face every night just before bed with soap and warm water to make sure all traces of facial oils are gone.

I'd be shocked if these measures don't solve your leak problems. I tried every FFM on the market that I'm aware of and nothing helped until I developed this protocol. Now, I have zero leaks and zero pressure sore,

Good luck!

[Meridianzzzzz]

Thank you!

I did try a larger mask when they first fit me but it was a different brand and it leaked horribly which is why I think they went with the small on this one. But I'll see about swapping out for the mask you suggested in a larger size. I'm gonna trust you on that forehead piece.

I do wash my face every night, and I don't apply anything to my skin. I meticulous about face washing so this issue is already addressed. As for the lip balm, I think I'm so dependent on it because I am a mouth breather, and before CPAP my lips would get sooooo dry. I guess I just feel like with all this air going over my lips they will get so dried out. But I'll give it a shot.

I agree that the liners might be unnecessary if the mask fit better to begin with, so maybe switching out will solve this. But I do find they soak up the oils my skin just produces naturally overnight. I have naturally very oily skin, so even with the careful night time washing routine, I just produce lots of oil on my face while sleeping.

I do wash the mask liner everyday with a gel facial cleanser for sensitive skin.

Thank you for your help. I'm hoping this will solve my issue. I'd really like to get through a full night with the CPAP.

[old dude]

FWIW, my facial skin is extremely oily as well, but I find that the combination of washing my seal every morning and washing my face just before bedtime is enough to get me through the night. My seal is oily when I wake up but it holds. Be aware that the seal on the Quattro Air is either made of a different type of silicone or it is finished differently. It almost has a frosted appearance as opposed to clear. Somehow this seems to help. As an added bonus, removing and replacing the seal on the Q. Air is the most simple procedure imaginable, as is hooking the straps on. Just size it to your face, make loops in the end of your straps and leave them like you've just set them and slide the loop over the posts to secure them.

And don't forget, the Air runs at least one size smaller than indicated.

[chunkyfrog]

I use unscented baby wipes on mask and face; repeating as needed if I wake up slippery.
You don't have to give up lip lube, just use Lansinoh instead.
Petrolatum is said to be bad for silicone.

[Meridianzzzzz]

Chunkyfrog- Yes, I have some petro chemical free lip balm that I use. I try to reduce as many synthetic chemicals on my skin as possible.

Old Dude- I think perhaps the different finish on the Q. Air mask may be almost a very fine etching, based on what you have described. This would make sense for providing a more stable seal. Kind of like when you glue to pieces of wood together, they sometimes tell you to sand the surfaces first. It gives more grip. So this might work nicely for me, and I'll remember about the sizing. I'm going in tomorrow to swap out and I'll let you all know how things turn out.

Thanks for the help as always!

[sleepy711]

Hi, I'm an RT and a sleep Technician.

Four popular full face masks are the ResMed Quattro, ResMed Quattro FX, ResMed Quattro Air and Respironics Amara in two different kinds of cushions. The Amara pinches on the nasal bridge creating a good seal but can sometimes be rough on the bridge of your nose. It also runs wide around the mouth and has in the past been prone to cheek leaks.

If you have a jagged or sharp nose (Romanesque), the Quattro FX is a good one. The key is to rock it on starting at the bridge and lowering it down over your mouth to create the seal on the bridge of your nose. It must set nicely in the groove just below your lower lip for the proper seal all around without needing to be super tight.

The Quattro has been the standard go-to mask, sturdy with good results for so many years; it has been tough for anyone to compete. Size is everything. The mask should sit between your eyes and in the groove just below you lip.

You are very much like Goldilocks; it cannot be too big or too small. It has to be just right. Each mask fits the proportions of different faces very differently. It may just be a matter of finding the right mask. Make a list of the above masks and go down the list with mask / size and a journal of what is working, what isn't working and why.

This part is redundant but I just want to make sure your version of cleaning is the same. You have to wash the cushion daily in soapy water to get the oil off and the liners don't work so well (as far as keeping a good seal). Also, soak the cushion once a week in vinegar water (25% vinegar and 75% water) for 20 minutes to break down any accumulated facial oil. Replace the cushion every 3 months. If you are still having problems with being oily, you need to wash your face in an astringent before bedtime to clear off any oil. I have heard of some people using alcohol wipes to cut through facial oil on their mask but this should only be done in addition to the regular cleaning schedule.

Check out iTunes for "My Little CPAP Book". It has a lot of answers to CPAP questions written by someone who has been in the field for years. It will be available in about 2-3 days on Nook and Kindle.

[nanwilson]

Hi, I'm an RT and a sleep Technician.

Four popular full face masks are the ResMed Quattro, ResMed Quattro FX, ResMed Quattro Air and Respironics Amara in two different kinds of cushions. The Amara pinches on the nasal bridge creating a good seal but can sometimes be rough on the bridge of your nose. It also runs wide around the mouth and has in the past been prone to cheek leaks.

If you have a jagged or sharp nose (Romanesque), the Quattro FX is a good one. The key is to rock it on starting at the bridge and lowering it down over your mouth to create the seal on the bridge of your nose. It must set nicely in the groove just below your lower lip for the proper seal all around without needing to be super tight.

The Quattro has been the standard go-to mask, sturdy with good results for so many years; it has been tough for anyone to compete. Size is everything. The mask should sit between your eyes and in the groove just below you lip.

You are very much like Goldilocks; it cannot be too big or too small. It has to be just right. Each mask fits the proportions of different faces very differently. It may just be a matter of finding the right mask. Make a list of the above masks and go down the list with mask / size and a journal of what is working, what isn't working and why.

This part is redundant but I just want to make sure your version of cleaning is the same. You have to wash the cushion daily in soapy water to get the oil off and the liners don't work so well (as far as keeping a good seal). Also, soak the cushion once a week in vinegar water (25% vinegar and 75% water) for 20 minutes to break down any accumulated facial oil. Replace the cushion every 3 months. If you are still having problems with being oily, you need to wash your face in an astringent before bedtime to clear off any oil. I have heard of some people using alcohol wipes to cut through facial oil on their mask but this should only be done in addition to the regular cleaning schedule.

Check out iTunes for "My Little CPAP Book". It has a lot of answers to CPAP questions written by someone who has been in the field for years. It will be available in about 2-3 days on Nook and Kindle.

WRONG!
Alcohol wipes will degrade the silicone of the cushion in no time and should not be used anywhere near your equipment. Your advise is wrong, you as a person who works for a DME wants to have the cushion replaced more frequently... that way you make more money off of us patients. You are too busy promoting your book to give out good advice to HELP patients. NEVER use alcohol on your mask to clean it.

[Meridianzzzzz]

Well, since I have an advanced degree that includes coursework in chemistry, physics and physiology, I'm pretty certain I can handle cleaning my mask and that I can handle most issues that arise. So, no worries @nanwilson, I wasn't going to break out the alcohol and scrub everything down. But thank you for interjecting. I appreciate it. Despite my advanced degree I know when it's smart to ask people who have already traveled the road what tips they have. So that's my goal here on the board.

One issue, if I use astringent on my face it will be a horrible mess. Plus astringent is mostly alcohol and I feel will degrade my mask liner more quickly from contact with my face after I've just wiped it down. Not only will I break out like crazy, I will be more oily during the night. Swiping alcohol on my face makes it produce more oil. I'm telling you, the oil my skin produces during the night has nothing to do with me not cleaning my face well enough before bed. I just have oily skin and I get very hot at night. I am a crazy fanatic about my skincare, and just skipping my night time creams in favor of a properly functioning CPAP mask has been so unnerving. But I have avoided putting any lotions etc on my face.

I do appreciate the information on the different masks and how they fit. This is very helpful and I will keep a journal as suggested. Thanks to everyone for their input. I won't assign any ill motives to anyone regarding their input. I'm off to the DME place now, so we shall see what they say!

[Pinhead]

I have used the FX and loved the first one and had no luck with the second one. I had the regular small and it fit just like yours. The second one came with a mask fit device and per that I needed a meduim.

So yes I think yours maybe to small, but if you exchange I would try the Air which is my current mask before you make up your mind. For me it has worked the best do follow the cleaning rules outlined above.

Good luck with search for a mask.

[chunkyfrog]

In addition to the masks suggested already, some full face masks cup the chin; as opposed to fitting above the chin.
The following have below-chin design:
https://www.cpap.com/productpage/fisher ... -mask.html
https://www.cpap.com/productpage/fisher ... -mask.html
https://www.cpap.com/productpage/hans-r ... -mask.html
https://www.cpap.com/productpage/RespCa ... -Mask.html

[Meridianzzzzz]

Thank you! I'm going in tomorrow to try some different masks on. I'll take a list with me! I appreciate your input.

M.

[Meridianzzzzz]

Ok, I'm trying out the Quattro Air Full Face in a medium. Crossing my fingers for a good night. Last night was monumentally unsuccessful with the previous mask, Quattro FX for her size small.

[LSAT]

Hi, I'm an RT and a sleep Technician.


Check out iTunes for "My Little CPAP Book". It has a lot of answers to CPAP questions written by someone who has been in the field for years. It will be available in about 2-3 days on Nook and Kindle.

It seems like our new "RT" has a lot of answers, but reading previous post...many are incorrect. I'm glad I'm not one of her clients.

[Meridianzzzzz]

First night with the Quattro Air in size medium and I slept all night with the mask on and with a good seal. The texture on the portion that sits on my skin helps so much, love it. SO excited!!!