Canadians Being Truthful About Socialistic Medical Care

[John from Brookston]

the upcoming year is likely to be a bad one for the American democratic party. The current obamacare fiasco down here is leaving most Americans very jaded about obama and the democratic party in general. Like Americans were not already jaded enough. LOL

The predictions down here are that the democrats will lose their control of the U.S. Senate in next Fall's 2014 midterm elections. After that, with obama's continuing loss of popularity in the polls and his lackluster performance on the U.S. economy, there is talk down here of impeaching obama post 2014. After the GOP has taken back control of the Senate...the GOP already controls the other part of our legislature...the House of Representatives.

obama will likely end up being the second American President faced with imminent impeachment in 2015 or early 2016. Second only to Nixon.

If obama gets impeached, get ready for some big and truly radical changes down here in the USA. Expect a country that will return to being more like it used to be. Socialism and communism will be dirty words down here, labor unions will get wiped out again like happened under Reagan in the eighties. obamacare will likely get scrapped and revamped.

Its all about the economy down here, if Americans are not doing well money wise we take it out on our politicians at voting time. Lackluster economy=change of parties in the USA at election time. The thing is, many Americans are FED UP with both of the major parties these days and where that will lead to...socialist types might not like where thats going to lead here in the USA.

Eric

I wanna bookmark this so when it fails to come to pass I can come back and ask you if you'd like tabasco sauce before you eat your words.

"Expect a country that will return to being more like it used to be"

Oh, you mean the "Gilded Age" of Vanderbilt and Jim Crow, before them coloreds got "uppity", right?
Maybe instead of "Atlas Farted" you should have built your life around "The Lord of The Rings".

[Julie]

[SuddenlyWornOut45]

I detect someone who sees the world strictly thru a racial perspective. Which is not how I perceive politics. Race was not a factor in my making that claim.

It has been all over Google news and other American news lately about how obama is ending this year with "record low approval ratings." If the GOP gets the Senate next Fall and the economy does not improve and the problems with obamacare are not ironed out very soon, obama WILL be facing impeachment post January 2014.

Eric

"obama will likely end up being the second American President faced with imminent impeachment in 2015 or early 2016. Second only to Nixon.

If obama gets impeached..."

In your wildest wet dreams, jocko.
"Presiding While Black" is not a "High Crime or Misdemeanor".

And better add Andrew Johnson and Bill Clinton to that list and strike Trickee Dickee, who bailed before Articles could be brought against him..

[SuddenlyWornOut45]

If the GOP takes the Senate back in 2014 and both parts of the Senate are then GOP controlled, serious dirt to amount to a high crime(s) WILL be found on obama. No doubt.

Eric

[ems]

"Presiding While Black" is not a "High Crime or Misdemeanor".

That was excellent!

[RogerSC]

If the GOP takes the Senate back in 2014 and both parts of the Senate are then GOP controlled, serious dirt to amount to a high crime(s) WILL be found on obama. No doubt.

Eric

Yeah no doubt about that. They'll be fabricating it as fast as they can. That's all that they want to do, anyways, no reason to move forward and work on real problems when they can spend all their time persecuting the president.

I assume that you didn't mean "both parts of the Senate", but the "Senate and the House"?

[mgaggie]

No government interference? Move to South Sudan

[zoocrewphoto]

To piggy back on Ontario Cpap, Alberta does not fund cpap therapy or tests at all, but my employee benefits picked up 80% of the tab for everything. Each province handles it differently, as healthcare in Canada is provincial rather than federal (same for education).

Can some of you clarify how your system works?

It sounds like many people have employer based insurance in addition to the national system. What does that cover that the national system does not? In other words, why do you need it? And do most people have it?

I am really confused as some people talk about everything being covered, some have it covered by insurance, and some are paying out of pocket.

I know many people want to go to a single payer system here, but as I understand it, that would mean no more employer based insurance (and no raise in wages to make up for lost insurance) and additional taxes. So, to me, it sounds like it would be much more expensive for somebody like me.

I just barely escaped losing my insurance (after 6 months of contract negotiations and a strike vote). I had checked the state website for insurance plans and decided it would be cheaper in the long run to pay out of pocket for prescriptions and cpap supplies and take the penalty. The monthly premiums were just too high for me, even with the subsidy, and the deductible was more than I usually spend in a year.

I like the *idea* of what I hear about your system. But I don't see how we can get to a system like that without years of transition that would hurt lower income workers like me. I hear people talk about the middle class, but not so much about people working at the low end of the scale, but not receiving benefits. Gas prices, food prices, etc hurt us more when we are already living paycheck to paycheck and our wages are not keeping up with the increase in costs. I typically get a 25 cent per hour wage each year. This year, I did not get a raise. The largest annual wage I got was 50 cents. I'm not saying this to whine, just giving a real example of why some people find it hard to consider higher premiums and/or higher taxes to fund these programs.

[mgaggie]

http://www.aph.gov.au/About_Parliament/ ... e/medicare

This is the history of Australia's Medicare system if you are interested zoocrew.

I believe our system is excellent for essential medical care, with things that are not considered life threatening or greatly impacting your health (eg weight loss surgery, hip replacement) there is a waiting period in the public health system.

[SleepyBobR]

Zoocrewphoto, each province is slightly different but all comply with the requirements of the federal Health Act. People have additional insurance to cover things not covered by the government plans such as an upgrade to a private ward in the hospital. Sleep studies are covered by the plan but the equipment is only covered up to a maximum (or not at all in some provinces) so additional insurance picks up the remainder. The government plans do not cover drugs or dental so people have additional insurance for those things. Additional plans are often offered by employers as a benefit to their employees. Many people have no additional coverage.

[Julie]

I have no private insurance and haven't had any since retiring, but pay nothing for medical care except for glasses, dental, and if I needed an ambulance would pay something depending on where I live(d), etc, but prescriptions are fully covered except for a tiny processing fee.

[SleepyBobR]

Julie are you in Ontario? Ontario covers drugs for seniors but I don't know if any others do.

[robysue]

For BC (British Columbia) medical: "Effective January 1, 2014, monthly rates are $69.25 for one person, $125.50 for a family of two and $138.50 for a family of three or more." Not cheap.
You can apply for premium assistance if you need it and then you pay a percentage (according to your income) down to zero.

That is just under half of my share of my health insurance that is heavily subsidized by my US employer. The true premium for my employer provided health insurance is close to $1000/month for a family plan (two or more people); I pay about $300/month and my employer picks up the other $700/month.

One of the dirty (big) secrets of how Americans pay for their health insurance and their health care is just how much health insurance premiums cost employers for providing quality coverage to their middle and upper class employees. Or perhaps I should say, the "secret" is really how little middle and upper class Americans with employee provided health insurance know about the true cost of their premiums since the employer pays most of the premium. Folks only become aware of just how expensive the full premium is if/when they land in a situation where they need COBRA to extend their coverage after terminating their relationship with the employer. Under COBRA, the former employee can (temporarily) keep their insurance, but they've got to pay 100% of the premiums.

But of course, everyone knows that the cost of union members' health insurance is a huge part of why American manufacturing cannot compete. Health insurance costs are constantly part of the right's union bashing and have been for 40+ years. So in essence, many Americans believe they are entitled to quality health insurance at a (very) low OOP cost through their employer, but simultaneously believe that other Americans should learn to live with reduced insurance coverage and much higher OOP premiums for the sake of their employer's bottom line OR they believe that the working class and the working poor shouldn't be entitled to any employer-based insurance plan at all---if the employer simply says, "I can't afford the premiums."

Most Americans have little or no historical knowledge of how (and why) our crazy "expect your employer to provide health insurance if you're upper or middle class" way of providing health care evolved over time. And in spite of all the cries from the Far Right about "I want the freedom to choose my insurance, my doctors, my hospitals, etc..," the fact of the matter is that most employers provide no choice when it comes to health insurance: You go with the company plan if there is one or you go without insurance. And if the company plan has (subsidized) premiums that you can afford, you're a fool to not go with the company plan---regardless of whether its good, bad, or indifferent.

And for choice of docs, hospitals, DMEs, etc??? Well, if your employer provided health insurance is a very traditional plan, then you may indeed have the choice to go wherever you want with a minimum amount of paperwork. But many traditional plans, and all PPOs and all HMOs will distinguish between in-network and out-of-network care. And the cost of out-of-network care is usually prohibitively expensive. So de facto you're limited to choosing between the places that are in-network.

[BlackSpinner]

Julie are you in Ontario? Ontario covers drugs for seniors but I don't know if any others do.

Alberta covers drugs for seniors. Quebec has an insurance for drug coverage everyone has to buy, about $800 per year unless you are on welfare/disability and maybe a senior.

Private insurance gets you a private room, private testing, drug coverage where it isn't covered, and services like massage, chiro, dental, private nursing.

[NateS]

For BC (British Columbia) medical: "Effective January 1, 2014, monthly rates are $69.25 for one person, $125.50 for a family of two and $138.50 for a family of three or more." Not cheap.
You can apply for premium assistance if you need it and then you pay a percentage (according to your income) down to zero.

That is just under half of my share of my health insurance that is heavily subsidized by my US employer. The true premium for my employer provided health insurance is close to $1000/month for a family plan (two or more people); I pay about $300/month and my employer picks up the other $700/month.

One of the dirty (big) secrets of how Americans pay for their health insurance and their health care is just how much health insurance premiums cost employers for providing quality coverage to their middle and upper class employees. Or perhaps I should say, the "secret" is really how little middle and upper class Americans with employee provided health insurance know about the true cost of their premiums since the employer pays most of the premium. Folks only become aware of just how expensive the full premium is if/when they land in a situation where they need COBRA to extend their coverage after terminating their relationship with the employer. Under COBRA, the former employee can (temporarily) keep their insurance, but they've got to pay 100% of the premiums.

But of course, everyone knows that the cost of union members' health insurance is a huge part of why American manufacturing cannot compete. Health insurance costs are constantly part of the right's union bashing and have been for 40+ years. So in essence, many Americans believe they are entitled to quality health insurance at a (very) low OOP cost through their employer, but simultaneously believe that other Americans should learn to live with reduced insurance coverage and much higher OOP premiums for the sake of their employer's bottom line OR they believe that the working class and the working poor shouldn't be entitled to any employer-based insurance plan at all---if the employer simply says, "I can't afford the premiums."

Most Americans have little or no historical knowledge of how (and why) our crazy "expect your employer to provide health insurance if you're upper or middle class" way of providing health care evolved over time. And in spite of all the cries from the Far Right about "I want the freedom to choose my insurance, my doctors, my hospitals, etc..," the fact of the matter is that most employers provide no choice when it comes to health insurance: You go with the company plan if there is one or you go without insurance. And if the company plan has (subsidized) premiums that you can afford, you're a fool to not go with the company plan---regardless of whether its good, bad, or indifferent.

And for choice of docs, hospitals, DMEs, etc??? Well, if your employer provided health insurance is a very traditional plan, then you may indeed have the choice to go wherever you want with a minimum amount of paperwork. But many traditional plans, and all PPOs and all HMOs will distinguish between in-network and out-of-network care. And the cost of out-of-network care is usually prohibitively expensive. So de facto you're limited to choosing between the places that are in-network.

Excellent analysis of the goofy, broken system we have been living with in the US!

Regards, Nate