Doctors Lying

[ChicagoGranny]

Breaking News Alert
The New York Times
Monday, August 6, 2012 -- 6:38 PM EDT
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Hospital Chain Internal Reports Found Dubious Cardiac Work

HCA, the largest for-profit hospital chain in the country, is confronting evidence of unnecessary cardiac treatments at some of its medical centers in Florida after a nurse’s complaint prompted an internal investigation.

The inquiry found that the complaint was far from the only evidence that unnecessary — even dangerous — procedures were taking place at some HCA hospitals, driving up costs and increasing profits.

HCA, the largest for-profit hospital chain in the United States with 163 facilities, had uncovered evidence as far back as 2002 and as recently as late 2010 showing that some cardiologists at several of its hospitals in Florida were unable to justify many of the procedures they were performing. Those hospitals included the Cedars Medical Center in Miami, which the company no longer owns, and the Regional Medical Center Bayonet Point. In some cases, the doctors made misleading statements in medical records that made it appear the procedures were necessary, according to internal reports.

Read More:
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/07/busin ... tml?emc=na

[idamtnboy]

HCA, the largest for-profit hospital chain in the country, is confronting evidence of unnecessary cardiac treatments at some of its medical centers in Florida after a nurse’s complaint prompted an internal investigation.

An unregulated, unfettered, free market will bring Americans the best health care possible, right? Gov't involvement guarantees waste and inefficiency, right? Give me a break!

[ChicagoGranny]

HCA, the largest for-profit hospital chain in the country, is confronting evidence of unnecessary cardiac treatments at some of its medical centers in Florida after a nurse’s complaint prompted an internal investigation.

An unregulated, unfettered, free market will bring Americans the best health care possible, right? Gov't involvement guarantees waste and inefficiency, right? Give me a break!

Totally out of context as hospitals and surgeons are already a very highly regulated market and all the doctors and nurses are licensed by government regulated boards.

Can I be sure that your answer to this is to create another layer of government bureaucracy to review every procedure?

I can see you on the gurney waiting for the bureaucrat who just ran out the door at 5:00. Good luck.

[Paulrp]

This points out a serious lack of ethics in todays society. It is not just doctors, there are local car dealers that will install the wrong light bulb in cars so that they burn out quickly -
They then charge about 25.00 to replace them - a tidy profit even if they can't find your original bulb to put back in. There are CEO that cost their company billions, but take the bonuses and implement the "golden parachute". It is all about the ethics or lack thereof.

[BlackSpinner]

You think that is bad? How about this

http://www.northwestern.edu/newscenter/ ... ering.html

The off-label intervention does not prevent CAH; it aims only at sex normalization.

The pregnant women targeted are at risk for having a child born with the condition congenital adrenal hyperplasia (CAH), an endocrinological condition that can result in female fetuses being born with intersex or more male-typical genitals and brains. Women genetically identified as being at risk are given dexamethasone, a synthetic steroid, off-label starting as early as week five of the first trimester to try to “normalize” the development of those fetuses, which are female and CAH-affected.

Mothers offered the intervention have been told it “has been found safe for mother and child” but in fact there has never been any such scientific evidence.

A just-out report from Sweden in the Journal of Clinical Endocrinology and Metabolism documents a nearly 20 percent “serious adverse event” rate among the children exposed in utero.

[Lizistired]

Blackspinner, That is beyond disturbing. I can't imagine any woman who would allow that! Well, but then there is the chik-fil-a crowd.

•Clinician proponents of the intervention have been interested in whether the intervention can reduce rates of tomboyism, lesbianism and bisexuality, characteristics they have termed “behavioral masculinization.”

[VVV]

This points out a serious lack of ethics in todays society. It is not just doctors, there are local car dealers that will install the wrong light bulb in cars so that they burn out quickly -
They then chard about 25.00 to replace them - a tidy profit even if they can't find your original bulb to put back in. There are CEO that cost their company billions, but take the bonuses and implement the "golden parachute". It is all about the ethics or lack thereof.

Right here is the problem:

Less than 20% of Americans regularly attend church—half of what the pollsters report.

If you go to church regularly, listen to the sermon and get involved in some Bible study, you will make better decisions and we will all be better off.

This is not a regulation issue. As you have pointed out it is lack of ethics.

[VVV]

Blackspinner, That is beyond disturbing. I can't imagine any woman who would allow that! Well, but then there is the chik-fil-a crowd.

I agree with this sentiment. Chick-fil-A is scratched off my list. A sea change is required before they get back on.

[Bons]

Right here is the problem:

Less than 20% of Americans regularly attend church—half of what the pollsters report.

If you go to church regularly, listen to the sermon and get involved in some Bible study, you will make better decisions and we will all be better off.

This is not a regulation issue. As you have pointed out it is lack of ethics.

Oh the stories I could tell about church members! At the last church I served I got into huge ethical arguments because the church council president used to bring his girlfriend to church events - his WIFE was Catholic and did not attend.

[chunkyfrog]

No chik fil-a here.
Surprises me, though.
This state has a reputation for unbridled intolerance.

[GumbyCT]

I agree with this sentiment. Chick-fil-A is scratched off my list. A sea change is required before they get back on.

No chik fil-a here.
Surprises me, though.
This state has a reputation for unbridled intolerance.

Correct me if I have misunderstood something but isn't Chik Fil A attempting to uphold the church going principles?

Edit: Oh and are you the same people who were surprised to here about docs lying?

[idamtnboy]

An unregulated, unfettered, free market will bring Americans the best health care possible, right? Gov't involvement guarantees waste and inefficiency, right? Give me a break!

Totally out of context as hospitals and surgeons are already a very highly regulated market and all the doctors and nurses are licensed by government regulated boards.

Yes they are. And if this kind of mistreatment of patients can occur inside a regulated system what do you think doctors and administrators could get by with if the system was unregulated like the free marketers and Repubs are screaming for? It would make the above look like childish candy stealing.

[MaxDarkside]

I can only conclude that we humans are a pretty screwed up species and some of us are not to be trusted. I'd rather trust a frog

Free markets are nice for pricing, the value for the money. Competition sends costs down and the public may punish/bankrupt the offender by shunning them.
Regulations are scribblings on paper. Like a speed limit sign, it does nothing to stop speeders or like a "Gun Free Zone" sign at movie theaters.
Regulations with teeth require eyes, ears and teeth. Someone has to be watching ($) and have authority to take swift action to deliver significant consequences.
Some regulators are powerless, can only cry out (think Fannie and Freddie, regulated, but regulators had no powers to enforce)
Some regulations are industry self policed, but then their "internal affairs" can be corrupted too and have a vested interest.
Some highly regulated companies can't succeed. US Postal Service is one example, regulations/laws prevent it.
Some highly regulated companies get caught by the government and walk, unpunished. Wacovia Bank laundered huge sums of drug money and no one got arrested or get a "huge fine", to you and me, but to them it's just a write-off.
Regulations too often only deal with consequences after the fact.

So, I think you need regulations with significant consequences at the right places and times because you cannot be watching everywhere always, and regulators that can dole out harsh consequences swiftly and justly, before harm, not after.

It's almost an intractable problem. Harder than keeping my AHI down and sleep quality up, that's for sure.

[49er]

Right here is the problem:

Less than 20% of Americans regularly attend church—half of what the pollsters report.



If you go to church regularly, listen to the sermon and get involved in some Bible study, you will make better decisions and we will all be better off.

This is not a regulation issue. As you have pointed out it is lack of ethics.

Hmm, the leaders in the Catholic Church who were involved in the sexual abuse scandals didn't get the word.

PLEASE - Whether someone attends church or not has nothing to do with their ethics. I have a non religious family member who operated a law firm for many years and refused to do anything that even might hint of questionable ethics. This person is completely non religious.

49er

[pats]

If you go to church regularly, listen to the sermon and get involved in some Bible study, you will make better decisions and we will all be better off.

I don't think you really intend to be offensive, but try applying the golden rule. How would you feel if someone claimed that anyone who goes to church cannot possibly have any principles?