Swift LT pillow system leak data

[Abbi-Normal]

Conversion about leaks per minute instead of however they are calculated.

I always turn the machine off before I take the mask off, whether I am getting up in the night for something or getting up in the morning. I 'thought' these were pretty good numbers but guess that is what I get for doing my own 'thinking'

So what the heck do I do besides duct tape the whole darn thing to my face and wrap an ace bandage around my head?

[RiverDave]

I don't have a Resmed. I have a Tank APAP and run EP 1.4 (yeah I know obsolete but it works and I can even move the database between computers with no hassles).

I know the LED pressure information may include both a 95 %ile and the average. However, I was under the understanding, perhaps a mistake on my part, that the leak number was an "average" not the 95 %ile value.

Jules,

Using my version of the software (ResScan 3.2), the number I see on the LCD screen is the same as what is reported in the software as the 95% number. I assume the the S8 I and S8 II show the same data. Also, resmed software reports the median amd maximum values. When looking at daily data.

Hmmm...I just noticed something that may warrant a separate topic, but I have to do some math before I can be sure.

[feeling_better]

Conversion about leaks per minute instead of however they are calculated.

I always turn the machine off before I take the mask off, whether I am getting up in the night for something or getting up in the morning. I 'thought' these were pretty good numbers but guess that is what I get for doing my own 'thinking'

So what the heck do I do besides duct tape the whole darn thing to my face and wrap an ace bandage around my head?

There are two units for reporting leaks, liters per minute (LPM) or liters per second (LPS). Most mask manufacturers provide in the manual a table or graph of the intended (normal) leak in LPM for various pressures. If you have the leak in LPS, then you get LPM by multiplying LPS by 60.

What mask are you using and what pressure? Somebody here would be able to tell you what normal or accepted LPM (as reported by the machine) for your particular mask/pressure, if you do not have the documentation for your mask.

[PaulyWally]

Which conversion are you referring to?

A leak rate greater than about 0.3 is pretty high. But that number can be misleading. Is the machine only on when you are hooked up to it? If yes, then you have a bad leak problem. If no, the number is suspect because while you were unhooked from the machine and it was running, it was recording massive leaks. The number you see is the leak rate you were at or below for 95% of the time the machine was on.

I use SmartStart on my S8 Elite II and although it continues to run for a short while after I remove my mask my leak rate is still 0.00 l/s. Assuming you've been "connected" for the minimum 3.5 hours you could presumably continue to run your machine for more than 10 minutes flat out (i.e. "disconnected") without affecting the leak rate reported for the period you are connected.

[RiverDave]

Abbi

3 steps to compare leak from resmed to leaks reported by respironics users.

First though, remember that resmed machines report leak as the total amount of air actually moving through the machine minus the total amount of air that was supposed to move through the machine. Resipronics machines report leak as the total amount of air actually moving through the machine only.

Resmeds have a table stored internally that holds the values for the amount of air that is supposed to go through your mask at your pressure. That is why it is important to have the right mask selected on your machine.

Step 1. Convert leak in liters/second (l/s) to liters per minute (l/m). This is done by multiplying the l/s number by 60.
Step 2. Find out the leak rate for your mask at a given pressure (this can be found in your documentation for your mask. If you cant find it, I have compiled a list and there is one posted by DSM). This is already in l/m so you don't have to do anything to it.
Step 3. add your leak rate reported by your machine (step 1) to the intentional leak rate for your machine (from step 2).

You can then sort of compare the resmed leak to the respironics leak. It's not a perfect correspondence because resmeds use the 95% and repironics uses the 90% values

Using your example, your typical leak is 0.4 l/s.

Step 1: Multiply that by 60 and you get 24.0 l/m.

Step 2: I dont know what your 95% pressure number is so lets pretend it's 10. Looking at a table for the Swift LT, the amount of air that is supposed to go through it is about 33 l/m.

Step 3: your total amount of air moving through the mask is 24+33 = 57 l/m

What does this mean? Who knows. It's a gut feeling. I like my leaks to be under 0.1, others are OK with 0.2, 0.3, 0.4. General rule is the lower, the better.

Clear as mud?

[RiverDave]

I use SmartStart on my S8 Elite II and although it continues to run for a short while after I remove my mask my leak rate is still 0.00 l/s. Assuming you've been "connected" for the minimum 3.5 hours you could presumably continue to run your machine for more than 10 minutes flat out (i.e. "disconnected") without affecting the leak rate reported for the period you are connected.

Paul,

When you turn a resmed off, it will continue to run at a much slower speed (barely detectable) for about 30 - 45 minutes to dry out the hose and mask. It doesn't count this time in the statistics (pretty sure about that).

You are correct. about the 10 minute thing. If you have the software, it will be recoded as the maximum leak.

[RiverDave]

Jules,

You are correct in that resmeds will report an "average" when you look at multi-day data. It actually reports the median of the multi-day period's 95% leaks and 95% pressure. I don't know about the AHI because the data set I picked had the same median and average. I sure wouldn't mind getting confirmation of this from someone else, though.


Edit: it appears to report the median AHI for the multiday period.

Sorry, my inner nerd is coming out.

[Abbi-Normal]

Yes, that is all clear as mud or maybe I am just stoopid

I am using the Swift LT right now and my pressure is set at 12, but I just researched numerous posts and found out how to change it, and its now at 10.

Fraunk thought my pressure was way too high because if he wakes up in the night he can hear the hissing and can't believe how much air I'm snorting up my nose. His pressure is set at 8 and he snored like a fog-horn and had apnea so bad that when he snorted to take in a breath, after being clinically dead (just a dose of drama here), it would wake me and the dogs

I sure appreciate the information you have provided. This site has kept me inspired to keep trying and trying and trying to make this therapy work. So, THANKS

[RiverDave]

Why did you change your pressure? Before you go doing that, you need to get a few nights of data when your leak rate is more appropriate. If you are leaking as badly as you are, the AHI data means nothing. True, reducing the pressure makes the leaks easier to control, but it may not be enough to keep you apnea-free. Pressure needs are different for different individuals. It's all about how much air it takes to keep your throat from collapsing, which is controlled by many things.

If I were you, I'd put the pressure back to 12 and work on controlling the leaks - you may be mouth breathing. Once you get a few nights of solid data (low leak rate), see what your AHI is and then adjust pressure if warranted.

PS you're not stoopid, you're new.

BTW - love Young Frankenstein. Still use "could be worse, could be raining" at least once a month.

[Snoredog]

Yes, that is all clear as mud or maybe I am just stoopid

I am using the Swift LT right now and my pressure is set at 12, but I just researched numerous posts and found out how to change it, and its now at 10.

Fraunk thought my pressure was way too high because if he wakes up in the night he can hear the hissing and can't believe how much air I'm snorting up my nose. His pressure is set at 8 and he snored like a fog-horn and had apnea so bad that when he snorted to take in a breath, after being clinically dead (just a dose of drama here), it would wake me and the dogs

I sure appreciate the information you have provided. This site has kept me inspired to keep trying and trying and trying to make this therapy work. So, THANKS

there is really no correlation in pressure from one person to another. You may have opened yourself up into experiencing more apnea by lowering the pressure.

If you are having trouble finding sleep with that pressure it would have been better simply to set up a lower Ramp pressure of like 7 cm over 30 minutes and let it ramp back up to the 12 titration pressure. If you are still awake by the time that timer expires you press the Ramp button again and it goes back down for another 30 minutes. Same should you awaken during the night. Stuff some ear plugs into the ears of your partner so the hissing from the exhaust is ignored, make them bright orange so he knows who left them

Watch carefully on how you feel, if you start feeling more fatigued you may have to put it back.

[Abbi-Normal]

I don't know what else to do to control leaks! I stopped using KY in my nose-holes, I put dental floss around the pillows, I have the tube suspended, I have the machine lower than the bed, I adjusted my mask properly last night so I don't know what else to do.

I could tape my mouth but the only tape we have is duct tape and Ronnie's Market doesn't carry tape!

[RiverDave]

Some people use an ace bandage under the chin and over th top of the head. People even use polident strips, painters tape, specialty chin straps, whatever they can.

I use a full face mask instead.

[Abbi-Normal]

The machine was initially set up to ramp for 40 minutes but I changed it several months ago to 20 minutes and it was pre-set at 6. I have no problem falling asleep and am asleep within seconds, well maybe minutes!

[feeling_better]

Yes, that is all clear as mud or maybe I am just stoopid

I am using the Swift LT right now and my pressure is set at 12, but I just researched numerous posts and found out how to change it, and its now at 10. ...
I sure appreciate the information you have provided. This site has kept me inspired to keep trying and trying and trying to make this therapy work. So, THANKS

Ok now I know your mask and pressure. What is the leak you are getting, the average value shown by the machine? You might have already mentioned this previously, but most people here, would not want to go thru re-reading the whole thread to find these things. So it is a good idea to help others who are trying to help you, to give all the info together in a post.

[Abbi-Normal]

Sorry

I hate being such a pain in the a** but I really DO appreciate your help.

Leak rates are between .2 and 1.1 with the average being .4 and .5

My lowest AHI has been 3.3 and the highest was 17.5, but it's usually around 4.6

The lowest AI was .2 and the highest was 11.7, but it's usually around 1.8

The lowest HI has been 2.7 and the highest was 9.2 and its typically oh geez, its all over the place actually. The last 9 days its been 3.6; 3.2; 4.2; 2.8; 3.5; 2.7; 9.2; 5.8, and; 4.6

I really don't understand what all that means except that I am not feeling as rested as I think I should or as much as I would like to be.

Maybe I am just ABNORMAL