CPAPtalk.com

ChicagoGranny wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 15, 2021 5:47 am

gadgetmaniah wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 15, 2021 4:19 am

So I've dug out some information about the foam that they use in the machine and its health risks.

You have no qualifications to evaluate any of the information you snipped off the internet.

Or to unilaterally decide what type of polyurethane and its components are being used.

Dog Slobber wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 15, 2021 7:24 am

ChicagoGranny wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 15, 2021 5:47 am

gadgetmaniah wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 15, 2021 4:19 am

So I've dug out some information about the foam that they use in the machine and its health risks.

You have no qualifications to evaluate any of the information you snipped off the internet.

Or to unilaterally decide what type of polyurethane and its components are being used.

I neither attempted to evaluate the information that I pasted nor did I unilaterally decide that this is the type of polyurethane used in the foam. If you refer to my post I wrote that 'I guess' that this is the type of foam used; I did not claim to be sure of it. What makes it seem highly likely that this is indeed the type of polyurethane used is that Philips wrote in its statement that its foam is a polyester based polyurethane. I read that TDI is a polyurethane that is used to make foam along with polyester. So it seems to be a likely possibility that this is the specific polyurethane used. Its documented harmful effects are also what Philips warns against as well.

This was just my opinion - I wasn't trying to assert that this is definitely the case. Sorry if it came about that way though.

[quote=gadgetmaniah post_id=1386297 time=1623764504 user_id=98124)
This was just my opinion - I wasn't trying to assert that this is definitely the case. Sorry if it came about that way though.
[/quote]

Don't apologize, you'll be baiting the both of them into coming back on here with their love of protecting all things Philips. It's almost like two of them work for Respironics. Regardless of the fact Philips has openly confessed the foam used in their product is now a known carcinogen, regardless of any cause or defect, foam or O3 or whatever BS spin message they use. They are Philip's blowers, they made them, they sold them, they sourced out the material. The type of foam in question doesn't change the fact Philips knew about it a lot longer than they are letting on, made sure to buy back 2M shares of its own stock two months ago to keep from a massive sell off when the boot dropped, they enacted a recall because they knew it, but didn't want to get in front of it when they actually really knew about it, and you can be sure they spent more time buying back stock instead of engineering a game plan to have people begin inputting serial numbers into their website to confirm risk of actual units out there. Everybody with a brain knows testing has already been done and uncovered by Philips. It will just be spun to control the message and the worst of it will never see the light of day. This is cover your ass mode and people should be concerned because Philips is concerned. If it wasn't concerning, this sh!t show wouldn't be happening. And people should be pissed because of the slow walk mode they've taken with PR.

Dreaming1 wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 15, 2021 8:34 am

gadgetmaniah wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 15, 2021 7:41 am

This was just my opinion - I wasn't trying to assert that this is definitely the case. Sorry if it came about that way though.

Don't apologize, you'll be baiting the both of them into coming back on here with their love of protecting all things Philips. It's almost like two of them work for Respironics. Regardless of the fact Philips has openly confessed the foam used in their product is now a known carcinogen, regardless of any cause or defect, foam or O3 or whatever BS spin message they use. They are Philip's blowers, they made them, they sold them, they sourced out the material. The type of foam in question doesn't change the fact Philips knew about it a lot longer than they are letting on, made sure to buy back 2M shares of its own stock two months ago to keep from a massive sell off when the boot dropped, they enacted a recall because they knew it, but didn't want to get in front of it when they actually really knew about it, and you can sure they spent more time buying back stock instead of engineering a game plan to have people begin inputting serial numbers into their website to confirm risk of actual units out there. Everybody with a brain knows testing has already been done and uncovered by Philips. It will just be spun to control the message and the worst of it will never see the light of day. This is cover your ass mode and people should be concerned because Philips is concerned. If it wasn't concerning, this sh!t show wouldn't be happening. And people should be pissed because of the slow walk mode they've taken with PR.

Neither Granny nor I have defended Philips.

And I use A ResMed AirCurve 10, ResMed P10 and ResMed P30i, though I do use the Respironics DreamWear strap instead of the strap that comes with the P30i.

I routinely suggest ResMed products and don't think I have ever suggested a Philips product. In fact when this foam problem first presented itself, I specifically suggested an AirCurve over a DreamStation, because of the problem.

Dog Slobber wrote: ↑

Thu May 27, 2021 8:44 am

Currently Philips has an announcement that most of their devices has a product defect. This list includes the DreamStation BiPAP.

https://www.usa.philips.com/healthcare/ ... src-update

I'm unsure if the DreamStation 2 has a BiPAP model yet, and if it does, it's not compatible with OSCAR yet.

Get the AirCurve 10 VAuto.

I also took criticism from somebody with the same poor critical thinking skills as you.

The Oscar developers are presently working on compatibility
with the newest models released.
It is OK to buy the newest machine.

ChicagoGranny wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 15, 2021 5:49 am

Is there a single soul here who understands this basic principle of toxicology?

Sola dosis facit venenum.

what's latin for "alarmist"?

Dog Slobber wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:09 am

I also took criticism from somebody with the same poor critical thinking skills as you.

You can take your poor critical thinking skills and pound sand.

The most convenient solution is to buy a newer machine, whether it's the DS2, Trilogy Evo, etc,. That's what they want you to feel -- is pressured into doing so. Rather than the headache of figuring out how to send your unit in, and not knowing when you will get it back.

My guess is Philips has known about this issue for a long time, but was waiting for a new product cycle to come out and be an attractive, convenient solution.

Scumbag company.

Pugsy wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 15, 2021 4:52 am

At this point we think it is going to include all the System One machines as in the 50 and 60 series machines which yours would be included. At least the commonly used cpap/apap models anyway. Those basic cpap machine and the Pro models and the Auto/apap models.

Thanks, Pugsy, I suspect you are correct.

One thing I can foresee, whether one thinks this is alarming or alarmist, there is going to be a big demand for non-Respironics machines as the word gets out.

ILoveFlowers wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:58 am

One thing I can foresee, whether one thinks this is alarming or alarmist, there is going to be a big demand for non-Respironics machines as the word gets out.

Yeppers....ResMed, F & P and DeVilbiss are probably sitting back and licking their chops at what dropped in their lap.

Elle wrote: ↑

Mon Jun 14, 2021 8:59 pm

I wonder why it is just in the U.S.? Would other countries use different materials?

I'm due for a new machine this week and asked for the Dreamstation.

Looks like what we call a recall notice goes by another term internationally: From this Phillips page https://www.usa.philips.com/healthcare/ ... src-update

The recall notification (U.S. only) / field safety notice (International Markets) advises...

Hope your replacement goes smoothly!

Side thought...I know some people are thinking that maybe adding one of those inline bacterial filters is a possible solution but while it might reduce or eliminate particulates...we don't know yet exactly what all the hooplah is about and if it were that simple I would be thinking Phillips would just be telling people to do that or mailing out 400 million of those inline filters.
If it is actually a gaseous byproduct that is the problem...the inline filter won't stop the gases. It will filter particulates but do nothing for gases.

I just called my supplier, Verus. The representative reported her manager had said they had stopped selling all BiPaps due to the recall. Not selling a recalled model is obvious, and I suspect this is just temporary while they figure out what is subject to recall.

I happen to have a machine over 5 year old, so I expect I will be trying to acquire a new one, but am not sure exactly which BiLevel Auto machine to ask for. Advice would be welcomed.

I may have to change suppliers to get one at all, but that can be done.

ProfessorEd wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 15, 2021 11:20 am

I just called my supplier, Verus. The representative reported her manager had said they had stopped selling all BiPaps due to the recall. Not selling a recalled model is obvious, and I suspect this is just temporary while they figure out what is subject to recall.

I happen to have a machine over 5 year old, so I expect I will be trying to acquire a new one, but am not sure exactly which BiLevel Auto machine to ask for. Advice would be welcomed.

I may have to change suppliers to get one at all, but that can be done.

So what model ...exactly...are you now using. There are more than a half a dozen different "BiPaps" out there just from Phillips Respironics.

JLROhio wrote: ↑

Mon Jun 14, 2021 9:45 pm

Edited - Removed Prior Quotes:


ResMed machines DO have a foam piece within the air chamber that generates the airflow for your CPAP - so yes, there is also FOAM that is within the airflow of ResMed CPAP machines (at least the AirSense 10's).

Here's a pic of the foam, within the airflow generating portion of a ResMed AirSense 10 model. I grabbed this pic from a YouTube video from a guy taking apart his ResMed (for her) machine.

Here's a https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpI0AVo ... ntsReviews link to the YouTube video of the ResMed Machine tear-down (BTW, it's a great video to show you how to take apart your ResMed CPAP - it's actually a very simple product with only a few parts). The part where the foam is exposed is at 8:40 into the video.

It looks like the foam is sealed outside the air pathway. Why would ResMed want to put it inside the airway? The same could be asked about Philips. Why would they put sound-abatement foam inside the air pathway?