jnk... wrote: ↑Tue Jun 18, 2019 9:59 am
Gryphon wrote: ↑Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:43 pm
Anyone feel free to weigh in on whatever I write if I'm wrong. I'll take any constructive criticism and file it away, so I can learn from it. . . . movement of the muscles in the act of breathing . . . asleep. I’m thinking the same movements and muscles come into play, it would stand to reason that the only significant difference is we’re not deliberately controlling these muscles when we’re sleeping, just like we don’t during day to day activities when we’re not thinking about breathing rather letting the body do what it knows how to do naturally.
Only because you asked, and I wouldn't exactly call it "wrong," but respiratory-muscle behavior, particularly
for those muscles used
for breathing other than the diaphragm, does change a bit during
sleep, as I understand it.
Diaphragmatic function is largely preserved, which is essential
for the maintenance of adequate ventilation during
sleep. However, accessory muscle function is reduced, particularly during REM
sleep . . . --
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12814041
Normally I wouldn't mention it, since that side point has no real impact on the logic or overall thrust of your well-thought-out statements.
I appreciate your follow up on what I was talking about,
sleep vs awake breathing mechanics. I feel I probably oversimplified when I made it seam as though awake breathing done automatically with out thought was the same as asleep breathing.
I was trying to get the OP to stop over complicating things with the CPAP and his "Physics thought process" It seams like he's thinking that when you fall asleep suddenly everything about your breathing changes fundamentally and that a simple CPAP machine is somehow responsible
for way more then it is. I get the feeling that he still is giving the CPAP machine credit
for the volume changes that occur inside the lungs by way of the diaphragm. It's like he thinks that when you fall asleep if you have
sleep apnea the machine is doing all the work... I meant more as you said - that awake or asleep our diaphragms are what moves the air "In and Out" the CPAP just keeps the channel open so the water can flow back and forth.
As
for everything else. It's all good. I assumed whether right or wrong that asking
for an example of well-thought-out statements was maybe directed at the original OP and not me. ( I tend to ramble a lot, and my writing style isn't the best, it was never something I was any good at in school )
I was quite happy to see JNK post a follow up in defense of me and what I said.
I know we had a difference of opinion about using recording oximetry due to our own experiences... I've been on a "EVERY ONE" should use a recording oximeter at least once every 15 years or so... Campaign. Mostly because of my own experiences with horrible desats my
Apnea presented with. I also knew that a negative result didn't prove
sleep apnea wasn't present.
Sleep health is so much more complicated then a simple blood ox test.
It was helpful to find out that some Insurance companies "Who should know this too" were using false results on recording oximetry to screw their members out of any follow up
sleep treatment to save money. I should have known this... I can't say I'm surprised... but I'll remember that going forward. I still feel recording oximetry could be useful... but not if the results
for good or bad are manipulated to deny people followup treatment they deserve. I so wish we could just gather data and not have it used incorrectly to save money at the cost of people's lives... Thanks
for sharing your experiences with me. I hope there were no hard feelings, I wanted to say more before, but just didn't know how to put what I was thinking in to words.
Also I was thrilled to see "Gryphon is one sharp cookie" No worries, any possible offence, erased by the Sharp cookie comment.
As
for my skin... Meh. It's as thick as it needs to be I guess.
For me it's not the skin, it's the way you let stuff fall on you. Like water off a ducks back is how I try to live. Dealt with enough bullying and mean spirited people growing up. I generally don't take offence unless someone is trying to attack me, even then... it's all about the situation and intent. Online forums are not a place that is going to "wind me up" one way or the other,
for the most part.
I feel very safe here.
I try to be rather analytical about the way I think or explain things. I know I sometimes write way too much, when a simpler statement could have had more impact. I sometimes worry that I write so much that people skim or skip my postings, that they're too arduous to wade through. I have been working on my writing style, trying to re-read and edit better before hitting that submit button. I know I've "Ended" quite a few threads... At least in my mind. Were I posted a silly long post and then... No follow up posts and the thread is now dead. "Maybe I'm just that good? meh... prolly not"
I always try to let people know that they can comment on what I say and that I welcome feedback if I feel there is any chance I'm delving into something I'm not 100% sure about, even then I don't mind being told I'm wrong if you show me why.
It's not like this is a photography forum or some site, were we talk about inane things that are important but ultimately not so much. If I write something about photography or a technique I like to use, and it's misunderstood or someone thinks it's wrong it's not that important. Worse case, they get frustrated if they screw up and don't get the results they wanted.
But.... If I say something that's misunderstood or wrong here, it could hurt someone's health. I know I'm never going to have all the answers, there's always a chance I could be wrong and I try to take what people tell me and absorb it so that when I offer advice away from this forum were I don't have a backup team, I'm more educated and better able to give good, sound advice that is going to help and not hurt anyone. I may still slip up or forget something someone told me before... so keep the comments coming, I just like having the chance to help other people.
PS: If anyone wants to help me with my writing or grammar that's ok too.... Just be nice, please? LOL
Thanks again
for everything!
Restwell,
Gryphon
