Hi. I have been using CPAP now for 9 whole days and have managed to get used to breathing on the machine. During that period of time I have gone through every full face mask that my sleep lab has and all of them leak or need to be so tightened that they leave the bridge of my nose fiery red.
In desperation I requested an Oracle mask, feeling quite certain that this would be even worse. It was the older version without the strap and nose plugs. I found it quite comfortable actually, the only problem being, that as soon as I sarted to doze off the air would start blowing out through my nose. The other negative I noticed was that my throat and mouth got very dry despite a high level of humidity.
I would be interested in hearing from Oracle users or former users who could give me any advice here, as it seems I will either have to learn to live with the Oracle or give up on CPAP. I can't use any of the nasal systems as my nose is structurally obstructed.
What most interests me are the nose plugs that are delivered with the new version of the mask. Do they work and how comfortable are they?
Many thanks.
David
Oracle Mask Experience?
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Oracle Mask Experience?
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Hi David, before getting the nose plugs, why don't you get a nose clip for swimmers from the drug store....a lot less $ and easy to use. If it works, then you could see if the nose plugs are more comfortable.
Glad it is working for you.
Unfortunately I couldn't use it! too uncomfortable, so I am still fighting with FF masks.
Good luck.
Nan
Glad it is working for you.
Unfortunately I couldn't use it! too uncomfortable, so I am still fighting with FF masks.
Good luck.
Nan
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David,
Hi. I am an ex-Oracle user, the newer version though. I don't know if you want to hear what I have to say or not as it's not pretty. But as I always preface or trail my comments about a mask with, it's an individual thing and what works for one doesn't work for another.
That being said, the Oracle was my first mask. I got that one because a friend of mine swore it was the best mask out there; however, she only needed cpap, according to her doctor, for surgery and used it for a few days or a week. I couldn't use it for very long because of the reasons I will list for you. First let me tell you the positive side of the Oracle that I found. I liked that it just went in your mouth and didn't cover your face really, and that the straps weren't a necessary thing. That's where it ends.
Now, what problems I had with it? First of all, I wound up with TMJ on the left side of my jaw, which I never had before, I think from holding my teeth/jaw in a certain way to compensate for the Oracle being in my mouth all night. It caused my lips to blow up like a bad Botox injection every morning, so bad that I seriously looked clown-like for the first hour of the day and was in a lot of pain from the swelling as well. The inside of my lips and gums got so irritated from the soft seal being pressed again them from the snap flap that I developed sores in my mouth. The soft seal, no matter what position I turned the ring in that adjusts it, used to feel like it was going to pop out of my mouth during the night. Many nights, I awoke to find it barely inside my lips, about to blow, which caused serious pinching discomfort. I would try to use the noseplugs, but they actually popped out from the pressure. And if I didn't use them, my nose would pop, as well as my ears, all night long.
I could not use the Oracle. I retired it and went on to try the Activa, which I used for six weeks or so. Then got the Breeze, which also didn't work out. Then the Swift, which I loved. And just recently, four nights ago, got the delivery of my Aura which, I have to say, I love the best of any of the masks I've used so far. The Swift was great and I never thought I'd find another mask that came close to it, but the Aura in four nights is fast taking its place in my opinion as the best interface that I can use.
Did your doctor tell you that you can't use nasal pillows or is that just an assumption on your part? I would make sure that you truly can't before you give up on the idea of a nasal pillow interface. I found them to be the best as they are the least cumbersome and restrictive to wear and use.
I don't mean to put the Oracle down, but it just didn't work for me. One of the RTs in my DME's office had been using it for six months at the time I got mine and loves it. He said not to use the straps or the plugs, that you get used to it without. But it just didn't work out for me. Sorry.
Hi. I am an ex-Oracle user, the newer version though. I don't know if you want to hear what I have to say or not as it's not pretty. But as I always preface or trail my comments about a mask with, it's an individual thing and what works for one doesn't work for another.
That being said, the Oracle was my first mask. I got that one because a friend of mine swore it was the best mask out there; however, she only needed cpap, according to her doctor, for surgery and used it for a few days or a week. I couldn't use it for very long because of the reasons I will list for you. First let me tell you the positive side of the Oracle that I found. I liked that it just went in your mouth and didn't cover your face really, and that the straps weren't a necessary thing. That's where it ends.
Now, what problems I had with it? First of all, I wound up with TMJ on the left side of my jaw, which I never had before, I think from holding my teeth/jaw in a certain way to compensate for the Oracle being in my mouth all night. It caused my lips to blow up like a bad Botox injection every morning, so bad that I seriously looked clown-like for the first hour of the day and was in a lot of pain from the swelling as well. The inside of my lips and gums got so irritated from the soft seal being pressed again them from the snap flap that I developed sores in my mouth. The soft seal, no matter what position I turned the ring in that adjusts it, used to feel like it was going to pop out of my mouth during the night. Many nights, I awoke to find it barely inside my lips, about to blow, which caused serious pinching discomfort. I would try to use the noseplugs, but they actually popped out from the pressure. And if I didn't use them, my nose would pop, as well as my ears, all night long.
I could not use the Oracle. I retired it and went on to try the Activa, which I used for six weeks or so. Then got the Breeze, which also didn't work out. Then the Swift, which I loved. And just recently, four nights ago, got the delivery of my Aura which, I have to say, I love the best of any of the masks I've used so far. The Swift was great and I never thought I'd find another mask that came close to it, but the Aura in four nights is fast taking its place in my opinion as the best interface that I can use.
Did your doctor tell you that you can't use nasal pillows or is that just an assumption on your part? I would make sure that you truly can't before you give up on the idea of a nasal pillow interface. I found them to be the best as they are the least cumbersome and restrictive to wear and use.
I don't mean to put the Oracle down, but it just didn't work for me. One of the RTs in my DME's office had been using it for six months at the time I got mine and loves it. He said not to use the straps or the plugs, that you get used to it without. But it just didn't work out for me. Sorry.
L o R i
Wow, that's quite a story
I used the Oracle last night for the first time and found it fairly comfortable compared to recent experiences with the FF. I had to take it off though, because the air kept blowing out of my nose as soon as I started to nod off. I have some nose plugs that I bought but they REALLY hurt if you make them tight enough to really create a seal.
My nostrils are not fully open and they sort of open and close at will, cutting off the supply of air. Nasal cushions would be great if I could use them, but it would always be sort of touch and go and the odds are that I might end up fumbling with a FF in the middle of the night so I figure, why bother in the first place?
You said something that interested me. Your friend suggested using the Oracle without the nose plugs - that one would get used to it over time. Right now air starts blowing out of my nose a mile a minute. I am wondering how you "get used to that". I read a lengthy Q&A today by a Fischer & Paykel rep about the Oracle and the idea is that nose plugs should not be needed in most cases as the flow of air through the mouth is supposed to hold the nasal passages shut. Apparently, however, I am not "most cases", much to my chagrin.
Anyway, thanks for the posts.
David
I used the Oracle last night for the first time and found it fairly comfortable compared to recent experiences with the FF. I had to take it off though, because the air kept blowing out of my nose as soon as I started to nod off. I have some nose plugs that I bought but they REALLY hurt if you make them tight enough to really create a seal.
My nostrils are not fully open and they sort of open and close at will, cutting off the supply of air. Nasal cushions would be great if I could use them, but it would always be sort of touch and go and the odds are that I might end up fumbling with a FF in the middle of the night so I figure, why bother in the first place?
You said something that interested me. Your friend suggested using the Oracle without the nose plugs - that one would get used to it over time. Right now air starts blowing out of my nose a mile a minute. I am wondering how you "get used to that". I read a lengthy Q&A today by a Fischer & Paykel rep about the Oracle and the idea is that nose plugs should not be needed in most cases as the flow of air through the mouth is supposed to hold the nasal passages shut. Apparently, however, I am not "most cases", much to my chagrin.
Anyway, thanks for the posts.
David
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David,
I think Nan's suggestion is great. The nose plugs literally blew out of my nose during the night, so I had to use large ones. They should have come with your Oracle. A swimmer's nose clip goes on the outside. It might cause a pin hole, though, of air to leak through, which could be just as annoying, if you don't make it tight enough, which then might cause discomfort. However, someone once posted about using the soft cushion-type ear plugs that they sell. My husband used to wear them when he did tree work with chainsaws. They are tiny little flexible cushions, nothing hard about them, and they get wider as the go up. Maybe you could get them in a sporting store like Sports Authority that sell guns. They might be used for deadening sound when a gun goes off. Or maybe just the sporting goods section of a Walmart or someplace like that.
The person who told me you get used to no earplugs or straps was an RT working in Apria Healthcare. He loves his Oracle. That's why I say, don't go by my unfortunate experience with it. I couldn't use the Breeze either and people on this site swear by it, that it's their favorite interface.
I think Nan's suggestion is great. The nose plugs literally blew out of my nose during the night, so I had to use large ones. They should have come with your Oracle. A swimmer's nose clip goes on the outside. It might cause a pin hole, though, of air to leak through, which could be just as annoying, if you don't make it tight enough, which then might cause discomfort. However, someone once posted about using the soft cushion-type ear plugs that they sell. My husband used to wear them when he did tree work with chainsaws. They are tiny little flexible cushions, nothing hard about them, and they get wider as the go up. Maybe you could get them in a sporting store like Sports Authority that sell guns. They might be used for deadening sound when a gun goes off. Or maybe just the sporting goods section of a Walmart or someplace like that.
The person who told me you get used to no earplugs or straps was an RT working in Apria Healthcare. He loves his Oracle. That's why I say, don't go by my unfortunate experience with it. I couldn't use the Breeze either and people on this site swear by it, that it's their favorite interface.
L o R i
Well, last night I tried the Oracle again and did use a swimmer's nose clip. My problem is that as soon as I fall asleep the passage from my throat to my nose (whatever that is called in lingo) opens up and the nose clips have to withstand the pressure for the rest of the duration. They don't really and there is an uncomfortable and constant pressure that eventually wakes you. I assume that most people who have success with the Oracle have this passage somehow automatically closed most of the time and the nose plugs act as a stopgap measure for rare lapses.
The other thing was, that I had the humidity at about 75% of maximum available and when I finally gave up in the middle of the night my mouth felt like a shoe that had been baking in an Arabian desert.
At the moment I am beginning to get a bit apathetic about my chances of ever finding a workable interface for CPAP. Maybe I will have to have an operation on my nose to make it possible to use a nasal interface.
Best
David
The other thing was, that I had the humidity at about 75% of maximum available and when I finally gave up in the middle of the night my mouth felt like a shoe that had been baking in an Arabian desert.
At the moment I am beginning to get a bit apathetic about my chances of ever finding a workable interface for CPAP. Maybe I will have to have an operation on my nose to make it possible to use a nasal interface.
Best
David
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Sleepless on LI
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David,
When I saw the link to this post in my email, I was praying you were having some success with the Oracle. So sorry to hear you're not. But the Oracle does cause that pressure from the throat to the nose, which is why they include those nose plugs in the box. But I found it was either a comfortable size that would blow out of my nares from the pressure or a large set that really hurt, and then you'd still have that pressure in the sinuses from the air wanting to escape. It's not an easy fix.
My only suggestion at this point would be not to give up too fast if this is your only true option left. Maybe given some time, your body will adjust to it. I tried it for a week or so and my problems were just growing and growing, like I explained to you in my first reply.
The RT said something I NEVER understood about the Oracle, even when I went home and tried to do it. He said if you use the seal backwards, it works better. Can you figure that one out?
One last thought. What machine are you on? Are you using straight cpap or auto? If you can use auto, maybe that would help because you may end up staying at a lower pressure than titrated and it won't cause as much discomfort. I never had an auto when I used mine. I was at a straight 10. Now that I'm on auto, the machine never goes to 10. Stays at 8 or 9. Maybe if that happened with you, you could tolerate it better. Just a thought.
Keep me posted, please. I would be interested in hearing how things go.
When I saw the link to this post in my email, I was praying you were having some success with the Oracle. So sorry to hear you're not. But the Oracle does cause that pressure from the throat to the nose, which is why they include those nose plugs in the box. But I found it was either a comfortable size that would blow out of my nares from the pressure or a large set that really hurt, and then you'd still have that pressure in the sinuses from the air wanting to escape. It's not an easy fix.
My only suggestion at this point would be not to give up too fast if this is your only true option left. Maybe given some time, your body will adjust to it. I tried it for a week or so and my problems were just growing and growing, like I explained to you in my first reply.
The RT said something I NEVER understood about the Oracle, even when I went home and tried to do it. He said if you use the seal backwards, it works better. Can you figure that one out?
One last thought. What machine are you on? Are you using straight cpap or auto? If you can use auto, maybe that would help because you may end up staying at a lower pressure than titrated and it won't cause as much discomfort. I never had an auto when I used mine. I was at a straight 10. Now that I'm on auto, the machine never goes to 10. Stays at 8 or 9. Maybe if that happened with you, you could tolerate it better. Just a thought.
Keep me posted, please. I would be interested in hearing how things go.
L o R i
Gave Up on Oracle
I finally gave up on the Oracle. It was worse than the apnea. Now I am fighting with a Respironics Full Face mask. The problem I have been having with the FFs is that to get around the leakage I need to pull them so tight that I wake in the morning with the bridge of my nose damaged. This morning it was (no kidding) bleeding. It's not just the Respironics mask. I have tried the Mirage and the Fisher & Paykel too. I suppose I could have an operation to restructure my nose so that I can use nasal cushions or something more user friendly. It may come down to that.
David
David
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David,
Are you SURE you can't use a nasal mask of ANY KIND? Grab is right to suggest the Activa. I would suggest moleskin under the ff mask, but if you're bleeding, forget that idea as it would hurt too much to place adhesive anything over an open wound. Not a good idea. I didn't put much faith in you having success with the Oracle only judging by my horrible experience and the fact that no one other than that one RT I know likes it.
I am sorry you are going through this, but there are SO many masks out there to try. Why don't you do a search on this site for full face masks and get some reviews? Rested Gal has some links to mask threads which might be useful to you.
Keep us posted.
Are you SURE you can't use a nasal mask of ANY KIND? Grab is right to suggest the Activa. I would suggest moleskin under the ff mask, but if you're bleeding, forget that idea as it would hurt too much to place adhesive anything over an open wound. Not a good idea. I didn't put much faith in you having success with the Oracle only judging by my horrible experience and the fact that no one other than that one RT I know likes it.
I am sorry you are going through this, but there are SO many masks out there to try. Why don't you do a search on this site for full face masks and get some reviews? Rested Gal has some links to mask threads which might be useful to you.
Keep us posted.
L o R i
David, sorry to hear you'r'e having such a tough time. A lot of us do, though. The main thing is to perservere! This is your life you're trying to get back.
One thing kind of jumped out at me when reading your experience with the Oracle. You said that the air came rushing out of your nose. The first thought that came to me was "Well, if the air rushes out of his nose with the Oracle, it makes sense that the air should rush into his nose with a nasal interface." It sounds like you may not be as obstructed as you think! I thought for 6 months that I was a confirmed mouth breather and didn't consider any mask other than my UltraMirage FF mask. Then I tried the DreamFit nasal interface and voila! It turns out I'm NOT exclusively a mouth breather after all. What a pleasant surprise that was to me!! Hopefully you'll find out your nasal passages aren't as obstructed as you think.
Take care and keep on trying! This therapy WORKS!!!
One thing kind of jumped out at me when reading your experience with the Oracle. You said that the air came rushing out of your nose. The first thought that came to me was "Well, if the air rushes out of his nose with the Oracle, it makes sense that the air should rush into his nose with a nasal interface." It sounds like you may not be as obstructed as you think! I thought for 6 months that I was a confirmed mouth breather and didn't consider any mask other than my UltraMirage FF mask. Then I tried the DreamFit nasal interface and voila! It turns out I'm NOT exclusively a mouth breather after all. What a pleasant surprise that was to me!! Hopefully you'll find out your nasal passages aren't as obstructed as you think.
Take care and keep on trying! This therapy WORKS!!!
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Makes sense to me! I'd go for a nasal mask. Worst that can happen is, it won't work. But think of what can happen if it DOES work!!! Your insurance company, like mine, might allow you two masks to start because, as they explained it, it's very rare when the first one works out to be the right one.TXKajun wrote:One thing kind of jumped out at me when reading your experience with the Oracle. You said that the air came rushing out of your nose. The first thought that came to me was "Well, if the air rushes out of his nose with the Oracle, it makes sense that the air should rush into his nose with a nasal interface."
Good thinking, TXK...
L o R i
Well I appreciate the many comments and suggestions. Funny enough I tried a Breeze and a Swift yesterday and was surprised that my nose was open enough to get sufficient air. Apparently under the pressure of CPAP even my narrowed nostrils intake enough air.
I couldn't warm up to the breeze. The headgear was too obtrusive and I continually woke up. Also the nasal cushions were of necessity pressed fairly hard up against my nose and around 3:00 AM I finally got up and started groping around for the Swift.
The Swift was far softer and required less pressure to hold it against the nose in a sealed fashion. The headgear also was less distracting. The only thing I didn't care for was the tube coming out on the side which hinders side sleeping as I am used to it (at least on that side).
Anyway, this mask is something that I can live with as long as my nose remains open enough to get air. My nose is the damndest thing. Just a change in position from back sleeping to side sleeping is enough to shut it down. And it is not that I am compressing the nose shut. It is the membranes inside that react and swell. Fortunately they revert fairly quickly when I go back to sleeping on my back.
Anyway, it looks like this story will have a happy ending.
Wishing all a good night.
David
I couldn't warm up to the breeze. The headgear was too obtrusive and I continually woke up. Also the nasal cushions were of necessity pressed fairly hard up against my nose and around 3:00 AM I finally got up and started groping around for the Swift.
The Swift was far softer and required less pressure to hold it against the nose in a sealed fashion. The headgear also was less distracting. The only thing I didn't care for was the tube coming out on the side which hinders side sleeping as I am used to it (at least on that side).
Anyway, this mask is something that I can live with as long as my nose remains open enough to get air. My nose is the damndest thing. Just a change in position from back sleeping to side sleeping is enough to shut it down. And it is not that I am compressing the nose shut. It is the membranes inside that react and swell. Fortunately they revert fairly quickly when I go back to sleeping on my back.
Anyway, it looks like this story will have a happy ending.
Wishing all a good night.
David
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Sleepless on LI
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David,
Are you sure your name isn't Lori? You are telling my story. The only part you left out was the Activa in between the Oracle and the Swift, and now the Aura after the Swift. I used first the Oracle, then the Activa, Breeze, Swift and Aura. The Oracle and Breeze were no-go's for me. The Activa was fine for awhile. The Swift I loved but always had the problem side sleeping a bit due to the tube (see Tridens post viewtopic.php?p=40679#40679 ). Now switched to the Aura and it's the best yet FOR ME.
I am so glad you took our advice and looked into being able to use a nasal pillow interface. I might try something else in the future other than a nasal pillow type, but have found so far that my two favorites were the Swift and Aura. I just read something here about a new gel mold-to-your-face ff mask coming out in October or November. Interesting...
Good luck with the Swift. It takes a bit of getting used to, as does any other new mask, but it's a great one. I'm very happy for you.
Are you sure your name isn't Lori? You are telling my story. The only part you left out was the Activa in between the Oracle and the Swift, and now the Aura after the Swift. I used first the Oracle, then the Activa, Breeze, Swift and Aura. The Oracle and Breeze were no-go's for me. The Activa was fine for awhile. The Swift I loved but always had the problem side sleeping a bit due to the tube (see Tridens post viewtopic.php?p=40679#40679 ). Now switched to the Aura and it's the best yet FOR ME.
I am so glad you took our advice and looked into being able to use a nasal pillow interface. I might try something else in the future other than a nasal pillow type, but have found so far that my two favorites were the Swift and Aura. I just read something here about a new gel mold-to-your-face ff mask coming out in October or November. Interesting...
Good luck with the Swift. It takes a bit of getting used to, as does any other new mask, but it's a great one. I'm very happy for you.
L o R i
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