Need explanation about central apnea index

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
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chunkyfrog
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Re: Need explanation about central apnea index

Post by chunkyfrog » Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:35 pm

I feel that as long as an index is decimal, rather than whole numbers, it is inconsequential.
If no significant digits are to the left of the decimal--don't sweat it.
Numerically, I consider you golden.
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Okie bipap
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Re: Need explanation about central apnea index

Post by Okie bipap » Mon Nov 22, 2021 7:43 pm

zonker wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 8:00 pm


Image

thanks! i've been holding on to this one for seven months.
Some of these dead horses (So Clean, distilled water, and so forth) get beaten over and over and over. They just won't stay down. :lol: :lol:
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ChicagoGranny
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Re: Need explanation about central apnea index

Post by ChicagoGranny » Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:22 am

Okie bipap wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 7:43 pm
Some of these dead horses (So Clean, distilled water, and so forth) get beaten over and over and over.
Washing the hose!

kvck
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Re: Need explanation about central apnea index

Post by kvck » Thu Nov 25, 2021 11:45 am

Pugsy wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 2:41 pm
It's normal to have a few centrals during the night.
Like it is normal to have a central apnea when transitioning from awake to asleep...also called sleep onset centrals.
It is also normal to wake up after REM stage sleep cycle is completed....entirely normal. Most of the time we aren't awake long enough to formulate a memory of the awakening but sometimes we don't roll over and go right back to sleep.

So a few wake ups during the night are normal and not necessarily caused by anything that is cpap or apnea related.
Google "sleep stages" and look at the normal hypnograms for various sleep stages and there's always a wake up after REM.

What basis does the Garmin device use to establish sleep stage???? Any electrodes to the face or head to measure EEG brain waves???? If not it doesn't have any way to actually know if you are asleep or not...much less sleep stages.
It might make educated guesses but it can't collect real data needed for confirmation without EEG leads.

http://freecpapadvice.com/sleepyhead-free-software
Using OSCAR software (based off SleepyHead) you can actually look at the flow rate and figure out if your centrals are real asleep centrals or arousal/awake centrals. If you aren't asleep they simply don't matter.
OSCAR https://www.sleepfiles.com/OSCAR/
http://www.apneaboard.com/wiki/index.ph ... stallation
http://www.apneaboard.com/wiki/index.ph ... rpretation

All that said...even if every single one of your Centrals were asleep centrals you aren't having enough of them to worry about. I suspect that a few of your centrals got flagged AFTER and arousal though and thus reflect the awake breathing false positive pause in breathing and not the cause of the awakening.
Hi Pugsy,

I downloaded Oscar and imported my sleep data. I had CA's again yesterday and here is an example. Would be appreciated if you could comment the flow rate and CAs relation.
1.JPG
1.JPG (293.31 KiB) Viewed 125 times

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Pugsy
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Re: Need explanation about central apnea index

Post by Pugsy » Thu Nov 25, 2021 11:49 am

kvck wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 11:45 am
Would be appreciated if you could comment the flow rate and CAs relation.
Those 2 centrals you zoomed in on...your were NOT asleep. The breathing/flow rate prior to the flags show obvious arousal/awake breathing.
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Re: Need explanation about central apnea index

Post by kvck » Thu Nov 25, 2021 12:00 pm

Pugsy wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 11:49 am
kvck wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 11:45 am
Would be appreciated if you could comment the flow rate and CAs relation.
Those 2 centrals you zoomed in on...your were NOT asleep. The breathing/flow rate prior to the flags show obvious arousal/awake breathing.
The others (7) are pretty similar to these two. I suppose something makes me awake :?:

Do you think (from a paradoxical POV), can ERP=2 make me awake and create CAs?

MMcG
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Re: Need explanation about central apnea index

Post by MMcG » Thu Nov 25, 2021 12:23 pm

I'm a relative novice at this, but my "diagnosis" was the same as Pugsy's (before I saw the comment). There's a link to some good explanatory videos on interpreting Oscar somewhere here. Having watched these, I can see that the increased/disturbed breathing started before the flagged CA. That shows you woke up before the flagged CA, so it was false. I'm ten weeks into using an APAP machine today and have become used to waking every couple of hours, as it's probably at the end of a sleep cycle. It's no longer a problem, because I usually fall asleep again within a few minutes (I can tell from the flow rate graph on Oscar next morning).

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Re: Need explanation about central apnea index

Post by kvck » Thu Nov 25, 2021 12:35 pm

MMcG wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 12:23 pm
I'm a relative novice at this, but my "diagnosis" was the same as Pugsy's (before I saw the comment). There's a link to some good explanatory videos on interpreting Oscar somewhere here. Having watched these, I can see that the increased/disturbed breathing started before the flagged CA. That shows you woke up before the flagged CA, so it was false. I'm ten weeks into using an APAP machine today and have become used to waking every couple of hours, as it's probably at the end of a sleep cycle. It's no longer a problem, because I usually fall asleep again within a few minutes (I can tell from the flow rate graph on Oscar next morning).
I think it is sort of normal of awake when using APAP. I will check the videos for sure. Thanks for your comment.

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Pugsy
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Re: Need explanation about central apnea index

Post by Pugsy » Thu Nov 25, 2021 12:41 pm

There are some people (very small minority) who find that using bilevel pressures can cause some unstable breathing and centrals happen.
Using EPR at any setting can thus possibly cause centrals. Not all that common though.
EPR creates a bilevel pressure situation.

Easy way to check though...reduce or turn off EPR.
This only works though if a person is having real asleep centrals.
EPR or not EPR or less EPR won't do a thing for arousal/awake related centrals. It's the awakening and subsequent normal pauses in breathing that cause central flagging while awake.
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Re: Need explanation about central apnea index

Post by kvck » Thu Nov 25, 2021 12:44 pm

Pugsy wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 12:41 pm
There are some people (very small minority) who find that using bilevel pressures can cause some unstable breathing and centrals happen.
Using EPR at any setting can thus possibly cause centrals. Not all that common though.
EPR creates a bilevel pressure situation.

Easy way to check though...reduce or turn off EPR.
This only works though if a person is having real asleep centrals.
EPR or not EPR or less EPR won't do a thing for arousal/awake related centrals. It's the awakening and subsequent normal pauses in breathing that cause central flagging while awake.
Thanks Pugsy for your additional comment. Appreciated. :)