REDUCE AHI

Anyone can share how (their experience) they have used DREAMSTATION BIPAP to reduce their AHI say from 30 to 10 etc.? thanks

Thanks; I am looking for actual (historical) data points like the following:
a) start with autob setting = 6cm/ipap & 4cm/epap
observations: ahi=30, 90%ipap=9cm2,epap=6cm2
b) adjustment
9cm2/6cm2
observations: ahi=25 etc.
what i am looking for the sequential inputs & resulting impacts (observations)
so i get a sense of what the type of responses to changes/adjustments to settings
to gain an understanding how the healing process should progress/unravel in time
thanks

SLOGGER wrote:Thanks; I am looking for actual (historical) data points like the following:
a) start with autob setting = 6cm/ipap & 4cm/epap
observations: ahi=30, 90%ipap=9cm2,epap=6cm2
b) adjustment
9cm2/6cm2
observations: ahi=25 etc.
what i am looking for the sequential inputs & resulting impacts (observations)
so i get a sense of what the type of responses to changes/adjustments to settings
to gain an understanding how the healing process should progress/unravel in time
thanks

you're wasting your time, because you're not the same person as whoever you're asking this data from. your responses will most likely be different.

also, there is *ZERO* correlation between severity of apnea (untreated AHI) and the pressure needed to correct it.

People who had a 'severe' diagnosis (many events) on testing may still have anatomically wide airways, so only need relatively low pressure settings to keep their airway open, and some with only 'mild' apnea - few apneas - on testing may have narrow airways and need higher pressures to keep them open.

I am not suggesting there is a unique pathway of adjusting pressures to bring down AHI
i do expect however there is a finite number of pathways as a function of major principal components perhaps including: age, cardiac condition, degree of untreated AHI etc.
by examining enough data point, one can in principle identify at least the major ones
you would be correct if the following holds true: there is absolute no way to reduce AHI by *ANY* adjustments to DREAMSTATION pressure settings
if latter were true, what use is the bipap machine?
in any case, seeing empirical data points is useful

SLOGGER wrote:I am not suggesting there is a unique pathway of adjusting pressures to bring down AHI
i do expect however there is a finite number of pathways as a function of major principal components perhaps including: age, cardiac condition, degree of untreated AHI etc.
by examining enough data point, one can in principle identify at least the major ones
you would be correct if the following holds true: there is absolute no way to reduce AHI by *ANY* adjustments to DREAMSTATION pressure settings
if latter were true, what use is the bipap machine?
in any case, seeing empirical data points is useful

You probably aren't going to find what you are looking for. Most people here who have improved their treatment started by reviewing their data to see what the breakdown of events were, if they were clustered, if they were long, etc. They also looked at the pressure if it was set for an auto range. Typically, if the events are obstructive, we recommend raising teh minimum (and increasing the max if the person is topping out). If the events are mostly CAs, we try to find out of they are real, and try a few adjustments before recommending a different machine.

Everybody is different, so seeing somebody else's before and after graphs won't do you much good other than to know it is possible to dial in on better settings and have a general idea. If you are trying to improve YOUR results, go ahead and post some graphs of a typical night. Let the people here help you.

Number of people on this forum
...Who use Dreamstation
-----Who monitor + tweak their own settings
.......With settings at the criteria you request

Have a feeling the group examined would be considered by research standards to be statistically insignificant. Maybe you can be a case study and document your research and report back. I really think comparisons like this are of questionable value as there is no control for sleep position or sleep stages or use of medications etc in the comparison. Just too many variables.

this may help you understand how they adjust a bi level/pap. This can be done at home with the aid of sleepyhead program. A difference of 3cm, gives a 50% reduction of effort in a normal lung.

I am beginning to see the vast #of variables;
Appreciate the constructive feedback especially the Titration Protocol; I will hunt down those manuals.
If anyone has the URL for them, please share; thanks

You can google "Titration Manual Bipap" and find documents.. There is even one by Philips on the first page of google.

The benefit of a sleep study is they can make these changes per the protocol while you sleep and see the impact.. so in one night they can make changes and get you some good feedback. This is not technically difficult for you to do if it wasn't for the fact that you are sleeping..

You are going to have to follow the protocol of making small tweaks and looking at it one day at a time.

Even if you go to a sleep study you can still look at your data on sleepyhead and see what you can do to further improve the therapy, if possible.

Also.. do you own and use this machine today?

What is your current experience?
You have AHI of 30 and what is happening?

the forum can normally help dial someone's pressure within a couple of weeks. As has been said, use sleepyhead and put up some charts

xxyzx wrote:

ajack wrote:this may help you understand how they adjust a bi level/pap. This can be done at home with the aid of sleepyhead program. A difference of 3cm, gives a 50% reduction of effort in a normal lung.

==========

pressure helps reduce effort to breathe but has nothing to do with the lungs
breathing is caused by the diaphragm causing a lower pressure cf partial vacuum to bring in air
and then relaxing so an exhale happens
the lungs just go along for the ride

If there is a constriction in the airways/lung (ie. asthma, COPD, bronchitis, emphysema, etc.), the lung very much has an impact on how much effort is required to breathe. It may not be doing the work, but it is absolutely part of the process.

xxyzx wrote:

compujas wrote:

xxyzx wrote:

ajack wrote:this may help you understand how they adjust a bi level/pap. This can be done at home with the aid of sleepyhead program. A difference of 3cm, gives a 50% reduction of effort in a normal lung.

==========

pressure helps reduce effort to breathe but has nothing to do with the lungs
breathing is caused by the diaphragm causing a lower pressure cf partial vacuum to bring in air
and then relaxing so an exhale happens
the lungs just go along for the ride

If there is a constriction in the airways/lung (ie. asthma, COPD, bronchitis, emphysema, etc.), the lung very much has an impact on how much effort is required to breathe. It may not be doing the work, but it is absolutely part of the process.

===========

do'H!

of course the lung is part of the process
but all the EFFORT is done elsewhere

you said it made the lungs effort less by 50%

i merely noted the lung makes no effort
the work is done elsewhere

First of all, it wasn't me that said it. Second, what was said was "A difference of 3cm, gives a 50% reduction of effort in a normal lung", meaning it's a reduction of effort if you have a normal lung, not a reduction of effort BY a normal lung.