Acceptable Leakage Stats on S8

MandoJohnny · Post by **MandoJohnny** » Tue May 30, 2006 1:36 pm

I have a ResMed S8 Elite and thanks to a kind soul on this site, I have learned how to read the efficacy stats. I think I have a handle on all the stats except for "Leakage." I know generally what it means, but my questions are:
1. How does the machine come up with the measurement? What are the inputs and the calculation?
2. What is an acceptable range for leakage?

GoofyUT · Post by **GoofyUT** » Tue May 30, 2006 3:03 pm

The easiest way to do this is to enable SmartData in the clinical menu, then enable Mask Fit in the SmartData menu (along with SmartData Access). Thereafter, SMartData will be an option in the Results menu in the Users Menu and MakFit will be a piece of data shown , 1 to 5 star increments. Though 5 stars is desirable, anything above three stars is fine.

Hope this helps.

Chuck

MandoJohnny · Post by **MandoJohnny** » Tue May 30, 2006 3:12 pm

Thanks, I'll do that!

Additional questions: How do the "stars" relate to the leakage stat? The leakage stat usually comes out to something like ".64" or ".32." BTW, I think my mask fits pretty well in a static sense and I suspect the "mask fit" function will bear that out. I am more concerned about leaks that get created when I move around at night. Wouldn't that be what the leakage stat measures?

GoofyUT · Post by **GoofyUT** » Tue May 30, 2006 3:21 pm

I use a Mriage Swift, which I REALLY enjoy. My leakage stats come out at <0.04L/s in most cases. (You can get Leakage stats from the efficacy reults menu).

Hope this helps!

Chuck

bassett · Post by **bassett** » Tue May 30, 2006 4:22 pm

MandoJohnny: I don't have any responses to your questions. However, I found this fairly informative link:

viewtopic.php?p=60845&sid=f1fec182e30ba ... 811fb78a67

It answered some of the questions I had myself about leakage. I hope it helps you, too.

Maryb · Post by **Maryb** » Tue May 30, 2006 6:37 pm

I have an S8 Vantage and Swift nasal pillows and I am also trying to work on my leak rate.
I know how to access the clinical menu and get the leak rate stats daily. I would also like to be able to check the mask fit.
When I look on my machine under the clincial menu and under SmartData I have the following 4 choices: Mask fit; pressure; usage and autoappear.
All of these were set to "off".
In my (crummy) users manual, it says that I can test for mask fit but it says nothing about measuring the overnight stats for mask fit.
My question is: should I enable all those 4 options under SmartData and if so what is it going to tell me that is different than the data I already am able to see under "results" every morning which is: Pressure setting, Pressure Max, leak rate, AHI, AI and Hi?
thanks for any insights that anyone can give me.
I'm feeling that I need to get hold of the clinical manual for the S8 Vantage.

Maryb

GoofyUT · Post by **GoofyUT** » Tue May 30, 2006 8:40 pm

SmartData just gives you a convenient way of accessing data from the User's results menu like MaskFit, usage and pressure. The MaskFit is rated in 1-5 stars, with 5 being the best. The leakage data that you get in the clinical results menu is somewhat more precise, but not everyhone can access the clinical menu. (For those that don't want to access the clinical menu, they shouldn't hold down the down and right keys for few seconds, together.

I'm a bit confused about the data that you ARE getting. You say pressure, pressure max, leak, AHI, AI and HI. If your S8 is set to AutoSet mode, I know that the min. pressure is displayed on that screen. But in the results screen , all I get is Pressure (95% pressure), Leak, AHI, AI and HI. No Pressure reading. Do you get something else???

Chuck

Maryb · Post by **Maryb** » Tue May 30, 2006 9:18 pm

Chuck-
Sorry I was reading off the xcel spreadsheet where I record these things daily.
I get the same data that you get: Pressure (95%), leak, AHI, AI and HI.
I also record the pressure setting that I use for that particular day on my spreadsheet since I've been fiddling with the pressure setting (trying to improve my stats).
Sorry for the confusion.
And thanks for the answer about SmartData--now I understand that it posts the data under the regular users menu.

Maryb

bsil · Post by **bsil** » Tue May 30, 2006 9:46 pm

maryb and chuck- I'm in my 2nd week of using the Resmed Vantage S8.
I called the sleeplab gal who I'm supposed to meet with in 1 month after I've downloaded the info on the Smartcard. She is supposed to review it with me and make any recommendations. I called her to see if I can get daily updates from my machine to see how I am doing. She said that if I did, then she would not be able to retrieve the same data from the Smartcard. Do you all know if that is true? Once I view the info, then the Smartcard card cant retrieve it? I would really like to know how I am doing. Each night, I feel like I'm sleeping a bit better, but I'm far from feeling refreshed!

GoofyUT · Post by **GoofyUT** » Tue May 30, 2006 10:00 pm

She spoketh NONSENSE. What you view on the screen has nothing to do with what the S8 stores and downloads to SmartCard. The fact that iit displays efficacy data on the screen is a distinct advantage of the S8.

Chuck

MandoJohnny · Post by **MandoJohnny** » Wed May 31, 2006 7:14 am

Chuck:

I did the mask fit procedure as you suggested and I got 5 stars. I even tried to mess with it and contort my face just to see if I could create leaks. It was solid at 5 stars and I have to say subjectively it feels solid. However, I still got .16 on leakage and in previous nights with the same configuration, I have gotten up to .32.

So I have an S8 Elite, similar to your machine, the same mask and I'm getting 5 stars, but my leakage is higher. I have double checked all my connections and set up on the machine. I am just wondering if there is some place to look next for the leakage. Machine defect? Need for a chin strap? Other?

GoofyUT · Post by **GoofyUT** » Wed May 31, 2006 7:31 am

First of all, I wouldn't sweat your leak of 0.16 or even 0.32. They're both acceptably low, I believe, but check with your DME or ResMed to be sure. Now, regarding places to check, folks have had problems occasionally with leaks from either the plug or the short tube outlet into the pillow sleeve on the Swift. So, you may want to try re-seating both of them. Some folks have tried plumber's teflon tape, or paper surgigal tape to increase the seal at these joints. I personally don't like the idea of breathing teflon over the long haul.

I've been spared any difficulties with my Swift, which I coddle like a baby since its been so good to me. You might want to pass along your pressure. I'm titrated at 10.0 and typically run 9.0-10.0 in AutoSet (its set to 6.0-14.0).

Hope this helps!

Chuck

ufo13 · Post by **ufo13** » Wed May 31, 2006 9:01 am

MandoJohnny:

Some more info for point of reference with the S8 "mask fit-leak rate" data etc. Below are my stats for mask fit-leak rate for the last 10 days:

1-mask fit: 5*-----leak rate: 0.78
2- " 4*----- " 0.64
3- " 2*----- " 0.72
4- " 5*----- " 0.46
5- " 4*----- " 0.90
6- " 5*----- " 0.74
7- " 5*----- " 0.38
8- " 2*----- " 0.88
9- " 4*----- " 0.78
10- " 5*----- " 0.68

The machine figures leak rates after adjusting for exhaust port standard leak rates keeping in mind the standard leak rate for the port will be higher as the pressure increases. As you can see in the above chart there are 4*s with a lower leak rate and 5* mask fit with a higher leak rate! My machine is set at a range of 13 to 17! The only conclusion I can draw is that the star rating is not only dependant upon the leak rate but also to the AMOUNT of time you are in a LARGE leak state during the the time the machine is recording data! To me this implies that MOUTH LEAKS and the duration of, directly affect the overall leak rate-mask fit data!

Hope this helps,

Steve,
ufo13

Maryb · Post by **Maryb** » Wed May 31, 2006 11:52 am

yikes!
I set the "mask fit" feature last night and I got "poor".
My leak rate is usually around .5 to .7. However, last night it was .84!
I've been thinking all along that I had mouth leaks (I use a chin strap) but maybe the mask itself is leaking! I do have to fiddle with it to get a good seal around the right nostril (deviated septum on that side). I've been using the large pillows. Maybe I should go back to the mediums (?). Also, I toss and turn quite a bit which probably causes leaks.

This thread has been great for me. I now realize that my leak rate is not so good. I thought that the leak rate reflected the flow rate/exhaust of the mask plus any leaks you had, and that if I was under .5 to .6 I was OK (from looking at the graph that comes with the Swift). I figured that I just needed to keep the leak rate at or below what it says on the Swift mask graph for my maximum pressure and that I'd be OK. Is that right??
But everyone else here seems to be having lower leak rates than me!
My pressure setting is 7.5 to 13.5 and I am usually up around 10-11 (no more than 12.5 max).

Any thoughts about this would be appreciated.

Maryb

john5757 · Post by **john5757** » Wed May 31, 2006 8:18 pm

The ResMed machines have mask selection feature that tells the machine the leaks rates at different pressure levels and kind of subtracts them to give a more realistic remaining leak rate. On my Swift I can get leak rates at about .1 I usually like to keep it under .3 the manual says that the auto algorithm start to degrade higher than .4 I did find that the mask selection feature does some changes to how the auto Spirit will react to flow limitations.

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