PB/CSR Not so scary anymore??

[Gabe]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDebRCR ... detailpage

Seems to me that PB/CSR is the most inportant event to be most concerned about. if this video is correct. Don't mean to be the Grim Reaper, but if we are to monitor and correct the most crucial event,, we should know what the most important event is, to improve it. I would think that it should be the main focus. The reason I bring this up, is I had asked what the most important data was and got different opinions.

[cpaptex]

Thanks for posting the video. I noticed one of the breathing patterns on myself. Especially when she"blows out" air from her mouth. I've done that a number of times from the best of my recollection. Originally, I thought that it was because of two much pressure in the mask. But later I discovered that no such pressure existed.

[jamiswolf]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDebRCR ... detailpage

Seems to me that PB/CSR is the most inportant event to be most concerned about. if this video is correct. Don't mean to be the Grim Reaper, but if we are to monitor and correct the most crucial event,, we should know what the most important event is, to improve it. I would think that it should be the main focus. The reason I bring this up, is I had asked what the most important data was and got different opinions.

Gabe,
First off, that vid was about a dying patient and really had very little to do with sleep apnea. The reason that you didn't get much mention of CS breathing in your thread is that it's quite uncommon and even when it does occur in sleep apnea patients, it doesn't herald death.

You have extrapolated that because dying patients often have CS breathing...that then CS breathing is a precursor to death. That isn't the case.

CS and PB can occur with apnea patients (who aren't dying) and if persistent, are treated most commonly with an ASV machine. I hope I've cleared this up for you.
Jamis

[JohnBFisher]

Gabe, I definitely agree with JamisWolf on this. Take the Hitch Hiker's Guide to xPAP Therapy to heart:



While Periodic Breathing and Cheyne Stoke respiration is not a good sign in a terminal patient, for those of us that only have sleep apnea, it's not really a big deal - unless we have that type of respiration ALL the time - not just some times.

So, focus on using your xPAP therapy to reduce your risks of heart problems and have many happy dreams!

[Gabe]

I'm not panicking. I just like to learn as much as I can. It seems like when you ask questions, some people think you are panicking. You can't help your therapy if you don't find out about your sickness and inquiring about things relating to it. There was another video that said PB and CSR are the same.

[jamiswolf]

I'm not panicking. I just like to learn as much as I can. It seems like when you ask questions, some people think you are panicking. You can't help your therapy if you don't find out about your sickness and inquiring about things relating to it. There was another video that said PB and CSR are the same.

John was just being humorous. Don't get your knickers in a snit. Your thread title indicated fear or concern by using the word "scary" so we assumed that was your emotion.

PB and CS breathing are related. CS is more well developed. PB has been described as CS little brother.
Jamis

[Gabe]

Well, it is scary. I did it to see what people would think about it. Everybody could draw their own conclusions as to what they think. Humor has it's place and I didn't think it was here. Some of us are serious about learning about things. I do have a sense of humor but I couldn't detect it. I don't wear knickers anymore, I outgrew them a long time ago. People on the forum tell you to ask questions and when you do, some want to be humorous. Why have CSR on Sleepyhead, at all, if it doesn't pertain to sleep apnea. It should just be PB.

[jamiswolf]

Gabe,
If you're trying so hard to learn...then what did you think of my post? Did it make sense to you? Once you understand the concepts, then it's not so scary.

And apparently you haven't read the Hitch-Hikers Guide to the Galaxy...
J

[Gabe]

Thanks, jamiswolf. I just don't know why CSR is even listed, when it wont show up anyway. I never heard of the Hitchhikers Galaxy. When I see something I don't understand and am interested in it, I want to learn more about it. I understand your reasoning. Again, why put something there that will do no good. I just wanted to pass on some information that I thought was related to sleep apnea. I apologize if I offended anyone or frightened them. I had no intention. I guess I better research things better,before posting them.

[jamiswolf]

No Problem Gabe,
I understand you were trying to be helpful, but there was a flaw in using that video because it didn't relate to sleep apnea patients.

PB/CS are listed in machine data because they do occur (more with folks with complex or central apnea). They also occur in folks with congestive heart failure and like your video showed, they occur in people who are dying. PB/CS are symptoms and not the disease.

So even though they are listed and apnea patients do experience them...they aren't the harbinger of death that your video showed. I had 25% periodic breathing during my sleep study...but now it's treated and not an issue. I'm sure John also had some PB or CS before he started his ASV treatment.

So it's valuable for the machines to report them...but they don't indicate impending death. Look at the pattern of a full blown CS breathing episode. The flat line between the crescendo and de-cresendo is a central (clear airway) apnea. So it's actually the central apneas that occur with CS breathing that are problematic.

And Gabe...this PB/CS breathing stuff is a part of sleep apnea that is very complex and difficult to understand. Just be aware that it does happen with apnea patients and needs to be watched (and treated if too frequent)
Did that help?
Jamis

PS: And the Hitch-Hikers Guide to the Galaxy is a Book/Movie by a British guy named Douglas Adams. Wacky British humor and great fun.

[Starlette]

Why have CSR on Sleepyhead, at all, if it doesn't pertain to sleep apnea. It should just be PB.

Gabe raises a good question though, why have CSR listed then? Think I know the answer.

[archangle]

Note that "PB/CSR" has nothing to do with SleepyHead. It's just reporting what the CPAP machine said.

If you had certain conditions, a report of PB would be very important. If it was bad enough, it would warrant further investigation.

Consider this analogy. Lots of heart attack victims report they had heartburn as their first symptom. That doesn't mean you should rush to the emergency room every time you get heartburn.

[Gabe]

I'm surprised that you didn't catch my humor in my topic change, jamiswolf. I guess it wasn't funny. Thanks to everyone who voiced their opinion. BTW, what good is the machine picking up CSR if the software can't decipher it? Another thing while I'm at it. I don't understand a lot of the jargon that is used on the computer and this forum. I wish people would be more explicit and use terms that can be understood by everyone. I remember President Kennedy saying something , to the effect, that using big words aren't worth anything if people don't understand you. I remember a commentator on tv a long time ago, summarizing the news, using a big vocabulary and I asked people if they understood him and they didn't understand him. That isn't good communication in my book.

[VVV]

People on the forum tell you to ask questions and when you do, some want to be humorous.

What would we do without a fall guy around here?

[Pugsy]

Encore Pro/Viewer does not list CSR....they only show PB on the event graphs and wave form reports.