Split night good/bad?

[gschamel]

Anyone else experience split nights?

Last night the data showed a calm night with no events until a CA and OA in quick succession that woke me up. Then I had numerous events until the alarm went off. I did go back to sleep relatively quickly after waking up.

George

[Slinky]

By split night I thought you meant you were scheduled for a split night in-lab PSG.

My guess is that as you progressed thru the night into deeper and deeper sleep cycles you progressed to a point where you needed a smidge more pressure than you were getting. Generally the later in the night and earlier in the morning the shorter the sleep cycles, the deeper the REM sleep, the more prone we are to "events".

I'm no sleep professional nor any form of medical professional, just a apnean and PAP user.

[archangle]

Is there any chance you were sleeping on your side to start and rolled on your back when the trouble started?

[gschamel]

Is there any chance you were sleeping on your side to start and rolled on your back when the trouble started?

not that I could tell...

I woke up on my side each time.

[gschamel]

By split night I thought you meant you were scheduled for a split night in-lab PSG.

Sorry about that...

My guess is that as you progressed thru the night into deeper and deeper sleep cycles you progressed to a point where you needed a smidge more pressure than you were getting. Generally the later in the night and earlier in the morning the shorter the sleep cycles, the deeper the REM sleep, the more prone we are to "events".

I'm no sleep professional nor any form of medical professional, just a apnean and PAP user.

I think sleep cycles run around 90 minutes so i don't believe that the several hours of problems were sleep cycle related. The first couple that woke me up may have been.

[BlackSpinner]

I think sleep cycles run around 90 minutes so i don't believe that the several hours of problems were sleep cycle related. The first couple that woke me up may have been.

There is a difference - there is a reason night shift is called the graveyard shift. You have something called a circadian rhythm and 3 - 5 am is the lowest point for many people - many people die at that time of the "night". (Quietly in their sleep) So basically there are 90 minute cycles but they are not the same.

[gschamel]

I think sleep cycles run around 90 minutes so i don't believe that the several hours of problems were sleep cycle related. The first couple that woke me up may have been.

There is a difference - there is a reason night shift is called the graveyard shift. You have something called a circadian rhythm and 3 - 5 am is the lowest point for many people - many people die at that time of the "night". (Quietly in their sleep) So basically there are 90 minute cycles but they are not the same.

True - I hadn't thought of it that way

[rested gal]

REM periods usually get longer as the sleep session progresses. Apneas are most apt to hit most people during REM. The longest REM usually happens near the end of the sleep session.

If you happen to turn onto your back AND go into one of the longer REM periods during the last half of the night, that could account for the worse looking data.

Having the pressure up high enough in the first place to try to prevent most apneas during "worst case scenario" (on your back and in REM) might help keep the latter part of the night events from occurring.

Yes, sleep usually cycles through the stages every 90 minutes. But -- the REM times generally do get longer with each cycle. That means other stages become shorter as the night progresses. Or stop happening...like the way N3 sleep happens mostly during the first part of the sleep session (for adults) and not during the second half.

Waking up on one's side is not necessarily the position the person was sleeping in when events started happening during the sleep. If a person is having difficulty breathing on his back, and he has an arousal to breathe better, he could turn over onto his side to "breathe better" during the arousal and never be awake long enough to realize he had been on his back, or that he turned over. If the arousal lasts long enough (more than 15 seconds?) for him to become aware of being "awake" he might have already turned onto his side. By the time he "wakes up" he's on his side, and thinks that means he's been on his side for quite awhile.

About being aware of being "awake:"

"sleepydave" on another board is the same person as "StillAnotherGuest", Muffy, NotMuffy, and deltadave" on cpaptalk.

sleepydave wrote:
An arousal is simply a 3 to 15 second break in sleep continuity, and an awakening is 15 seconds or more. It's usually to an alpha pattern. You may be aware of awakenings (not to be confused with really being "awake") but you won't be aware of arousals.
http://www.apneasupport.org/viewtopic.php?p=27820