RuthArt Therapy Thread

[RuthArt]

This is from last week and I just realized that I was not breathing during
one of these events for 68 seconds, with pressure at 17? It took 9 minutes
for me to wake up through all these events....I wish I could remember what
I was dreaming about, it must have been awesome. And once I woke up
and had that much air coming in, off went the mask.

So why doesn't that much air wake me up sooner? Where does it go, just out the ports in the
front of the mask? Of course, I was sleeping on my back and perhaps the
cat was sleeping on my lap (I love that). But what is happening to my
brain? (I have been having success in remembering my dreams for the last
4 days and that makes me happy because I haven't been able to do that
for a few years.)

[Pugsy]

Might have been a really good dream....might have been a really bad dream...might have been no dream at all.
Might have been positional...supine or maybe extreme chin tucking for some reason narrowing the airway.

Just because we don't remember a dream doesn't mean it didn't happen either.
They say we only remember a dream if we wake up during it or maybe right at the end of it and are awake long enough to form a memory of it. Remember dreams really isn't a good thing....it means we are waking up maybe more than we should.
That said...waking after the completion of REM stage sleep is a normal part of the cycle. Usually we aren't awake long enough to form a memory of the awakening though.
And to top it all off...dreams aren't restricted to just REM stage sleep...we can actually dream in any sleep stage.

As to why you didn't wake up sooner from all that air pressure....we can sleep through a lot more pressure than that and it appears you did.
What I think happened wasn't that the air pressure woke you up but the back to back OAs finally caused enough issues to cause you to wake up and you just happened to notice the higher air flow.
So I think the OAs caused the awakening and you just happened to notice the air flow pressures when you woke up.

I have slept through pressures over 20 cm...never even have a hint of them and only see them when I happen to review my reports.

[RuthArt]

but with all that pressure, I was still having OA, and I was taking some breaths in between,
does that mean my pressure is not high enough to stop them?
my settings are 6-18

my sleep contact at Kaiser only looks at the AHI and says I'm doing fine, but I will be looking for someone else
at the beginning of the year when I leave Kaiser for Aetna. Should I be looking for a Pulmonary person?

[Pugsy]

Actually unless you see this happen often I don't know that I would spend much time worrying about how to best prevent those OAs.

What you could do it increase the maximum from 18 to 20.....I am reasonably sure that the machine wanted to go higher but couldn't.
If it could have gone higher it might have prevented some of those OAs.

[CPAPLuv]

I was sleeping on my back and perhaps the
cat was sleeping on my lap (I love that).

Lol, sometimes my Chihuahua sleeps on my chest and I love that too. I think I actually sleep better when he does that.

[palerider]

but with all that pressure, I was still having OA, and I was taking some breaths in between,
does that mean my pressure is not high enough to stop them?
my settings are 6-18

my sleep contact at Kaiser only looks at the AHI and says I'm doing fine, but I will be looking for someone else
at the beginning of the year when I leave Kaiser for Aetna. Should I be looking for a Pulmonary person?

Correct, it wasn't ENOUGH pressure to keep your airway open... which is why I recommend to always have the max pressure set to whatever the max on your machine is, in your case 20, unless you have aerophagia problems.... having the max pressure set lower does nothing besides preventing the machine from being able to treat you.

[RuthArt]

thanks, I'll take the plunge and set to 20. (and somehow, I have to stay off my back but
it's the most comfortable position for me.)

[Pugsy]

You know it is very possible you were both on your back and in REM stage sleep at the same time. Worse case scenario kind of thing.
Both can cause OSA to worsen and sometimes some rather dramatic pressure needs. My OSA is worse in REM but doesn't seem to be affected by whatever position I sleep in.
I try to avoid back sleeping though because it increases my back pain significantly.
Staying off one's back is easier said than done though.
Or in your case you prefer supine sleeping and when you are asleep the body is going to want to gravitate to what it just likes to do.
It doesn't care that your OSA is maybe worse on your back. The body just wants familiar.

[chunkyfrog]

. . . The body just wants familiar.

Indeed.
Before my mastectomy, I hardly ever slept on my back.
I had to sleep on my back exclusively for around 3 months to preserve the desired position of my implants.
Since then, I have returned to mostly side sleeping, but supine is easier than it was before.

[RuthArt]

I haven't been able to use my mask for a while now, leaks, uncomfortable. I was able to get someone from Apria to send me some masks to try:
1. (Dreamwear FFM, the holes seemed small and I couldn't get enough air through them, then a lot of leaks around the bottom and sides),
2. (AirFit with memory foam, that had many leaks around the bridge of nose....anything too tight just irritates me)
I've had to postpone my hip replacement surgery until April 6 because the surgeon says I need to get the Sleep Apnea under control
before surgery....nothing is working.
I have been trying to get a Dr to get me a new sleep study in a lab thinking that they could see what a struggle I am going through but
my husband is saying there is no place in San Diego that does the in lab studies. I finally got a call from Apria today for a fitting on
Feb 21, the woman said there is no reason that those masks I got from them should not be working for me. I asked if she had sleep
apnea and when she said no, I had to keep my mouth shut!
I know I need this therapy but the amount of time that I struggle with these masks is infringing on the amount of sleep I could be
getting although it's still not restful sleep.
I have a small face with small nares and probably deviated septum (at least that's what the dentist said when I was fitted for the oral device...he
was all for me getting my nose fixed and I said no.)
I'm starting to wonder if my inability to get this to work has something to do with I don't really want to go through the hip surgery, but if I don't then
what? Be in a wheelchair and no walking anywhere? Every night that I try to make the masks work, I end up in tears.
And....the Apria people say the AHI is trending down....how can that be? What are they going by?

[Miss Emerita]

They are probably getting the data through wireless transmission from your machine.

About masks: are your completely sure you need a FFM? Any chance you could use a nasal pillow mask with a little help to keep your mouth closed?

[RuthArt]

now I have something happening in my throat, I can feel it just below my larynx and I burp to try to get rid of it. I was only able to keep the mask on for an hour, because the leaking started and I couldn't get it stopped. AHI 25 just for that....and of course, my trend on MyAir shows going down, that's all the DME looks at. I am beyond frustrated now.
I did try pillows years ago, but my mouth kept popping open and I felt like I was suffocating. Is there any hope?

[Julie]

Stop trying to get anything meaningful from MyAir... not happening. DO DL Oscar because it will show a huge lot more of info that can actually point to problems and fixes... the instructions tell you how to do it, post graphs, etc. (but plse no calendar or pie chart, tho' leave necessary info below those) and once it's done we can help interpret things for you and suggest tweaks that might be needed, whether to pressure or whatever else.

[RuthArt]

since it was only an hour with mask on, I was probably awake and that thing going on in
my throat was really bothering me, and the burping...do I now have that dreaded Aerophagia?
I'm so totally depressed I fear for my life because I am having visions of doing my self harm!!
I don't want to live like this, but I try because my husband would be devastated if I left him.
Before I found out about my hip and this worsening sleep apnea, I was getting over my
dog passing...but I felt I was on the mend, emotionally. Not it's in the toilet and I don't
want my husband to think I am feeling worse than I did over my dog passing. I'm 74 and
don't feel like life is worth living like this.

[kteague]

I may have missed it in the thread, but did you test out a different machine yet as Pugsy mentioned? I would hate to see you going through this mask ordeal is the mask isn't the issue. When I was having some issues my DME provider at the doctor's request gave me a 2 week loaner.