Re: CPAP and allergies-runny nose after using

lisadrive517 · Post by **lisadrive517** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 10:20 am

Hi there,
I was diagnosed with sleep apea about 3 years ago. I guess I have had it for a long time, but didn't know it. I felt someone sleepy, but lived and lived a pretty normal life. About 1 1/2 years ago I had a deviated septum surgery, and since I was doing that I decided to have a rhintoplasty? at the same time. Had I know that the deviated septum surgery would not correct sleep apnea, I would have had neither. In any event, I have had major sleep apea problems since then. I have had all sorts of problem, major sleep deprivation, with all kinds of neurological problems, including slow speech, weakness, which seem to notice more on the left side and mostly in the early part of the day. It has really affected my life. I have been in real estate for 20 years, and I can't concentration on contracts, etc.
When I use the Cpap, low level 4, my nose runs all the next day.
It does these with the heated humidifier??, as well.

My quality of life has sleep to a 0. Saw this website, so any suggestions would be welcomed.

Thanks in advance.

Lisa

NyNurse33 · Post by **NyNurse33** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 10:52 am

HI Lisa...Welcome...you've come to the right place. Have you tried playing around with the level of humidity? Maybe you are giving yourself too much moisture. Also, have you ever heard of saline sinus rinses? I'm not sure if you can use them with your deviated septum ( I'm thinking maybe not), maybe others can tell you.

JimHillTx · Post by **JimHillTx** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 11:05 am

First let me say I know in time things do get better.
One of the things I noticed when I read your post was that you used the phrase, "When I use.....". Unless your doctor has told you to only use your machine occasionally, you have to always use it. Even when you lay down for just a short nap, which can help sometimes if you have the time. Go horizontal, use CPAP......
Before purchasing a humidifier, try just putting a bowl of water next to your machines intake port, or if you have a room humidifier, try using it. may not be as effective as a contained one, but will give you an idea.
If you are really new to your machine, it will take your body a while to get accustomed to the prossess. Even after many years with my machines, sometimes I have the runny's the next day, even with my humidifier. I live very near the coast and right next to a lake so the normal moisture levels are usually good.
If it is a really big ongoing problem, there are very mild Rx's your doctor can give you to try. I say go to your doctor for them instead of the over the counter meds because they tend to be too strong, too many side effects that you are already having problems with...... I have had very good luck with Hydralazine 25mg as it does not make me dingy the next day. Everyone is different when it comes to medications, so ask your dr if he has any samples before you spend the money on a full Rx.
Make sure and tell him all of your problems with the sleeping. My doctor has me trained or maybe the other way around, but I type out a list of what the problems are, when they occur, how I feel ect. He looks at my notes and then starts asking me for more info on the ones that he feels are important. This has lead to a lot better care through the years for me and give me a point to ask questions from also.
My two cents worth and I really hope things improve. I have been sleeping well with my machines for almost 25yrs now. Would not be here if it had not been caught in time.

ozij · Post by **ozij** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 11:29 am

When I started cpap therapy - with a humidifier - I had an extremely runny nose fro a while - during the first month more or less.

And then it disappeared - I can't say why.

I agree with Jim -

JimHillTx wrote:Unless your doctor has told you to only use your machine occasionally, you have to always use it. Even when you lay down for just a short nap, which can help sometimes if you have the time. Go horizontal, use CPAP......

Getting used to sleeping with the machine is extremely important - some people do take to it immediately - for others it takes months. Don't give up after a night or two, and do browse the forum, you'll find tons of tips from people who solved problems with cpap problems. Many of us here had a hard time starting - we know where you're at.

O.

Goofproof · Post by **Goofproof** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 11:40 am

It would help us if you would fill in your profile, I take your post to be you use CPAP at 4 cm pressure, 4 cm is air staravation level, most people can't stand that. Also do you have a pollen filter installed onthe machine and the filters clean, my nose gets better on the machine because the machine is giving me purer air.

If you are using a nasal interface, you maybe mouthbreathing, if that's the case you can be losing your treatment into the room. A machine that records data and the software is a great asset. If you are set at 4 CM, a APAP and software could show you if the Dr. was correct or just nuts. Jim

krousseau · Post by **krousseau** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 2:41 pm

It is possible you have a vasomotor rhinitis triggered by cpap-if you don't have any other symptoms like sneezing that may be it. There is an Rx nasal spray that can help (atrovent or ipratropium bromide)see a doc to make sure. Without allergies antihistamine, decongestant, and steroid sprays don't help much. It can be caused by low humidity-so don't be tempted to do without your humidifier. Cold is another trigger. Pressure??? Blowing air in your nose-AKA cpap???

It does not sound like you have effective treatment-like Goofproof-I'd be gasping at 4 even when fully awake. Please do fill in your profile. Ask questions here-you have the equipment-why not get some answers. When did you see a good sleep doc last?

JimHill-what do you use hydralazine for--rhinitis--it is a vasodilator used to treat hypertension and had I've had patients complain about nasal stuffiness. I don't get the rhinitis connection though.

thomzeyl · Post by **thomzeyl** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 3:26 pm

Your neurological issues concern me. Have you had an MRI and/or PET scan? These plus an EEG are needed. Not all sleep apnea is OSA, some neurological issues cause the brain's control of sleep to go astray. Make sure a neurologist has cleared you!

JimHillTx · Post by **JimHillTx** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 4:38 pm

krousseau

Thank you for reading all of everyone's posts. Had it not been for you doing so and asking me about the hydralazine, who knows how long I would have been taking the wrong medicine. I get a 90 day supply, 4 x a day and have been on the wrong med for about 1 1/2 months. Explains why I have been having more problems. Others too, passed out at the rec center the other day, they called ems and we just thought I had done too much. Standard Dr's appt near end of next month, am calling him tomorrow.....
Again, thank you for asking. Jim (also, I am not supposed to take hydralzine at all !!)

hydralazine 25mg....is what I am supposed to be taking/Dr's prescription!
hydroxyzine 25mg....is what the Pharmacy gave me for a refill. NOT what I should be taking

We have all heard the horror stories of wrong medications being given or not being able to read the doctors writting. This refill was done by the same Drug Store that has been filling this prescription for years.

lisadrive517
For the correct record, Hydroxyzine 25mg is what my doctor intended on me taking for the runny nose problem. It did work, as with what everyone else has said, get really involved with your care. I fully agree with "thomzeyl" that at a setting of "4" I would be gasping for air also.

_________________

CPAPopedia Keywords Contained In This Post (Click For Definition): Prescription

kavanaugh1950 · Post by **kavanaugh1950** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 4:39 pm

I THINK THE ADVICE JIM GAVE WAS GREAT, ALTHOUGH I THINK HE MAY HAVE MEANT HYDROXAZINE (ATARAX OR VISTARIL) AS OPPOSED TO HYDRALAZINE WHICH IS A BP MED. PAT

JimHillTx · Post by **JimHillTx** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 4:47 pm

kavanaugh1950

Please see my re-post to this subject, You also caught the close spelling error, unfortunately the wrong medication given.
Because I have been on this medication for so long, when I picked it up, just glancing at the name, it looked "right". Even when I took the time to make sure I spelled it correctly by looking at the bottle when posting my original message, did not click wrong med. Had to go to workshop and get an "old" bottle with finishing nails in it to see what was wrong. From what I have read in a short time on the net, pretty big screw up on my med. I hope no lasting problems.

Monday, the sh*t is going to hit the fan...

Snoredog · Post by **Snoredog** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 4:56 pm

your nose runs because your body is trying to flush out the allergens attached to the inside of the nasal cavity that are causing the inflammation, such as dust, etc. CPAP would dry that process out or make it harder for the body to natually flush out those allergens. Using a humidifer would prevent the nose from drying out.

You can help the runny nose process along by using a yoga style saline rhino wash using a netti pot or irrigator. This will flush out the allergens at a much faster rate. You simply make up the saline solution, hold your head over the sink and squirt the solution into one nare allowing it to run out the other. Couple times a week and your allergies will get better. To make the solution at home;

-8oz. pure warm water (distilled is better).
-1/4 teaspoon of salt (can use tablesalt, but seasalt or uniodized is better).
-pinch of Arm& Hammer baking soda (breaks up dried mucosa).

Use half solution on one side, tilt your head back for a few seconds, use the remainder on the other side. Blow your nose when finished. It actually works.
When you have flushed out all the allergens, the nose will stop running. The rhino wash would offer instant relief.

Are you also taking anything for the allergies it such as Loratadine (Claritin)?

I don't think your neurological symptoms are related to the rhinoplasty surgery, allergies can cause fatigue and similar symptoms. Rhinoplasty reshapes the nose or improves the airway, they will fix a deviated septum at the same time.

Untreated OSA can lead to stroke, you can also have a stroke and never know it. MRI is the only way to determine for sure if you had one.

Humidifier: Humidifiers add moisture to the cpap air so your nasal cavity doesn't dry out. They are not intended to warm the air from a cold sleeping environment although more humid the air is the warmer it will feel.

If you want to warm the incoming air get a heated hose don't turn up the humdifier expecting it to warm the air because all that will do is increase the moisture and create rainout problems.

krousseau · Post by **krousseau** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 6:15 pm

May be allergies-maybe not. We don't have your whole history. Can't just go with one symptom-unless it is only a runny nose with clear watery mucous. Why not give your history to a doc though and then you can get medication if you need it. From the other symptoms you gave you need to see a doc anyway.

Snoredog's suggestions for allergies are good if that is what is wrong.