CPAP.com Launches Return Insurance Option

Post by **forumadmin** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 10:35 am

Greetings CPAPtalkers,

I am pleased to announce that we at CPAP.com are taking the first step towards what I hope will be a sustainable and effective CPAP equipment return option.

Starting today, CPAP.com customers purchasing a Hybrid, Activa or Profile Lite mask will be asked if they would like to purchase return insurance. Those who purchase it will pay an additional fee for the ability to return the product. We will include a UPS return shipping label with each return option purchase. If you wish to return the mask, simply repack it, put the label on it and drop it off at any UPS location.

The return option fee will vary depending on market conditions such as product price, return rate, shipping fees and administration costs and is designed to be as low as possible given that opened products can not be resold.

All CPAP.com products will continue to be sold brand new. You will never get a product from CPAP.com that has been used by another person.

Return insurance will not affect (read, will not raise) the pricing you have come to expect from CPAP.com. Our price match policy stands. The return option is a value added fee that is purchased only by those who want the protection.

For more information, please read the updated CPAP.com Return Policy:

https://www.cpap.com/returns.php

Please be aware that this is a trial policy. If it meets with success it will be expanded, otherwise it will be discontinued.

On a personal note, I've watched far too many people struggle with this aspect on online CPAP retailing. I want this to work badly and will do whatever I can to see it succeed. I need your ideas, thoughts and feedback. Please help me improve this aspect of online CPAP retailing for the benefit of all.

Johnny

limpy · Post by **limpy** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 1:25 pm

This may be a good option for me when the next hot new mask comes out. I wish it had been around when I was buying my first 9 masks.

ThunderSnorem · Post by **ThunderSnorem** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 3:35 pm

I want to get a FF mask and I am very seriously considering the Hans Rudolph 7600 or the HC431. Wish you offered insurance on those. I'd pay to be able to return it if it didn't work right. $110 - $149 is a big chunk of change to eat if it doesn't fit me right. I'm terrified of purchasing and getting stuck with something useless.

But I guess the insurance only works when CPAP.com calculates the probable return rate so that they don't have to continually 'eat' the wholesale prices on these masks.

John

kteague · Post by **kteague** » Tue Sep 19, 2006 8:07 am

Johnny,
Thanks for this effort to address this concern. If the risk factor is reduced in trying a particular mask, maybe those of us who can't afford multiple trial purchases will also have the opportunity to possibly improve our xpap experience. Sure hope you can get the kinks out to make it a workable solution for both both cpap.com and the buyers. Thanks again.
Kathy

KimberlyinMN · Post by **KimberlyinMN** » Tue Sep 19, 2006 8:15 am

That's a great idea. Heck, I can't even return a mask to my DME!

Kimberly

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Sep 19, 2006 8:56 am

Heh. Can you imagine the uproar if a DME company even thought about suggesting charging extra for the ability to return a mask after trying it?! lol

Wulfman · Post by **Wulfman** » Tue Sep 19, 2006 9:18 am

Anonymous wrote:Heh. Can you imagine the uproar if a DME company even thought about suggesting charging extra for the ability to return a mask after trying it?! lol

Because they're ALREADY charging "extra"???

Den

Wulfman · Post by **Wulfman** » Tue Sep 19, 2006 9:25 am

Johnny,

I've been wondering what happens to the ones that come back......
(especially the ones that have been "thrown across the room" during the night)

Any options for the lab-ratting forum members to pick them up at a discount?

Who knows, some or these folks (not mentioning names here) could take various parts from many masks and come up with a whole new mask concept.

Anyway, it sounds like a good idea.

Best wishes,

Den

ThunderSnorem · Post by **ThunderSnorem** » Tue Sep 19, 2006 9:29 am

Hi Johnny,

I'm imagine you all are working out what the percentage of returns etc. might be, so to help, I'll give you my mask purchase history. I'm new to CPAP since 8/10/06, and have been working through my DME.

I started with a ResMed Ultra Mirage II Nasal mask. This worked well, but I was mouth breathing. So the DME had me return it, and we tried an UMFF, both large and small. Neither would work. The DME only carries ResMed products, and wanted a $90 upcharge to have me turn in the UMFF and try a non-returnable HC321. I figured it was best to get an Activa for $20 more and then get a FF mask online, thus I'd have 2 masks for just a little more cash out of pocket.

So, I would have kept the UM II nasal mask except for the mouth breathing. The only return was the UMFF, and I am happy with the Activa and mouth taping. Had I purchased online I would have kept the UM II nasal mask and tried a FF mask, probably the VIP7600.

I am still thinking about the VIP7600 as a FF mask for backup.

I imagine everyone's experience is different, but I hope this info helps.

John

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Sep 19, 2006 10:14 am

Wulfman wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Heh. Can you imagine the uproar if a DME company even thought about suggesting charging extra for the ability to return a mask after trying it?! lol
Because they're ALREADY charging "extra"???

Den

Funny you say that. I was thinking about that after I entered that last message. Supprisingly, our host here is now MORE expensive than the DME company that set me up. My insurance paid $810.00 for the setup. Online it is now at $980.20 for the same thing.
I think it's because as stated in the annoucement post - many online companies are now trying to deal with the one primary shortfall they have always had: Difficulty in dealing with a customer who doesn't know exactly what they want and how to use it.
So in trying to come up with solutions for that problem area they are now incurring the exact sorts of costs that drove the costs up on the traditional businesses. This is true in virtually any market segment - it's not unique to our little corner of the internet. It's a fantastically tough nut to crack and frankly I don't know if can even be done. Once you start acting like a traditional brick & mortar business - you have the liabilities of them too.

Wulfman · Post by **Wulfman** » Tue Sep 19, 2006 12:19 pm

......: Difficulty in dealing with a customer who doesn't know exactly what they want and how to use it.

I don't know what the answer to this one is. I can say that, personally, I gave a lot of thought to what I perceived to be a mask that would work for me......and so far it seems like it has.
I'm afraid in too many cases, the DME picks out the mask to give the patient based on what they want to make the most profit from. By the time the patient determines that it isn't working, they either give up on their therapy or it's time for the DME to stick it to their insurance for another one to try.

I'm wondering if the patient had to actually pay out-of-pocket for some of this stuff, they'd do a lot more research up front......which may also be tough for a sleep-deprived person......and, again, that's all dependant on what makes and models they have access to. Just look at how many makes and models of masks have become available in the last year and a half......

We know the manufacturers aren't losing money.....and the insurance industry isn't going to lose money......so that leaves the ones in between and the end-users.

Sorry for rambling, but I was just told about a close (family) situation this weekend that has me absolutely furious with a sleep doc and a DME in another state......and I'm REALLY having a hard time feeling any sympathy for the B&M DMEs at this moment.....(if I ever did).

Den

greyhound · Post by **greyhound** » Tue Sep 19, 2006 1:06 pm

Can't help but be a bit skeptical about guest's claim that a DME setup is (significantly) less expensive than cpap.com. I'm not putting cpap.com on a pedestal (although I am extremely satisfied with their customer service and pricing), but my DME/internet provider pricing comparison was much different than guest's.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 9:15 am

There isn't really anything to be skeptical about. Though I was off on my math the first time, not sure how.

The total cost through insurance was $814.32 (Not $810.00 as I said).

The total cost through the website was $980.20. I just double checked that math to make sure I didn't mess that up as well!

greyhound · Post by **greyhound** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 1:44 pm

Guest. are you sure that your "total" cost isn't just your co-pay and there's a significant additional amount paid by your insurer.

I'd still like to know the specifics of your configuration and your DME pricing before accepting your statement. It contradicts every pricing scenario I've seen.

roadwarrior · Post by **roadwarrior** » Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:26 pm

Not having insurance at the moment I sure would love to see them offer that return insurance for a Hans Rudolph FF mask. Oh well.....time will tell. I'm not prepared to shell out the big bucks for a trial with no hope of return at this time.

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