Water in nasal pillow mask

[Hosehead4ever]

Here's the deal, I have this new AirSense machine and heated hose. I also use a hose cover. But I keep my bedroom around 55 at night. My machine is set to 4 humidity and 80 on hose temp. At least I think that number is hose temp. My mask is collecting water in the pillow which goes down my throat at night and sometimes chokes me awake (and it burns my sinuses). I'm hoping for some suggestions on which way to change my settings to help mitigate this. Considering my bedroom is chilly at night, should I lower my hose temp? Lower humidity? Any ideas on exactly what to try?

[Pugsy]

See my thoughts here in this thread.
viewtopic/t94035/Pugsys-Pointers-3Deali ... -road.html
Second post

Lowering the hose temp won't help and will make it worse.
Lowering the humidity level delivered may or may not help...won't be any help if the moisture is coming from your own exhaled breath and could potentially cause nasal mucosa to get dried out and unhappy.

Try increasing the hose temperature...from 80 to 82 or maybe 84 or the max. If that doesn't help then consider a barrel cozy like I mentioned in the above thread.

[SGearhart]

I have a heated hose and a hose cover causes condensation problems. It appears that the heated hose needs to have contact with the actual environment to be effective. Because of the insulating properties of the hose cover, the hose is basing its settings on the temperature/humidity differential between it and the hose cover and not your bedroom conditions. I've found that I had to change from the autoset mode to the manual mode and reduce the humidity level to about half of the default (80%).

Here is another idea. Try and place your CPAP lower than the top of your mattress. Gravity will aid in any rainout staying in the lower part of the hose. This tip works well with all hoses.

[Pugsy]

I have a heated hose and a hose cover causes condensation problems. It appears that the heated hose needs to have contact with the actual environment to be effective.

Your situation is not what commonly happens. Most people find the opposite to be true...myself included.
Also Katy as the new Airsense 10 machine and it does things a little differently than the S9 does...she is already using a setting of 4 for humidity delivery which is not all that high (I think it can go to . The AirSense pretty much defaults to manual mode with humidity and temp settings being independent of each other.

Placing the humidifier lower to let gravity help with moisture in the hose is a good idea for moisture in the hose itself but it doesn't really help with moisture in the nasal pillows which is what Katy is primarily complaining about. With the way the nasal pillows fit the face it is difficult for any moisture in the hose to even make it down into the hose. Depends a lot on head and mask position.
I have a multitude of experience with moisture in both the hose and nasal pillows due to my own preference of having a really cold bedroom...like Katy's 55 degree.

For condensation in nasal pillows (and not in the hose) there's a real good chance that it is from the moisture in our own exhaled breath sort of overloading the air in the nasal pillow and the air simply is too cool to keep the condensation from forming.
Simplest fix to try first...simply turn up the temp on the incoming air so that it hopefully stays warm enough to not cool to the point of releasing the moisture.
If we max out the temp and that doesn't help...then we maybe add a hose cozy to the short hose assembly...or a barrel cozy.
Anything to help keep the air in the nasal pillow from cooling to the point of releasing the moisture.

I suggest the barrel cozy because not only does it work...it feels super nice against the skin. I used mine year round even when it really wasn't needed because it felt so good against the skin.

[SGearhart]

For condensation in nasal pillows (and not in the hose) there's a real good chance that it is from the moisture in our own exhaled breath sort of overloading the air in the nasal pillow and the air simply is too cool to keep the condensation from forming.
Simplest fix to try first...simply turn up the temp on the incoming air so that it hopefully stays warm enough to not cool to the point of releasing the moisture.

Good Point!

I have a question. If the condensation is from high humidity in our exhaled breath into a cooler environment, wouldn't it be better to turn down the incoming a temperature since 40% humidity @ 70 degrees is actually less moisture than 40% @ 80 degrees. (I used 40% as an arbitrary value).

I used the following assumptions:
Basic dewpoint = bedroom at 55 degrees
An air temperature of 75 degrees with the humidity set at 40% will yield a dewpoint of 49 degrees allowing a leeway before condensation forms.
An air temperature of 85 degrees with the humidity set at 40% will yield a dewpoint of 58 degrees thus condensation is forming 3 degrees above room temperature.
Or, Am I just over thinking this?

[Pugsy]

Or, Am I just over thinking this?

This gets my vote.

In 5 years (coming on 6 now) with 5 winters now under my belt and remember back when I first started therapy there was no such thing as an integrated heated hose. The best we had was the Aussie heated hose at a really steep price point.
So I have run the entire gamut with various ways to reduce condensation in both the hose and the nasal pillows. Reducing the amount of humidity delivered has never been an option for me because my nasal mucosa absolutely don't like being too dry.

Did you know that even people living in the high desert and not using any humidifier at all can get rain out in their masks? Yep, I cringed when I read that but it's true. I would just as soon go without my machine as without a humidifier.

Even with a heated hose being used, remember that most of the nasal pillow masks have some sort of short hose thing going on and that part is unheated so the air starts cooling as soon as it leaves the heated hose part and depending on how cool the bedroom is.

I tend to go with the obvious K.I.S.S stuff...try the easiest option first if at all possible.
Never, ever has lowering the hose temp reduced any rain out issues that I have ever had...even back when all we had was Classic Mode and a lower setting there meant lower air temps by default for condensation at the mask level from the moisture in our exhaled breath.

I see your point about relative humidity and dew points but in real life I don't see it happening that way and way too confusing for most people anyway.
The only time I have ever seen lowering any temperature reduce rain out is when it also reduced the amount of humidity being delivered...like with Classic mode and mainly at the hose level and not the mask level.
Rain out at the mask level is a totally different animal in most situations.
I don't know about others but when I sleep the position of the mask and the outlet hole to the short hose never comes close to allowing gravity to help out....my hose is up over the top of my head and water can't run uphill even if I am on my side.

In general the long held solution for rain out...more warm air by some fashion.

[bruskee]

I had the same thing happen to me with the same machine when I 1st got it and was setting both heat and humidity manually. I changed the humidity back to auto and just adjust the heat and it's never happened again. You can still control the heat of the air and I've never had an issue wanting anymore or less humidity that what the auto picks..

Hope this helps.

[SGearhart]

Or, Am I just over thinking this?

This gets my vote.

Yes Ma'am!

[Hosehead4ever]

Pugsy, I've been eyeing those barrel covers for a while. So happy to have an excuse to buy them. Will turn up temperature as well.