Sleep Hygiene/Dissenting Opinion

[blueh2o]

I meant NLJT's (NotLazyJustTired) post.

[mollete]

Experts tell us we should adhere to a regular sleep schedule, get up at the same time every day to an alarm, even if we haven’t slept enough. Sorry, there is no way I will sacrifice sleep to regularity. Sleep is such a shy and fleeting presence in my life, and is so essential to my mood and functioning, that, no, I won’t scare it away with an alarm.

I would respectfully submit that if someone is waking up to an alarm every day that they are not practicing good sleep hygiene, as that would certainly suggest they are building a sleep deficit.

I would like to see her reference on the "expert" who told her that. "IMHO", a blaring alarm in the middle of Final REM is a great way to pretty much guarantee that you'll be in a state of high anxiety for at least a couple hours.

Simply, it sounds like this person's bedtime is too late.

Having finished the book, it would appear that all the information that will become available, has become available. So with that implied caveat (i.e., she has chosen to reveal only what she wants to reveal), it would seem that she is a Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome patient rather than (or at this point, is now also) an insomniac. Poor sleep habits were developed during childhood.

Consequently, having apparently tried none of the treatments to correct DSPS (bright light therapy, chronotherapy, sleep hygiene) it is no surprise that she remains where she is.

By self admission, she never sticks with one plan very long (except medications). She is starved for CBT. She is completely obsessed with sleep, presenting behavior after behavior, yet constantly claims "Yeah, can't let this thing run you!""Gotta control it!"

Her stubbornness to accept and follow proper treatment (as well as refusal to accepted views that differ from hers) borders on Münchausen.

To say her style is "cranky" is generous. I would describe it as a negativity that may be more detrimental than helpful to most people.

[mollete]

Blame and excuses, the worst of which comes early in the book:

Born at 10:30 P.M., I began my day just as everyone else was ending theirs, a pattern that’s persisted.

This one attempts to put the blame on (God, astrology, baseless syllogism, the L&D Unit).

Planting Seeds of Doubt. Gonna be a bumper crop...

Anybody who has seen or read of a child being born knows this implication is absurd. The kid has been working all day (Halloooo... labor? Work?) so the first thing the kid does after she comes flying out is sleep! The day is not beginning, it's over!

"It's not my fault, it's the brain chemicals...."

[mollete]

...a Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome patient ...

Course, if you're trying to sell a book, chances are a title like "Insomniac" will catch a lot more eyes than "DisPis" (or at least, be a little less embarassing if you're seen standing in line for the cash register).

BTW, does anybody call it the "cash register" anymore? Who uses cash nowadays?

Anyway, I happy I'm an Advanced Phase. As Ben Franklin used to say, "Better an AsPis than a DisPis be".

That Ben.

Such a card.

Card.

Wonder where that expression came from.

Credit card?

Probably not.

Greeting card?

Maybe.

Playing card?

Probably, but which one.

Joker's the obvious choice, but why not the Eight of Diamonds?

Hey, one's as good as another.

[pikov22]

That Ben.

Such a card.

Card.

Wonder where that expression came from.

Credit card?

Probably not.

Greeting card?

Maybe.

Playing card?

Probably, but which one.

Joker's the obvious choice, but why not the Eight of Diamonds?

Hey, one's as good as another.

A card is certainly a very individual person, one who stands out from the crowd because he is odd or amusing, because of a clever or audacious nature or because he is one of a kind.

Though it doesn’t seem to have any connection with real card, an association does exist, through playing cards. Once that is assumed, a link with the joker might seem obvious, but — surprisingly — this playing card only entered the pack as an American invention around 1870, after card had already appeared.

On the other hand, figurative expressions based on a playing card as a token of action or manoeuvre or a stratagem or gambit have long existed. In modern usage, we have playing the [something] card, to obtain political advantage through raising a particular contentious issue. We might have a card up our sleeves, meaning we have a plan or resource in reserve. In some situation, we might play our best card or our trump card.

A long way back in history, around 1560, the phrase sure card appeared, for some expedient certain to work. Another of similar meaning was sound card. People were often referred to as good cards, meaning that they were reliable or had abilities or qualities that made them effective in some situation.

It’s relatively new — it’s not recorded before Charles Dickens used it in Sketches By Boz in 1836: “Mr. Thomas Potter whose great aim it was to be considered as a ‘knowing card’”. He used it again in Bleak House in 1852: “Such an old card has this; so deep, so sly, and secret.”

[SleepingUgly]

Interestingly, there is an anectdotal report on an association between Hashimoto's and SBD.

I had searched for this kind of information, but more specifically, I wanted to know if there was an association between Hashimoto's BUT STILL EUTHYROID and sleepiness or other sleep issues. It's clear that with full blown Hashimoto's there can be SDB, but what about Hashimoto's antibodies in the presence of a still functioning thyroid? What does that do to a person?

About to find out. Starting the chapter on thyroid.

Whose chapter? This Gayle person with her DPSD/insomnia?

I once saw a TINY study (like N= 6 or 9 or something absurdly small) referring to an association between Hashimoto's euthyroid & OSA.

[mollete]

Whose chapter? This Gayle person with her DPSD/insomnia?

Correct.

She seems to self-treat her HT. Wonder if that could be be contributing to the the sleep difficulties.

At any rate, her sleep schedule works against the natural circadian rhythms:

[mollete]

Another thing I find particularly odd is that absolutely every detail of her sleep is covered meticulously, at great length, with one notable exception-- sex.

Now, it strikes me that if someone is sleeping 0300 to 0900, but their husband has a "normal" sleep schedule, then there might be a little difficulty getting all the verbs conjugated, if you get my drift. And since associating bed with problems is one of the best ways to generate insomnia, maybe the solution (or at least the problem, anyway) is obvious.

[SleepingUgly]

Whose chapter? This Gayle person with her DPSD/insomnia?

Correct.

She seems to self-treat her HT.

With what? Hashimoto's is a cause of hypothyroidism, but as far as traditional medicine is concerned, you treat an abnormal TSH with synthroid. I guess too much synthroid could make a person hyperthyroid. I really don't know much about this, as I'm still euthyroid.

[SleepingUgly]

What do you make of someone like me, who obviously has significant sleep issues (e.g., sub-optimally treated OSA) but also has worsened functioning when 8 hours of sleep ends at 6:30 or 7am than when it ends at 8 or ideally later? Is that delayed phase?

[zoocrewphoto]

What do you make of someone like me, who obviously has significant sleep issues (e.g., sub-optimally treated OSA) but also has worsened functioning when 8 hours of sleep ends at 6:30 or 7am than when it ends at 8 or ideally later? Is that delayed phase?

I would call it DSPS, but in my own case, I normally live WITH my sleep schedule, so I am not fighting it. For example, the chart above shows body temp vs sleep in a normal person and a dsps person. But it assumes that the dsps person is not sleeping their ideal hours. It even says something about desired wake hours. Why does everybody assume that somebody with dsps can't sleep the hours that work for them? I realize many people WANT to sleep earlier hours for work and schedule. But really, if we adopt a sleep schedule that works for our rhythms, then we are normal, just like a normal hour person. We are simply out of phase with what is considered the normal schedule.

I am dsps, but my sleep AND other circadian rhythms are normal for me. I do get colder at the end of my sleep, like other people do. If I have to wake up at only 4 hours of sleep, I will be freezing cold for half an hour until I get it back up. I can have teeth chattering in 80 degree weather if I get up too early.

Like most people, I get up for work. I go to work. I get home, relax, eat dinner, watch some tv, do laundry, etc. The ONLY thing different about my schedule is the time showing on the clock. People are surprised that I eat dinner when I get home from work. Why wouldn't I? Just because it is after 11pm? Well, I ate breakfast at 2pm. And lunch around 6pm. That's a normal amount of hours between meals.

Back to one of the questions mentioned above. I do feel better when sleeping 8 hours (or even 6 hours) at MY time than I do when I sleep 8 hours at a "normal" time. In that case, my sleep has been adjusted off my schedule, but my other rhythms have not (temp, hormones, digestive, etc). It took me a long time to come up with a backup "normal" eating pattern for my travel weekends. I used to get sick during events because I wasn't eating well. I wasn't used to eating that early in the morning, so I would go without, and then it would catch up with me. But some things I like during the day just don't appeal to me in the morning. I had to learn to make myself eat breakfast at an early time.

[mollete]

Whose chapter? This Gayle person with her DPSD/insomnia?

Correct.

She seems to self-treat her HT.

With what? Hashimoto's is a cause of hypothyroidism, but as far as traditional medicine is concerned, you treat an abnormal TSH with synthroid.

"Porcine" supplements.

[mollete]

What do you make of someone like me, who obviously has significant sleep issues (e.g., sub-optimally treated OSA) but also has worsened functioning when 8 hours of sleep ends at 6:30 or 7am than when it ends at 8 or ideally later? Is that delayed phase?

DSPS is based on bedtime, like about 0200 to 0600, so it doesn't sound like it.

[mollete]

I am dsps...The ONLY thing different about my schedule is the time showing on the clock.

Then arguably, you are not a DSPS, you're a SWSD (Shift Work Sleep Disorder).

[mollete]

... my sleep AND other circadian rhythms are normal for me...

And this is the strongest of points:

A problem is a problem only if it's a problem.

because

DSPD is considered a disorder only if the individual’s preferred schedule interferes substantially with occupational or social functioning

so actually, we are DSPs and ASPs, subgroups of FSs (Funny Sleepers).