Anomaly- Stopped Using my CPAP

[Helmer]

I've used a CPAP for 10 months. I've used it very faithfully. Last night I decided not to use it, that's right- not use it. What happened is what I've either read about heard talked about i.e., that stopping to use the CPAP may in some cases be okay because the person has learned to breath properly after using the CPAP.
I have noticed that while using it I often wake up groggy, with even a slight headache. This morning I felt human, alive, energized. Don't get me wrong the CPAP has been a big plus toward sleeping better.
My question- have any of you experienced a very refreshing night of rest by not using the CPAP after weeks, months, years of using one. Is there any truth to the fact that a person can learn to breath correctly by using a CPAP and then he/she can stop using it?

[greatunclebill]

you have apnea episodes when you are sleeping because your airway closes. how do you think you can learn to breathe thru that? no, don't answer that. in 5 or 10 years tell us how it worked for you. it's called denial. we all went thru it in one form or another.

[sylvie]

you have apnea episodes when you are sleeping because your airway closes. how do you think you can learn to breathe thru that? no, don't answer that. in 5 or 10 years tell us how it worked for you. it's called denial. we all went thru it in one form or another.

greatunclebill, you're killing me. Your answer is spot on.

Kelmer--if I were you, I would get a pulse oximeter and check to see if your oxygen levels are falling during the night. Oxygen desaturation is going to kill your brain. You definitely don't want that.

[zoocrewphoto]

I feel like crap if I skip a night, or even half a night. From what I have read here, most people seem to feel that way.

I would also be very leery of the idea that you can learn to breathe better. Sleep apnea is caused by a variety of things, usually some combination of narrow airway, large uvula, fatty tissue, etc. These are physical issues that cannot be changed by exercising or retraining muscles. It isn't like flexing a muscle. That;s something we can see and do on purpose. Sleep apnea is not where we can see it, and not something we can intentionally change with learning or practice.

I suspect that you felt better because you probably have some discomfort with the cpap machine, so it feels more peaceful and relaxing to sleep without it. I completely understand that as it feels better for me to sleep without it. I am guilty of taking it off in the middle of the night when I get a leak or an itch. And I fall sleep before getting it back on. I feel like I am more comfortable when I sleep that way, and I don't feel noticeably different when I get up. (Usually, this morning I had a headache, but it was worse than normal, I only had 1.2 hours with the machine, I was really bad last night). If I don't get 6-9 hours with the machine, I will feel sluggish, and need an energy drink to get through the day. I also get klutzy again. I can defnitelitly feel a big difference, even if I only skip half a night. Also, if I get a really exceptional night (8 hours plus, with only one wakeup all night), then I feel truly awesome all day. Those are rare for me, but almost intoxicating. I get one really good night a month, and it is enough to keep me striving for that. If I could have a couple of these each week, I would feel awesome on a regular basis.

Welcome to the forum. I hope you stick around. Read a lot of the older posts, ask questions, and hopefully, soon, you will feel better on a regular basis. Then, your "good" without the machine will be in the past, and your new good will show you how bad the old good was.

[Pugsy]

No and no to your questions.

The one time I didn't use my machine last month was because I forgot to bring the hose with me on a trip.
I slept horribly and felt horrible the entire day.

I have never heard of someone "learning to breathe correctly" and being able to go off the machine.
That has to be someone's really wishful thinking. Breathing correctly and keeping the tissues in your airway from collapsing are 2 different things. I have learned a lot in 3 years but I haven't learned how to keep saggy tissue from blocking my airway.
Only way to know would be go get another sleep study without the machine.

Instead maybe there are other reasons why you don't feel so great after a night on the machine. There's a long list of them from less than optimal therapy to factors totally unrelated to sleep apnea itself.

[BlackSpinner]

I've used a CPAP for 10 months. I've used it very faithfully. Last night I decided not to use it, that's right- not use it. What happened is what I've either read about heard talked about i.e., that stopping to use the CPAP may in some cases be okay because the person has learned to breath properly after using the CPAP.
I have noticed that while using it I often wake up groggy, with even a slight headache. This morning I felt human, alive, energized. Don't get me wrong the CPAP has been a big plus toward sleeping better.
My question- have any of you experienced a very refreshing night of rest by not using the CPAP after weeks, months, years of using one. Is there any truth to the fact that a person can learn to breath correctly by using a CPAP and then he/she can stop using it?

So what does your data say regarding your AHI when you use it? Are you having apneas? What kind? When are you having them?

You can't learn to breathe "right" when your airway has collapsed. Simply not going to happen.

[jen4700]

Can you pls post your equipment and mask so that we can help you track down why using the cpap is uncomfortable or "not working"?

[chunkyfrog]

If I fall asleep for as little as ten minutes without my machine; I feel absolutely horrible.
Hunt down whoever told you such a ridiculous thing and cut them out of your will.'
They surely want you dead.

[Lizistired]

Helmer, I believe that if your therapy was so poor that you didn't get any quality sleep for 10 months, sleeping without the machine for a night might be an improvement.
You don't say why you had a sleep study in the first place.
Did you have a study and an in-lab titration?

Too bad you didn't drop in for help 9 1/5 months ago.

[SleepingUgly]

I can't even learn to keep my mouth shut, let alone my airway open.

[Carl LaFong]

I've never slept normally without CPAP. I seriously doubt it's a "learning" issue.

[ems]

I've used a CPAP for 10 months. I've used it very faithfully. Last night I decided not to use it, that's right- not use it. What happened is what I've either read about heard talked about i.e., that stopping to use the CPAP may in some cases be okay because the person has learned to breath properly after using the CPAP.
I have noticed that while using it I often wake up groggy, with even a slight headache. This morning I felt human, alive, energized. Don't get me wrong the CPAP has been a big plus toward sleeping better.
My question- have any of you experienced a very refreshing night of rest by not using the CPAP after weeks, months, years of using one. Is there any truth to the fact that a person can learn to breath correctly by using a CPAP and then he/she can stop using it?

No, I don't think that a person can learn to breath correctly by using a CPAP and then be able to stop using it.

I agree with others that perhaps your therapy isn't where it should be. That's also what I think in reference to myself. I notice little difference if I use the machine or not... maybe a little less fatigued during the day, that's about it. I've decided to try and figure this out. Pugsy suggested I change the pressure a bit and today my doctor totally agreed with her. I'm optimistic about this.

I'm wondering if perhaps this is an issue for you as well. Have you had a sleep study recently? How long has it been since you've seen a sleep specialist?

I'll be interested in what you decide to do.

[Helmer]

Thank you for your many replies, sorry but I do not pretend to address all of your question or recommendation. Nevertheless, they were well said and with a desire to help, thanks. Following some answers to your questions and observations.

1. My first and last sleep study was done in November of 2011. I had 17-19 episodes per hour.

2. I’ve tried three different masks: a) nasal- didn’t work for me even with a jaw strap, b) full mask- Fisher and Paykel #432 was good, c) ResMed Mirage Quattro has been my best. I’ve been very careful not to over tighten the straps, in fact I loosen them as much as possible till it leaks air and then begin to tighten little by little. The MicroFit dial on the ResMed works well, I set it at mid point and after tightening the straps to stop air leak then I adjust the MicroFit dial. All in all the mask works well it’s that I continue to feel groggy and with a slightly headache upon waking up.

3. Why did I wait 9.5 months to ask? Didn’t think about it before, I was just trying very hard to make it work.

4. My sleep apnea seems to be more from head traumas then anything else. I’ve had four rather serious accidents (head injuries) during my 69 years of life. The neurologists said I have scar tissue in my brain, prior to my head injuries I did not have a major problem sleeping, at least my wife did not comment.

5. AHI? Apnea-hypopnea index. Was it the AHI which determined that I had 17-19 episodes per hour? The sleep therapist said I did not have a severe case but still needed the CPAP. My wife has been telling me for the last 3-4 years that I needed to go to a sleep clinic- I did. However did the sleep clinic just want to make money by selling a product if I’m not a severe case (see #6)?

6. My cmH2O setting is 9, don’t know if that's severe, how do you measure what’s severe? Was it the oximeter check oxygen level that determined my cmH2O? I don’t know if the oximeter check was done unless it was part of the sleep clinic. I’ve also adjusted for altitude I live at just over 2800 ft. The machine works at 1500’ increments I have mine at 3000’.

7. About my sleeping habits prior to CPAP, I would jerk, stop breathing, gasp, etc.

I built a free standing stand which comes over the headboard of the bed and swivels left to right giving me lot’s a freedom to move left to right in bed. The air hose comes from over head and does not fall on my face. The stand is adjustable up and down as needed.

Thanks people for your counsel.

[BlackSpinner]

But what is your machine and what is your daily AHI? Are you monitoring your data?

If head trauma is the cause then are you having complex apneas? If so then the machine you have becomes critical. A regular cpap machine does not help with central apnea, it can make it worse in fact.

[Sloop]

The ONLY way you could have somehow had good, restorative sleep is if you had lost a lot of weight in the last nine months. And that alone may not work for everyone .. but it did for me.

When I first started on CPAP, over 20 years ago, I had moderate to severe OSA. In the next year, I lost 65 lbs (diet and exercise) and had another sleep study done at UVA without using CPAP -- no apneas, or if there were any, I was well within whatever is considered normal. I was declared "cured" - as much as one can be cured with this condition. I then went for several years without CPAP and maintained my weight and slept great. But knee issues cropped up and I pretty much stopped my distance walking and the weight came back as well as the OSA.