Zeo and SleepyHead data

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lazer
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Zeo and SleepyHead data

Post by lazer » Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:01 am

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Observations:

I know I laid in bed a bit longer than normal before falling asleep. Partly my fault as I was browsing the forum on my tablet and trying to get the Zeo headband comfortable as it initially was creating some pain on my forehead (think I had it too tight). Also I had to re-adjust my Swift FX since wearing it over top the Zeo for the first time.

I woke up at 3:15 AM after a dream and had to use the bathroom to pee. Also noticed one of my chihuahuas had peed on the damn bed so had to get the soap and towel out to clean that up... Seemed to get right back to sleep fairly quick.

Had another -unrelated- dream somewhere between getting back to sleep and waking up this morning.

According to Zeo, I had plenty of REM but no "deep sleep" recorded.

My first alarm does go off around 6:45AM so the short "wake" time blip along with the others seems accurate to me but I'm not sure about the REM between 6:45 and 7:10 wake up

Comments welcome

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Re: Zeo and SleepyHead data

Post by BasementDwellingGeek » Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:28 am

According to Zeo, I had plenty of REM but no "deep sleep" recorded.
The bar graph would suggest that. But the pie chart says 4% and 17 minutes. The bar graph is based on the 5 minute data and the other on 30 second data?

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Re: Zeo and SleepyHead data

Post by lazer » Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:40 am

BasementDwellingGeek wrote:
According to Zeo, I had plenty of REM but no "deep sleep" recorded.
The bar graph would suggest that. But the pie chart says 4% and 17 minutes. The bar graph is based on the 5 minute data and the other on 30 second data?
I see what you are saying. Not sure what to make of that since this is my first go with Zeo. Maybe the 17 minutes of "deep sleep" was recorded in separate intervals and wasn't enough to plot on the column graph?

Oh, I forgot to add. I posted last nights "SleepyHead" data just to see if anyone noticed any correlation with the Zeo graph and events, ect... I think the time is off a little though on the APAP compared to Zeo because I can see my "wake time" at 3:15 which is correct according to the Zeo time is more like 3:30ish in SleepyHead when I turned it off to go to the bathroom.

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Re: Zeo and SleepyHead data

Post by Lizistired » Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:57 am

Yours is showing REM after awake like mine does. I think their guess is off there.
If you take screen shots and paste them to a document or spreadsheet, you can stretch them to line up the time line. Gotta sync your clocks though.

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Re: Zeo and SleepyHead data

Post by lazer » Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:12 am

Lizistired wrote:Yours is showing REM after awake like mine does. I think their guess is off there.
I was wondering about that. There should be some "light sleep" in there first, correct?
Lizistired wrote:If you take screen shots and paste them to a document or spreadsheet, you can stretch them to line up the time line. Gotta sync your clocks though.
I didn't even think of that with the document/spreadsheet.. Good idea

My APAP time is what is off though and I can't change that so I would have to do it on the Zeo Clock/Alarm and really don't want to throw that off from being actual time as I have it set now per my cellphone clock which is accurate.

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Re: Zeo and SleepyHead data

Post by MaxDarkside » Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:58 am

Yes, the pie chart is based on 30 second data, the bar chart is based on 5 minute. You need more than 2.5 min in one go for the bar to show deep. My deep generally runs between 30 min to 1 hr per night. Last night, for me, not so good, fragmented sleep, 31 minutes. Night before, better, 59 min. of deep.

REM is very similar to wake. Ergo I often see some REM 1st as I fall asleep.

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Re: Zeo and SleepyHead data

Post by robysue » Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:26 am

BasementDwellingGeek wrote:
According to Zeo, I had plenty of REM but no "deep sleep" recorded.
The bar graph would suggest that. But the pie chart says 4% and 17 minutes. The bar graph is based on the 5 minute data and the other on 30 second data?
Yes, the bar graph is aggregated data shown in 5-minute windows and the "time in stage" data is based on the 30-second epochs.

For each five minute window in the bar graph, the final assignment of "sleep Stage" is based on a very straightforward algorithm:
  • If there is any WAKE scored during the 5-minute window, the bar for that window is labeled as WAKE. In other words, one 30-second epoch of WAKE causes the whole five minute window to show up as WAKE.
  • If there is NO WAKE scored during the five minute window, the State assignment is done by "voting" with Winner-take-all. As an example, note that there are ten 30-second epochs that correspond to a particular 5-minute window. Let's suppose that the scoring in one five minute window goes something like this: 3 3 2 2 3 4 3 3 2 4. The five minute period in the bar graph would be labeled as LIGHT (3=Light in the Zeo) because there are five 3's, three 2's and two 4's recorded. But that minute-and-a-half of REM (the 2's) and that minute of DEEP (the 4's) are used in computing the "time in each sleep stage numbers.I'll be honest: I don't know what the zeo does whem there's a tie vote. My guess is that if LIGHT ties ith either DEEP or REM, that LIGHT wins. I have no idea who would be declared the winner of a tie between REM and DEEP.
And also keep in mind that the Zeo is only about 75% accurate according to its makers. (And given the cost of the device and the fact that it only has three rather closely spaced sensors, that's really quite good for accuracy!) And WAKE vs REM is particularly hard to distinguish. But it does mean that you have to use some common sense in interpreting zeo data.

As to how to sync the zeo dat and the SH data: JediMark allows import the thirty-second epoch data directly into SH. You first have to download the Zeo data to your harddrive as a file and then import into SH. Th zeo data uses the Zeo clock's time stamps and the cpap data uses the cpap's time stamp, so syncing the clocks is an issue---particularly for those of us with PR machines. If the clocks are reasonably close, it may just be easier to deal with the horizontal "shift" in the Zeo data the same way S9 users have to deal with shifted data in ResScan (and SH).

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Re: Zeo and SleepyHead data

Post by lazer » Tue Jul 03, 2012 10:01 am

robysue wrote:.....As to how to sync the zeo dat and the SH data: JediMark allows import the thirty-second epoch data directly into SH. You first have to download the Zeo data to your harddrive as a file and then import into SH. Th zeo data uses the Zeo clock's time stamps and the cpap data uses the cpap's time stamp, so syncing the clocks is an issue---particularly for those of us with PR machines. If the clocks are reasonably close, it may just be easier to deal with the horizontal "shift" in the Zeo data the same way S9 users have to deal with shifted data in ResScan (and SH).
Thanks for the responses! And to robysue: Where does one import the Zeo data into SleepyHead exactly? I understand about copying it to the harddrive first but would I just select "Import" in the same way I would be choosing the xPAP data but instead, point it to the Zeo file on harddrive OR is there another part in SleepyHead to do this part?

Any examples of anyone importing Zeo data into SleepyHead (this interests me)?

And what about the "dealing with the horizontal shift in the same way S9 users do" - - I never followed what that exactly entails.

Thanks

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Re: Zeo and SleepyHead data

Post by Lizistired » Tue Jul 03, 2012 10:27 am

I didn't know you could import to sleepyhead either so I'll be listening in.

Rethinking, your clock won't matter if you paste them as long as your graphs both start and stop together, all you have to do is line up the ends.

There is a way to see the 30 second graphs from your zeo data. It's in the forums on their site. Jay sent me the link so I'll see if I can find it. Seems like it was a firmware update and some other applications that you run on your computer. "zeojar" and a "datadecoder" I think. It gives you the blue stepped graphs that you may have seen in other threads.

Found it.
viewtopic/t72950/Decrypt-your-Zeo-Bedsi ... -Naps.html

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Re: Zeo and SleepyHead data

Post by lazer » Tue Jul 03, 2012 10:38 am

Lizistired wrote:I didn't know you could import to sleepyhead either so I'll be listening in.
I found it in "SleepHead" top menubar Under [Data - Import ZEO Data]. Only problem it is asking for a .cvs file and the file we have from the (Zeo) directory off of SDcard is a .dat file...

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Re: Zeo and SleepyHead data

Post by Lizistired » Tue Jul 03, 2012 10:45 am

lazer wrote:
Lizistired wrote:I didn't know you could import to sleepyhead either so I'll be listening in.
I found it in "SleepHead" top menubar Under [Data - Import ZEO Data]. Only problem it is asking for a .cvs file and the file we have from the (Zeo) directory off of SDcard is a .dat file...
You still have to upload to zeo.com and then download the .cvs file. I think it's an "export data" button.

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Re: Zeo and SleepyHead data

Post by lazer » Tue Jul 03, 2012 10:47 am

Lizistired wrote:
lazer wrote:
Lizistired wrote:I didn't know you could import to sleepyhead either so I'll be listening in.
I found it in "SleepHead" top menubar Under [Data - Import ZEO Data]. Only problem it is asking for a .cvs file and the file we have from the (Zeo) directory off of SDcard is a .dat file...
You still have to upload to zeo.com and then download the .cvs file. I think it's an "export data" button.
Was just getting ready to post... I googled Zeo+cvs file and found that Succesfully uploaded to "SleepyHead". Now where to see the data... Guess I have to poke around in SleepyHead preferences or something...

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Re: Zeo and SleepyHead data

Post by lazer » Tue Jul 03, 2012 10:56 am

Found a possible solution here ---> viewtopic/t76992/viewtopic.php?p=702969#p702969

Just tried it but still not seeing the data after resaving .cvs and reimporting to SleepyHead. It's lunch time... I'll investigate further in a bit.

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Re: Zeo and SleepyHead data

Post by Lizistired » Tue Jul 03, 2012 11:09 am

Yeah, I forgot about having to manipulate the file to get that one cell of data then copy it, convert it, create the graph .....
The other thing I found was that when I had to 'convert text to columns' if it took more than 1024 columns, it would drop the excess data. (I was using openoffice).
It was important enough once that I made 2 graphs by deleting leading data that I had already graphed, and then pasted them together.

I guess that's why I haven't used it for awhile. I doesn't matter how good or bad my sleep is if all I do is spend the rest of my day analyzing it.

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Re: Zeo and SleepyHead data

Post by lazer » Tue Jul 03, 2012 11:25 am

Lizistired wrote:Yeah, I forgot about having to manipulate the file to get that one cell of data then copy it, convert it, create the graph .....
The other thing I found was that when I had to 'convert text to columns' if it took more than 1024 columns, it would drop the excess data. (I was using openoffice).
It was important enough once that I made 2 graphs by deleting leading data that I had already graphed, and then pasted them together.

I guess that's why I haven't used it for awhile. I doesn't matter how good or bad my sleep is if all I do is spend the rest of my day analyzing it.
Oh I agree with the last sentence. I just like to get an idea on what's going on

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