Everyones Take on seeing a counselor?

[KimberlyM]

Why don't you try Swift FX or Swift LT nasal pillows? That would eliminate the claustrophobic feeling. I worried that nasal pillows would feel like a strong force of air up my nose, but in truth, I sometimes have to pull them away to make sure the air is on. My guess is, a counselor would work with you to desensitize yourself to the mask. That is something you can do on your own. If panic attacks are a regular part of your life outside of CPAP, that is a different story.

[BlackSpinner]

Not sure I can allow myself to be in control of another person, so not sure hypnosis might work, but its worth looking into.

It doesn't work like stage hypnosis, it is more like guided imagery. You do not give over control to this person, any more then you give over control to a travel guide.

Most good therapists use a combination of techniques.

I started going to one over a year ago to get my emotional eating in control. I learned a lot about my self delving into that. I could have done it by my self, I know the techniques, but the discipline of showing up for the appointment and the knowledge that she was there ready with a box of tissues allowed me to go much deeper and take more risks and work faster.

[Cindy Lou Who]

Oh Kahfree....what a bummer! I'm currently seeing a councilor who uses EFT (Emotional Freedom Technique) and TAT (Tapas Acupressure Technique). On my first appointment with her in 2009 she introduced me to EFT and I use it whenever and where ever I am triggered. Yes, I can do an abbreviated version of EFT in public and not get stared at. That way triggers can be immediately addressed. I can do EFT and TAT in bed while having the headgear on, but it is easier with it off.

Below is the link for TATlife.org that will take you directly to the "how to" of this technique that works very well for me. I finish a session feeling deep calm and peace.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/11152231/Howt ... TatLifecom

Perhaps you can find a councilor that also is a hosehead. They certainly would have additional understanding of what you experience. The woman I work with began CPAP the same month I did...we had a good laugh over that one. I feel we understand each other better because we have that in common.

Good Luck! I pray you find your solution very soon!
Wishing you good sleep tonight...
Cindy

[robysue]

Kahfree,

Cindy Lou Who has mentioned an important idea for you to consider if you do decide to go to a counselor when she writes:

Perhaps you can find a councilor that also is a hosehead.

I haven't the foggiest idea how you determine if a councilor is a hosehead or not. But with the severe levels you're beginning to go to in order to avoid bedtime, my guess is that you may very well have a difficult time accepting good advice from someone who hasn't walked the walk so to speak.

The avoiding bed to avoid the hose is also creating problems you might not be aware of with your sleep hygiene. It sounds like you are now associating your bed with fear and anxiety (and the mask) instead of sleep. And that's tough to deal with---the beginning of my insomnia was a reluctance and avoidance of going to bed---not so much out of fear or anxiety as anger and the fact that simply putting on the CPAP mask left me WIDE AWAKE like a triple shot of espresso during the early days. And I'm wondering, when you do put the CPAP mask on near bedtime and start watching tv in an effort to fall asleep, do you find that the mask winds up making you MORE AWAKE, in addition to being more afraid and or more anxious?

Because if one of the problems that simply putting on the mask is waking you up, you've got to make sure that everything around you when you put that mask on is telling your body it is time for sleep. That's where looking at sleep hygiene might come into play.

And you said it yourself in another post: You need to find a way to create a habit of going to bed with the mask on. Focus on that first. If you yank it off in your sleep, don't worry about that yet. For now, you need to simply try to get to the point where you can train yourself to always put the mask on as part of your daily bedtime ritual. And you need the rest of that daily bedtime ritual to be soothing and sleep inducing.

[Kahfree]

How old are your kids?

27, 26 and 23. Why?

Just curious because you look too young to have kids that old, but you keep referring to your kids helping you in various ways. (I was thinking, "If Kahfree can get her 5-year-old to help her put her mask on, why can't I get mine to clean up the toys without being told?")

Awwwww so nice of you to make such a nice compliment. I have been told I look young and that my daughter looks like my sister. Thank you...I had my daughter at age 20. She will be 28 this Feb.

by the way, the complaint you have on not getting your child to clean up the toys is a common one shared by many. I run an at home daycare and the kids all pick up the toys, put their cups on the counter and put away their chairs when done. Why do they do it for me and not their parents? Because I am NOT their parent and the old saying..."Monkey see monkey do" all the kids do it so they all do. The ages I Have are mostly 2 and 3 year olds. Kids always do things for other people...mine were the same way when they were small.

[Kahfree]

If I've gotten this right, you didn't have these issues until CPAP and it's specific to using CPAP? If that's correct, then the first place I'd start is here, to see if any of these mental health professionals who specialize in sleep are in your neck of the woods:

http://www.absm.org/bsmspecialists.aspx

The MDs may just be sleep medicine docs, but the PhDs may be psychologists who have specialized in sleep (and the PsyDs are). If they specialized in sleep, they should run into this issue all the time and be very familiar with how to handle it.

If not, the next place I'd look is for a behavioral or cognitive behavioral therapist. You need desensitization techniques, and that falls under the realm of behavioral therapy. An insight-oriented, or other approach, will not be nearly as helpful for this specific problem.

Yes you are right, except for the panic attack on an airplane once. However, feeling like I cant breath has ALWAYS been an issue of mine and I never wear any top that might go to my throat and when I lived in New England, I never wore scarfs, turtle necks, etc. I always have to have my face and neck area clear of any thing that constricts. I have always told the joke to friends and family that if reincarnation is real, then in my past life I died by suffocation somehow since I have such an issue with it. LOL I will look up that site you listed. Thank you.

[Kahfree]

Hypnosis

I thought it was like what I have seen in shows. LOL sorry...since I am not familiar with the use of Hypnosis, I guess I just assumed that its all like that.

The avoiding bed to avoid the hose is also creating problems you might not be aware of with your sleep hygiene. It sounds like you are now associating your bed with fear and anxiety (and the mask) instead of sleep.

(yes, I am)

And I'm wondering, when you do put the CPAP mask on near bedtime and start watching tv in an effort to fall asleep, do you find that the mask winds up making you MORE AWAKE, in addition to being more afraid and or more anxious?[/quote} I can lie there for a bit, or at least I was able to lie there and then fall asleep. It does not make me more awake, but I feel more "on alert" as though I need to make sure its not leaking, etc.


[quote}And you said it yourself in another post: You need to find a way to create a habit of going to bed with the mask on. Focus on that first. If you yank it off in your sleep, don't worry about that yet. For now, you need to simply try to get to the point where you can train yourself to always put the mask on as part of your daily bedtime ritual. And you need the rest of that daily bedtime ritual to be soothing and sleep inducing.

Your right and I know that I need to find a habit that works. Well, it was working. I am so confused because I do not know what went wrong. I started out good, not great or a master at it, but good.


I also did walk around today with the mask on and got a coffee, talked to the cat, etc. Then, I had to take it off as one can not drink coffee with it on. LOL.

I am so happy for the support I have found here. Tonight is another night...I will try. Good night all.....

Kelly

[zsnoreking]

Why don't you try Swift FX or Swift LT nasal pillows? That would eliminate the claustrophobic feeling. I worried that nasal pillows would feel like a strong force of air up my nose, but in truth, I sometimes have to pull them away to make sure the air is on. My guess is, a counselor would work with you to desensitize yourself to the mask. That is something you can do on your own. If panic attacks are a regular part of your life outside of CPAP, that is a different story.

I think Kimberly is on to something. I have just reentered the tethered world of hose-headedness. After a 5 year hiatus and much trepidation about having to get back on the machine; I had to give it one last shot; for my own sake. But alas, much to my delight (and dismay at not starting back sooner), I've been back in the game for 4 days now. The main reasons for my non-compliance before were panic attacks. Waking up in the middle of the night most assuredly expecting to fight off a person holding a pillow over my face. But it was the continuous air flowing into my nostrils that was preventing me from inhaling. Kinda like sticking your head out of the car window when it's going real fast and trying to breath. That, along with rainout, pretty much did me in the first go round.

Trying to hearken back to the first fitting, I don't remember my DME giving me different choices of masks to try out so I was given nasal pillows; probably due to a question that I answered about claustrophobia on a questionnaire. In my naivete, I didn't know that I had a choice. The pillows felt OK, but they irritated my nose a little bit. The parts that fit up into the naves were more oval-like cylinders and were somewhat soft. I could have lived with them.

Fast forward to the other day when I went in to get my machine. I went in armed with tons of questions; had done a ton of reading, and I felt more prepared to make a more educated decision this time. My Rx is 9cm. Since I had claustrophobic issues the first time, I tried all the different types of masks. In comparing the masks, I noticed that there seemed to be a huge pressure difference. I felt myself almost having to make an effort to inhale using the nasal and full faced masks; but the pillows put the full force of the air right where I needed it to get the full benefit of my therapy. But the remarkable thing that I noticed, was that there was absolutely no effort in exhaling or feeling like I was breathing my own exhaust on the next breath. The EPR technology is brilliant! The nasal and the full masks still gave me the feeling that I was a jet fighter; suiting up for combat. So I settled on the pillows again. The new styles are head and shoulders above the ones I had before. The materials are much more soft and tactile friendly. Plus the nose pieces are of a conical shape that wedge into the naves as opposed to jamming all the way up your nose. So it came down the the Swift LT and the Opus 360. The Swift felt heavier, a little more cumbersome, and the exhaust was markedly noisier. When I put the Opus on, it was feather light and I couldn't even tell that it was on my head. The machine and mask were so quiet that I couldn't tell that it was on until I put my hand in front of the exhaust. Well. To make a short story long , I think you should give the pillows a shot. I can't even tell I have mine on. Couple that with the unbelievable quietness of the machines, and the EPR technology--these could give you the greatest chance for success. We are all pulling for you! You can do it!!

Bruce

[mars]

Hi Kahfree

First of all you should know having a job title of counsellor does not mean that person is a good counsellor.

A good counsellor being someone who helps you to handle better, perhaps overcome, the debilitating emotions you are describing, so you can better handle your problems, and make life-enhancing decisions.

From reading your posts I would guess that self-talk has a part to play in you getting anxious. This is best addressed by a Rational-Emotive Therapist or a CB Therapist. Or a cheaper way, if you can make it work, is by following the ideas in a book such as " Overcoming Worry and Fear" by Paul Hauck - look near the bottom of the page -

http://www.stressgroup.com/selfhelpresources.html

Also, academic qualifications are no guide to how good a counsellor is. The woman or man volunteer counsellor at the local Health Agency may be better than the guy with a Ph.D.

The most important thing a counsellor should have is "heart". Techniques to help a person move along are necessary, but the vulnerability to feel the other persons pain, and stay focused on helping that person move forward, are equally necessary.

Sometimes childhood trauma has to be explored, and resolved. Experiential therapy would be my choice to deal with this, but there are many kinds. I prefer this approach -

http://www.marriagecpr.com/experiential.html

Whilst you may not want to see someone who is in their dotage, life experience can be important. As I saw once in a training video (slightly edited) -

1st Person: I prefer the older counsellor, she has been around a while and understands my problems better

and

2nd Person: I prefer the younger counsellor, she is just out of training, and knows all the latest stuff.

You could always go to both, and check them out. There is nothing wrong in seeing more than one counsellor at the same time. Those who are against it are devaluing your common sense.

It is better to see someone who is helps you "get" better, rather than seeing someone who helps you "feel" better. Unconditional positive regard is good, but without the tools to move forward, you might as well chat with your friendly next door neighbour.

Group therapy can also be a good way forward, provided it has a good leader and is active-directive. Give any leaderless gestalt oriented group a wide berth.

Good luck

Mars

Edited once for spelling and clarity.

[rosiefrosie]

I have always told the joke to friends and family that if reincarnation is real, then in my past life I died by suffocation somehow since I have such an issue with it. LOL I will look up that site you listed. Thank you.

I had to laugh, as I was reading your post, that same thought went through my mind. I think that if you can find someone to help with your anxiety it would be most helpfull. I also think you should try nasal pillows to see if this helps lessen you anxiety about wearing a mask. Good Luck!

rosie

[goldman1948]

Try a sleep weaver mask.
I have recomended it to several friends and they love it.
You can scratch your nose with it on and won't break the seal.

Bruce...

[NightMonkey]

Why don't you try Swift FX or Swift LT nasal pillows? That would eliminate the claustrophobic feeling. I worried that nasal pillows would feel like a strong force of air up my nose, but in truth, I sometimes have to pull them away to make sure the air is on. My guess is, a counselor would work with you to desensitize yourself to the mask. That is something you can do on your own. If panic attacks are a regular part of your life outside of CPAP, that is a different story.

Why don't you try Swift FX or Swift LT nasal pillows? That would eliminate the claustrophobic feeling. I worried that nasal pillows would feel like a strong force of air up my nose, but in truth, I sometimes have to pull them away to make sure the air is on. My guess is, a counselor would work with you to desensitize yourself to the mask. That is something you can do on your own. If panic attacks are a regular part of your life outside of CPAP, that is a different story.

I think Kimberly is on to something.
...

Try a sleep weaver mask.
I have recomended it to several friends and they love it.
You can scratch your nose with it on and won't break the seal.

Bruce...

Wow! Three people with very basic bad suggestions in one thread!

Surely you looked at Kahfree's equipment profile and saw that she is using a full face mask? Full face masks are prescribed to patients who mouthbreathe. If Kahfree switches to a nasal interface and mouthbreathes, then she will have much bigger problems than she has now.

Dudes don't lead people down a disastrous detour on the road to good CPAP therapy!

[zsnoreking]

NightMonkey. I don't think anyone is trying to lead her down a path of ill health. Due to seasonal allergies and a propensity to sinus infections, I too, am a mouth breather when sleeping. I find that my nasal pillows actually suction the back of my throat closed, so that if my mouth comes open at night, there is still a seal in the back of my throat. Because of the force the pillows provide, it takes some physical effort to break that seal. I'm just trying to encourage the lady and assuage her fears and give her the best chance at compliance. I don't want her to abandon her therapy for 5 years like I did; thinking that there was no way I could ever do CPAP because of the claustrophobia.

I see that you have 4 different machines and 6 different masks; so it looks as though you are still searching for the right combination to help you in your journey. Why can't Kahfree do the same? No where in her posts does it say that she is a mouth breather and has been prescribed a full mask. As I alluded in my post, the first time I went to my DME 5 years ago, I only had one choice of mask. Maybe it was from my doctor's prescription which was written from the sleep study. I did prefer the pillows when I had my study; therefore my prescription may have been written that way. Not because of medical necessity, but because of my preference. No one here who has suggested pillows wants to see her fail, and suggesting pillows is just that--a suggestion. She would have the machine's telemetry to tell her if the pillows were providing her with adequate therapy or not anyway. So why not try? Nothing is written in stone. Especially when health and mental well being are concerned.

Bruce

[SleepingUgly]

Due to my own sleepiness and related cognitive issues, I've had trouble assimilating your issues, Kahfree. Perhaps you could get better help from people if you start one thread, and as succinctly as possible, outline your issues in one thread (bullet format is fine). That way all your issues will be laid out in one place, rather than having unrelated threads and people like me forget what your other issues are, some of which may relate to one another.

Of course all the things Mars says about therapists are true and just because someone has a particular theoretical orientation doesn't mean that they will be good fit for you. That said, you are describing issues that are the bread and butter of behavior therapy. So I encourage you once again to look for a sleep psychologist (from that link I sent), who, if they are actually practicing in sleep, will be dealing constantly with issues of insomnia (the bedroom/bedtime/CPAP as a conditioned stimuli, which is the problem you are describing), desensitization to CPAP, etc. This is a run of the mill problem with fairly straight forward fixes. If you can't find one of those near you, then I encourage you to look for someone who does behavior therapy and tell them on the phone that you need help with desensitization, relaxation techniques, etc. and ask if they do that. Then see if that person is a good interpersonal fit.

[secret agent girl]

.