Im a "stomach sleeper"! What Mask should I use?

[Calist]

In another thread someone said that I am calist. That is news to me. I do find it ironic that I am also called a troll. The definition of troll is someone who intentionally disrupts a community by posting provocative messages. I was not trying to be provocative. In fact, I thought that simply relaying some basic medical information was a responsible and helpful thing to do. But you will all be happy to know that if I am viewed as disrupting your community then I will take that as my cue to exit. I have a feeling though that calist will stay around, as he does not seem to be affected by your blasting of him. And the poster in another thread that said calist and I are the same of course has no proof but presented that as fact. Feel free to check my ip address. My message to calist would be that this is apparently an inappropriate forum for his efforts. I wish you all good sleep health. And to the one individual who privately welcomed me to this forum I am especially thankful.

No no! Don't leave. Listen, when that guy said I was you I was kinda flattered. You are very articulate and not inflammatory in the least. The reason he thought I was you is because we were both using the same terminology like 'Medicine' and 'Science' and 'Medical Science'. I know what you mean however that this might be an inappropriate forum for my efforts but I hate watching people run in circles like this. I was actually thinking of writing a sleep science manifesto right here on this forum and I was kinda hoping you could double check it when I was done.

Anyway, let me welcome you as well if you haven't already left!

[greg-g]

An interesting post.
I'm a stomach sleeper and use a Swift Fx with the hose over my head, and an air diffuser so the exhaust air doesn't make a noise on the sheets or pillow. I also use a very thin pillow and find the set-up very comfortable.
I agree with the above that if you use a CPAP machine you should be titrated on your back as this is the worst case scenario.
As you can see below I use a ResMed S9 Autoset with the pressure set to 6 - 20.
From studying my readouts, I observe that for about 75 % of the night my pressure is below 7. For the rest of the time the pressure rises to about 10 if I'm on my front, and 14 if I'm on my back. As a consequence I spent most of the night on my front with the lower resulting pressure that I find far more comfortable, less problems with leaks, and less air ingestion.
I'm not in the medical game, but I don't think my comments contradict any of the previous discussion.
Need a comfortable night?, get an APAP and sleep in your front.

[kramus]

Respiratory Distress
Positions
Normal respiration
Complications
Solutions
Questions?

Dear Guest.
Thank you for your detailed information.
I hope you stay around (register even) and continue to provide valuable and informative contributions to the forum (a place for open discussion

[countrysdad]

Ok... I am the original poster of this question, which has gotten way way off the topic... the question NEVER was "what is the best sleep position?"; the question was "what is the best mask to use for a stomach sleeper?" While there has been a lot of great discussion here, I would appreciate it if this would get back "on topic".

Thanks

[Sillyme]

Dear Guest.
Thank you for your detailed information.
I hope you stay around (register even) and continue to provide valuable and informative contributions to the forum (a place for open discussion

I like the idea that professionals are tuning in. The major complaint here seems to be that we are not being listened to or taken seriously. Our experience and 'anecdotal evidence' is valuable. We know what works in the real world - outside the lab. Your education and experience are also valuable. Actually, none of the people who have been paid to help me have taken as much time as you have to explain anything. I don't think we need to be hostile to those we disagree with. This a great chance to educate each other.

[countrysdad]

An interesting post.
I'm a stomach sleeper and use a Swift Fx with the hose over my head, and an air diffuser so the exhaust air doesn't make a noise on the sheets or pillow. I also use a very thin pillow and find the set-up very comfortable.
I agree with the above that if you use a CPAP machine you should be titrated on your back as this is the worst case scenario.
As you can see below I use a ResMed S9 Autoset with the pressure set to 6 - 20.
From studying my readouts, I observe that for about 75 % of the night my pressure is below 7. For the rest of the time the pressure rises to about 10 if I'm on my front, and 14 if I'm on my back. As a consequence I spent most of the night on my front with the lower resulting pressure that I find far more comfortable, less problems with leaks, and less air ingestion.
I'm not in the medical game, but I don't think my comments contradict any of the previous discussion.
Need a comfortable night?, get an APAP and sleep in your front.

greg-g, you're post is very helpful....thanks

[M.D.Hosehead]

countrysdad,

I apologize for my contribution to hijacking your thread.

I suggest you consider the Sleepweaver.

https://www.cpap.com/productpage/circad ... dgear.html

It doesn't work for everyone, but some are very pleased with it, and there's very little $ at risk, because they offer a 100% refund if you send it back.

Guest,

I sincerely appreciate the time and effort that was obviously required to compose the long, explanatory post (on p. 3). I agree with others who hope you register and become a regular member, as you obviously have valuable experience to offer. I'd be happy to pursue this topic in another thread, rather than continue to hijack the OP's thread.

The Guest.

I can see that choice of words was the origin of the misunderstanding. It's easy for that to happen when everything is being communicated in writing.

Guest/calist,

We know you're the same person, because the forum software has made the identification.

The Guest,

You are the same person as Guest/calist, because you referred to Guest's post in the first person.

I can see that the way I worded this explanation was confusing. I used the wrong wording. I will clarify:

Can you see that there's dishonesty involved when you post under different names? And that therefore readers can't fully trust what you say? Why can't you just post as who you are and become a regular member?


And for whichever of your identities that asked, yes I have run PSG's.

[countrysdad]

Thanks M.D.

[LoQ]

Respiratory Distress is a mechanism in which the brain realizes that it is running out of oxygen. It does this not by examining oxygen molecules but instead by counting carbon dioxide molecules. If you have 3% c02 (or carbon Dioxide) then the brain assumes you have 97% oxygen. If you have 7% c02 then it assumes you have 93% oxygen.... and so on.

3% of what? O2 (oxygen) binds to hemoglobin. CO2 (carbon dioxide) dissolves in the blood. They are not competing for the same resource. Perhaps you are confusing CO2 with CO (carbon monoxide), which DOES bind to the hemoglobin and is competing for the same resource.

This is actually how people die from gas leaks in their home as well. 7% c02, 90% Methane and 3% Oxygen looks perfectly normal to the human brain because it is only counting carbon dioxide. If however the carbon dioxide climbs above 12% (88% Oxygen) then the brain will begin the process of initiated the Respiratory Distress mechanism.

Even people without medical training know that the reason a person dies in this situation is not because the CO2 is at a normal value, and therefore they are not stimualated to breathe enough. The reason this poor soul dies is because there isn't enough oxygen in the air, no matter how hard he breathes!

Additionally, in the presence of low concentrations of oxygen such as you present here, methane is toxic, though I am not sure of the mechanism.

Did they teach you this stuff in breathing school, or are you just making it up as you go along?

[Robespierre]

I think that if what Calist and The Guest (assuming they are not one and the same) are trying to tell us were true, Muffy/NotMuffy/SAG would have pointed these things out years ago and it would long have been common knowledge here.

[torontoCPAPguy]

It is true enough. The breathing mechanism is indeed triggered by the level of CO2 in the bloodstream - I get the distinct feeling that infusion of O2 into my APAP line triggers something with my pulmonologist wanting to get a baseline for my current arterial blood gasses (I gather not a pleasant withdrawal). CO2 levels have indeed been mentioned in discussion.

[xenablue]

I've been a stomach sleeper for as long as I can remember. Not only does sleeping on my back give me a backache, but my rather ample chest threatens to suffocate me - even side-sleeping tends to 'tip' me into a semi side/stomach position.

I don't know what school Guest went to, but not once did the sleep tech, DME sleep specialists, my neuro or anyone here say sleeping on your back is the goal, and preferable.

Anyway... to the OP - I DO sleep on my stomach, even though I start on my side. I use a Mirage Liberty, which is pretty successful, but I think partly due to the CPAP pillow I bought, which has the "C" cut out on both sides. I have the mask pretty firmly on my face to avoid movement and for the most part it works fine.

From all the suggestions you'll see here, it's still going to be a matter of you doing some experimentation to see what works for you. Initially I was using some very small throw pillows in different configurations to see what would work best for me.

Cheers,
xena

[Emmy1]

... when the CPAP is set at the right pressure using a nasal mask, the air pressure forces the mouth to stay closed for almost all people. Therefore there is no need to cover the mouth as with a full face mask.

This statement contradicts the laws of physics.

Pressure inside the mouth will NOT help the mouth stay closed. Pressure from a CPAP machine, when using a nasal mask, can only force the mouth OPEN, not closed.

Using a full face mask equilizes this pressure, reducing the tendency for the mouth to fall open in relaxation and deeper sleep, and it allows those that need to mouth breath to do so freely.

It also helps when your nose is stuffed up with a cold or allergies

Getting back to your question, I too would suggest the Sleep Weaver mask.

[torontoCPAPguy]

Jeez, I wish some of the ignorant comments would stay off the board. A nasal mask at ANY pressure will not keep one's mouth closed and prevent mouth breathing. Period. End of story unless you read fairy tales.

A FULL FACE MASK is ideal for side/stomache sleepers as (a) it permits the 'smooshing' of one's face into the pillow (no need for any special pillows although I hear they do help some; and (b) it EQUALIZES the pressure being presented, regardless of nasal breathing OR mouth breathing and maintains an open airway. I wear a nasal mask only when I am in the family room an may nod off watching TV these days.... with a spare CPAP. In the bedroom in generall ALWAYS use a full face mask and the one that I have been using and having success with is the Mirage Quattro. It takes a bit to get it sitting right and adjusted tension wise but my leak rate is always low.

A few months back I introduced O2 into the APAP line and it keeps my SPO2 above 90% during REM sleep and I generally have been starting to get pretty good nights of sleep. Unfortunately, a new affliction has reared its ugly head in the form of Atrial Fibrillation and I am dealing with that right now. No idea where it came from. Could have been a virus or dental surgery but we are hoping I will revert to sinus rhythm on my own, else it's blood thinners forever and an attempt to reset the heart to sinus rhythm using the paddles, then drugs the rest of my days. Six percent of the population have it and over 75 percent never know due to less than optimal medical care. I have a doctor for everything and they share everything. My last cardiogram at the GP? Sent off to the other doctors including cardio and bingo.... more tests and I have atrial fib. It kills early and suddenly by producing and breaking loose blood clots which get stuck in the brain (stroke) or heart arteries (heart attack) or leg arteries (thrombosis). Pays to keep a close watch. Now I sleep but suffer fatigue from the blood thinners and atrial fib. Can't win. Anyway, full face mask for stomache sleepers. I'm going to make a list of the other masks mentioned and try them.

[torontoCPAPguy]

I use the Swift LT nasal pillow which works pretty well on my side and stomach almost no leaks but I am going to try a FFM this month because I am starting to get fall allergies and a full face mask will allow me to breath even when my nose is clogged.

As for the back side stomach thing, I have severe apnea, 90 AHI on my back 54 on my side. I have APAP set 10/14. Every time I sleep on my back the pressure is between 13 and 14 and my AHI goes up to 4.5 or higher with 2-3 or more centrals per hr. When I sleep on my side or stomach my pressure sits between 10 and 11 and my AHI sits around 1.5 with centrals at .5 per hr. or lower. I have talked with my sleep Dr. twice now and he has never even suggested that I sleep on my back. He also suggested a chinstrap to keep my mouth shut because it has a tendency to blow open. Now with the chinstrap no more mouth leaks. I know that is empirical data but from what I have read this is more of the norm than the exception.

I don't personally deal with sleep techs that have spent a year at ITT tech online or whatever - not sufficient medical care for my wants. So I deal with an MD specializing in sleep disorders, in especially OSA (as it appears to be most common). I also deal with a pulmonologist, a respirologist, a cardiologist, and so on. I think the last 'technician' that I allowed to touch me was a nurse to draw blood and a technician to poke me with allergens to test for sensitivities (I'm allergic to everything from dust to pinecones). The only other technicians I will deal with are for my TV set and furnace. I WANT A DOCTOR. (Now, you have to grant that the doctor has a technician make the connections of the EEG, etc., but I want A DOCTOR discussing with me what the issues are). It's like the hearing aid racket where you need to have your hearing aid programmed by a guy that charges $1500 when you can get the hearing aids, already programmed, name brand, from offshore for $400. Just try and get a copy of the results of your hearing tests!