Techniques for Side Sleeping

[GoodGuy]

After 4 months I continue to make progress on CPAP (actually APAP) . I was a long time back sleeper and have to a large part made the transition to side sleeping but still wake up at times on my back. If I could reduce the back sleeping further I suspect I could reduce my A.H.I. further.
I've not tried the tennis ball route and from reading posts here I'm not sure that's recommended. Can anyone help with the current thinking for recommendations and techniques ? Thanks !

[roster]

How about the the SonaPillow, http://www.sonapillow.com/pillow.htm.

Particularly note the comment "......... also has a training arm sling on either side."

I haven't tried it myself but it looks promising.

I did try the tennis balls and could not tolerate them.

[TerryB]

My theory is an alternate to yours.
Increase you back time and put your machine in CPAP mode and you may eliminate the Obstructive apneas. The reason the AHI goes up on your back is the APAP has to sense the apnea and deal with it. The CPAP pressure setting is designed to not allow an obstructive apnea to occur.

All of this need re-thinking if you problem is really centrals.

TerryB

[GoodGuy]

No. I haven't tried that particular pillow and it doesn't appear members have had experience with it. It certainly has some strong claims.
I did try the PAPillow as well as memory foam pillows and I couldn't tell a difference.
I suspect someone here has the answer because I always find the answer here ! No kidding.

Thanks for your response !

[Sleepless_in_LM]

My theory is an alternate to yours.
Increase you back time and put your machine in CPAP mode and you may eliminate the Obstructive apneas. The reason the AHI goes up on your back is the APAP has to sense the apnea and deal with it. The CPAP pressure setting is designed to not allow an obstructive apnea to occur.

All of this need re-thinking if you problem is really centrals.

I would love to hear some feedback on this. I recently switched to an auto. If I can stay on my side all night (getting much better now that the neck surgery is healing) I can keep my ahi below 2 and my 90% pressure around 8.5. If I roll onto my back, the auto has to jump way up to at least 13 and sometimes much higher. Isn't it better for me to "train" myself to sleep on my side then subject myself to a pressure of 13+ all night??

And that pillow looks promising. Has anyone tried it?

As for the original question, I have found that placing a pillow between my legs helps not only with back/knee pain, but makes it more difficult to roll over onto my back. I also sleep "hugging" a pillow to support my upper arm and stop in from falling asleep. Again, when the covers are on top, it makes it harder to roll over if you are hugging a pillow. Both of these were recomended to me by my physical therapist and seem to have helped a great deal with both comfort and keeping me on my side.

[Guest]

My theory is an alternate to yours.
Increase you back time and put your machine in CPAP mode and you may eliminate the Obstructive apneas. The reason the AHI goes up on your back is the APAP has to sense the apnea and deal with it. The CPAP pressure setting is designed to not allow an obstructive apnea to occur.

This is what my sleep doc told me, when I asked his opinion on APAPs. His remark was that "they let too many events occur" while operating at lower pressures because they're unable to increase the pressure fast enough, whereas CPAP at one's titrated pressure prevents essentially all events and doesn't even let any of them get _started_ in the first place.

And it's cheaper, and you can check for leaks very easily and immediately (since the pressure you get initially is the same pressure you'll get all night). And, many people suffer arosals or mini-awakenings due to the pressure changing under APAP, which is not a problem with CPAP.

Some/all of these factors are why a lot of people do better under CPAP than under APAP.

[Sleepless_in_LM]

Hey from the SonnaPillow website:

Using a body pillow to hug or put between the legs assists in maintaining the side sleeping position.

Maybe my physical therapist reads their stuff

[KimberlyinMN]

This is a slightly humorous response, but try sleeping with a dog in your bed. We "used to" sleep with two small dogs and a cat in our king size bed. Once I found my side position to sleep in, I would have all three stuck up against me like Velcro. There's no way a person could change position with the creatures stuck against your back, thighs and calves. Now that we aren't letting them sleep with us, I have woken up sleeping on my back with my arms overhead. (And that is dang cold when the room is only 60 degrees.)

Although you could simulate the creatures by having pillows wedged along your back as you are side sleeping. That would make it more difficult to turn onto your back.

Kimberly

[GoodGuy]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. Terry,you may a point regarding CPAP versus APAP and back sleeping. When I first started, a pressure of only 5 bothered me so an APAP was great. At this point my range is 8-10 and I was titrated at 10 but my 90% is 9. My A.H.I. is 1-2 but can be 3 sometimes which it was last night,hence my post. I may set it at a CPAP of 9 and see the results and gradually move it up from there if need be.

I have used pillows for hugging,between the legs,and behind me to discourage rolling over on my back. I always wake up and the pillows are "somewhere far,far way " : ) But having said that I am going to keep trying to use them in combination with a CPAP approach since it can't hurt and might well help.

Other ideas ?

[Goofproof]

My theory is an alternate to yours.
Increase you back time and put your machine in CPAP mode and you may eliminate the Obstructive apneas. The reason the AHI goes up on your back is the APAP has to sense the apnea and deal with it. The CPAP pressure setting is designed to not allow an obstructive apnea to occur.

This is what my sleep doc told me, when I asked his opinion on APAPs. His remark was that "they let too many events occur" while operating at lower pressures because they're unable to increase the pressure fast enough, whereas CPAP at one's titrated pressure prevents essentially all events and doesn't even let any of them get _started_ in the first place.

And it's cheaper, and you can check for leaks very easily and immediately (since the pressure you get initially is the same pressure you'll get all night). And, many people suffer arosals or mini-awakenings due to the pressure changing under APAP, which is not a problem with CPAP.

Some/all of these factors are why a lot of people do better under CPAP than under APAP.

Could you please help me. I use APAP, and my AHI this month has AVJ 0.48, do I need to switch to CPAP mode? At the sleep study my AHI was 450 for 3 hours of sleep. Jim

[Slinky]

I was a tummy sleeper all my life until a whiplash in '94. I "had" to learn to NOT sleep on my tummy due to my neck problems. When the tennis ball bit was suggested to me I had to laugh. Ferggedditt!

However, I "did" come up w/my own solution which I found worked best for me. I just grabbed a couple of hubby's holey hunting socks and tied some knots in them, then just basted the knotted socks to the back of a couple of pair of old PJ tops and wore them to bed.

Even now, 12 years later I do NOT sleep on my tummy, nor do I even attempt to do so according to my recent sleep evaluation study and two titration studies.

As for sleeping on your side and keeping you on your side I can vouch for the dog and cat solution. And we have just a regular ole double bed plus our dog was a Canaan Dog, not some little dog. Hubby has the rhythmic leg movements at night so the dog and cats preferred my side of the bed.

We still have the double bed but our dog is now a Sheltie (Shetland Sheepdog) and she insists on sleeping on MY side of the bed on MY pillow until I go to bed, then she's banished from the bed. The cat doesn't give up as easily. But that's hubby's problem since she LIKES to attack his feet when his rhythmic leg movements disturb HER sleep. If I take a nap during the day her sister is content to sleep on hubby's side of the bed and doesn't bother me except to object when and if I try to remake the bed. She managed to hook my CL2 headgear causing me to drop it and break the plastic elbow plus evidently managed to hook the nasal cushion w/her claw. Bless her rotten little heart! Thankfully our "ghetto cat" hasn't learned to appreciate sleeping w/us.

[whatrdreamsmadeof]

I agree the dog thing works but, after my neck surgery the water bed was the only way I could sleep on my side or stomach. I love it and so do the dogs and hubby. It also keeps the hose warm with the 60 degree room temp. Good Luck...couldn't do the tennis ball thing as in a water bed you can roll over on an elephant and not feel it.

[tom2112]

Instead of sleeping with dogs, try sleeping on the couch. It's very easy to sleep on your side on a couch, and much hard to sleep on your back. I do it all the time. Don't blame me if your back hurts in the morning, though. That just means it's time to get a better couch!

[onecoknower]

I've always been a side sleeper. For me sleeping on my back or stomach is torture! Having said that, the pets solution certainly works best. I sleep alone (human-wise) but I rarely get to actually use half a queen bed - the dog and cat are bed-hogs!!!

[SelfSeeker]

Were you sleeping on your back when you got titrated, if yes then the pressure would be ok for you to sleep on your back.

If you have an auto, I would think that the APAP would adjust to the pressure you need.

I always slept on my side. Except for the PSG, I layed on my back and did not move for fear of removing a wire.

I was titrated on my side.

I was/am surprised to see that I started waking up and being on my back. Pre CPAP I would not have been on my back. I wonder if this is because I can actually breathe again, and I am not "mentally fighting the fear" of sleeping on my back anymore.