Newbie Looking for 1st CPAP Machine (Apex or Philips)

[robysue]

I asked the dealer about the PR60 and here's the reply I got:

Remstar Pro cflex+ not sure with the catalogue no.

If the machine is a PR RemStar System One Series 60 Pro with C-Flex+, it is the 460 model.

I would ask to see the machine itself before agreeing to buying it. Here in the US, there were a lot of DMEs who would act like there was no difference between the Pro with C-Flex+ and the Plus with C-Flex models. And as I said earlier the Pro with C-Flex+ is a fine model and fully compatible with SleepyHead; the Plus with C-Flex is a brick.

I hope this helps you guys in knowing and determining more about the Philips being sold to me and how it compares with the Apex model feature wise.

I know nothing about the Apex. In general you do need some kind of software to get at all the data a PAP records. I don't think the Apex is compatible with SleepyHead. So an important question is whether you can get your hands on the program written for DMEs and doctor's offices to use to monitor patients with Apex machines.

[Pugsy]

I think they are talking about the PR System One Pro with CFlex which is indeed the model 460. The "Pro" term is the give away. The term Remstar tells us nothing because Respironics has pretty much used that marketing term on all models since time began up to the new DreamStation models.

While the PR 460 is basically a fixed cpap machine as opposed to a machine that offers both cpap and full time apap modes...the 460 does have some limited apap capabilities. It offers 30 days of apap mode capability which can be used either consecutively or randomly until the 30 day total is met. I think that those 30 days can also be reset up to 5 times if they haven't changed it. The reset is doing by erasing all the past data.

I would still prefer even the model 460 over the APEX despite the auto mode limitations but that's me.
We don't see APEX users here very often but the last one I saw was complaining about noise.
It's really considered a low end budget item and marketed as such.

Is this the APEX model you are considering?
https://www.cpap.com/productpage/apex-x ... chine.html
This is the data that is available from the product spec page
Data Storage:

Summary Data - 730 Sessions
Efficacy Data (AHI, Leak) - 18 Sessions or Cumulative 72 Hours

That means a generic AHI and some sort of leak data....very limited data with no event category breakdown. That in itself would be a deal breaker for me. It's real imported to know if you are having central apneas or obstructive apneas and that machine won't/can't do it.

Exactly how much is the import tax if you were to use a CONUS supplier? I have sent machines all over the world and most of the time import tax is waved or dramatically reduced for medical equipment. Have you actually checked to see import fees on something like a $600 machine?
If worried about warranty issues and down time...heck, you can buy 2 machines from US suppliers and have your own backup machine in case one goes bad for a lot less than what you are looking at in terms of cost from your local supplier.

[egzbuen]

I think they are talking about the PR System One Pro with CFlex which is indeed the model 460. The "Pro" term is the give away. The term Remstar tells us nothing because Respironics has pretty much used that marketing term on all models since time began up to the new DreamStation models.

While the PR 460 is basically a fixed cpap machine as opposed to a machine that offers both cpap and full time apap modes...the 460 does have some limited apap capabilities. It offers 30 days of apap mode capability which can be used either consecutively or randomly until the 30 day total is met. I think that those 30 days can also be reset up to 5 times if they haven't changed it. The reset is doing by erasing all the past data.

I would still prefer even the model 460 over the APEX despite the auto mode limitations but that's me.
We don't see APEX users here very often but the last one I saw was complaining about noise.
It's really considered a low end budget item and marketed as such.

Is this the APEX model you are considering?
https://www.cpap.com/productpage/apex-x ... chine.html
This is the data that is available from the product spec page
Data Storage:

Summary Data - 730 Sessions
Efficacy Data (AHI, Leak) - 18 Sessions or Cumulative 72 Hours

That means a generic AHI and some sort of leak data....very limited data with no event category breakdown. That in itself would be a deal breaker for me. It's real imported to know if you are having central apneas or obstructive apneas and that machine won't/can't do it.

Exactly how much is the import tax if you were to use a CONUS supplier? I have sent machines all over the world and most of the time import tax is waved or dramatically reduced for medical equipment. Have you actually checked to see import fees on something like a $600 machine?
If worried about warranty issues and down time...heck, you can buy 2 machines from US suppliers and have your own backup machine in case one goes bad for a lot less than what you are looking at in terms of cost from your local supplier.

Thanks again guys for taking time in replying.

1. The Apex model is ICH, here is the link:

https://www.cpap.com/productpage/ich-au ... -apex.html

It's different from the quoted post model above.

2. I'll give my sleep doctor a call tomorrow morning and ask if she's fine with the Apex or not, which necessarily includes whether or not she would get all the data she needs from said model. Although at the outset, she prescribed the cflex+ model to me.

3. Tax is not a joke in our territory. Lows of 20% and highs of 25%. Shipping fees would be another issue as well.

4. Buying 2 units from CONUS is a good idea. Question is, won't the other unit which is barely used would have problems in the long run for being unused?

Sent from hell

[chunkyfrog]

The plus symbol gives me the shakes.
The P/R bricks are often called "plus".
No data except hours used.

[robysue]

The plus symbol gives me the shakes.
The P/R bricks are often called "plus".
No data except hours used.

Yep. That's why it's so important to clarify exactly what machine we're talking about with the PR machines:

In the System One series:

• System One CPAP Plus with C-Flex = Brick
  System One CPAP Pro with C-Flex+ = Full efficacy data fixed pressure machine

In the new DreamStation series:

• DreamStation CPAP = Brick
  DreamStation CPAP Pro = Full efficacy data fixed pressure machine

[egzbuen]

Guys, just to give you an update. I called the supplier and the Philips quoted by the dealer is the 460 model. 260 is out of stock while the 560 aint available in our jurisdiction.

I asked for the dreamstation auto model and i was quoted 2555usd converted from PhP.

FYI.

Sent from hell

[Gasper62]

Just how much import duty would you be facing to have one or two machines shipped to you from the USA ? Sounds to me like you need to forget warranty periods and do the math to see what bringing in two brand new $500 units will cost. My guess is it'll be a lot less than some of the prices they want locally for just one machine.

Edit:
Looks like it's not too much money, according to this calculator........... http://www.dutycalculator.com/compare-plans/nr-ni/

[egzbuen]

I'm currently looking for the software used for the Apex ICH CPAP machine. Although I'm currently bent on getting this, if I don't have access to its software, it would be of no use to me. I've spoken to my physician and she doesn't have it as well. Contacted Apex through all of its regional offices and it was only Apex USA which replied. Sadly they can't send the software but it would have to be requested from the Asian regional office which is not replying.

Be that as it may, is the software for the Philips CPAP machines readily downloadable by anyone? Where? Easy to use?

I ask since my physician will only accept decrypted data and not raw data.

Thus, if all attempts to secure Apex ICH software fails, I would be constrained to purchase the Remstar Pro with CFlex+.

I've also decided to purchase it from CONUS as prices here in Manila are ridiculous.

Any thoughts to my queries? Thanks.

[Gasper62]

If you're determined to disregard the info and advice you've already been given.....why bother asking further questions ? Get a machine that will work with Sleepyhead. Simple.

[egzbuen]

If you're determined to disregard the info and advice you've already been given.....why bother asking further questions ? Get a machine that will work with Sleepyhead. Simple.

If your read my last post well, you would see that I've decided already to get the Apex but having problems in getting its software.

Thus, in the event that im not succesful in getting or assured of being able to get its software, i will be considering the philips. However I have just a few questions which are included in the last post.

The point being, if I will be encountering or get the same software issue with Philips, I will take my chances with the Apex.

Ergo, entirely new questions or questions which have not been answered here.

[palerider]

Ergo, entirely new questions or questions which have not been answered here.

only, they've already been answered before, repeatedly... and, again, just above.

[egzbuen]

Ergo, entirely new questions or questions which have not been answered here.

only, they've already been answered before, repeatedly... and, again, just above.

Here are my questions:

Be that as it may, is the software for the Philips CPAP machines readily downloadable by anyone? Where? Easy to use?

I might have missed the answers but the only one who answered these, I think, was Julie on the first page. That the software is free.

My questions now are: easily downloadable (because it might be free but not downloadable and you have to request from a CD from manufacturer)? Where can I download it (if it is indeed downloadable)? Is it easy to use?


Again, thank you in advance for being patient with a newbie like me.

[Julie]

Think you're missing the point - it isn't Phillips (or Resmed or Apex) software that you should be asking about... the 'software' or tracking for any one company's reports is very limited and usually only applies to 'compliance'. The point we're trying to make is that Sleepyhead (it's free and none of us have any personal financial stake in it) is a program that works with all, and does Macs, and gives you much more and more useful results than any of the individual manufacturer's programs. I don't think anyone here uses those for anything except the first few months when starting out and the insurance co's want to be sure Cpap's being used at all.

If you want to know what's working and why overnight and over time, as well as over a broad range of factors, use Sleepyhead, not the Mickey mouse stuff the mfgr's supply. Those are a waste of time.

But if you want to keep your head in the sand, call Phillips and ask them about their program - it'll probably be a first for them.

Here -

https://sleepyhead.jedimark.net/

http://sleep.tnet.com/resources/sleepyhead/shorganize

[Pugsy]

Take a look here.....see the part about software
https://sleep.tnet.com/equipment

SleepyHead will work great with the Phillips Respironics machines...
Free and easy to download and use.

Encore from Respironics will also work and it can be found without cost. Depending on the version not always so easy to use. Explained about how to get it to download at above link.

[russatore]

I am familiar with the Philippines and the exorbitant prices of CPAP machines but can't you use a Balikbayan box from the US? For the price they charge you for an unknown machine you would be able to get a brand new Airsense 10 and a decent second hand S9 as a spare and you will still be ahead with two of the best equipment available( there are a few trusted members of this board that will be more then happy to help you put together a decent deal for you in States).
If you insist on Apex then you may want to consider talking directly with Apex Medical in Taipei ( numbers and address on their website) and see if they will sell you a machine from their Taipei office instead. In that case a short hop with CEB will set you back a couple of 100U$ for the flight from MNL to TPE but it would still save you more then half they want to charge you in Manila.
Just a thought !