Breathing with cpap off

[xman charl]

Use a small irregular mount piece, sort of helps keep mouth open small amount


Charl

[archangle]

It absolutely blows my mind that our machines don't come included with some sort of battery backup unit.

CPAP backup batteries tend to be heavy, expensive, and unreliable. It takes a substantial battery to power a CPAP for very long. They also quit working after a year or two, often without much warning.

Battery technology is getting better, but it's still not great.

Insurance companies don't want to pay for it, so unless it gets mandated, it's unlikely to happen.

[AMK]

ChicagoGranny - I couldn't sleep on my back if I wanted to. I fly awake, doubtless from apnea.

Chunkyfrog..thanks for the idea. My problem isn't so much mouth breathing per se (my nose works fine) as having my jaw go lax and lips part in deep sleep just enough that a little cpap air escapes my mouth and causes me to wake up all throughout the night. I wear a chin strap along with paper tape on my mouth. I have not been able to find any other arrangement that I can tolerate.

[archangle]

If you're connected to an unpowered CPAP machine, it's worse than no CPAP. You can blow air backwards through your CPAP machine, so your exhaled air goes up the tubing. When you inhale, you breathe that same air back into your lungs. It's a bit like breathing in and out of a paper bag.

You do get a little fresh air because some of the air goes out through the exhaust vent in the mask, but there's much less air going out the vent because the mask isn't pressurized like it is when the CPAP is running.

The manufacturers and FDA seem to think it's a problem because all full face masks (FFM) have an anti-asphyxia vent that opens up if there's no pressure and it lets air in and out directly from the mask.

There's no anti-asphyxia valve on nasal masks. I presume they think you'll open your mouth if the CPAP stops. This makes me worried about taping your mouth shut with a nasal mask.

Oxygen deprivation is dangerous and sneaky. Google "confined space training." If you enter an area with low oxygen, you can lose consciousness and never notice anything is wrong before you pass out. Because you're breathing in and out, some of your suffocation reflexes don't kick in the way they would if you were being strangled or smothered by having your breathing blocked.

How bad is it in reality if you tape your mouth? We don't really know. There haven't been a lot of reports of people dying from suffocation when their CPAP quit. However, I'm not confident we'd know. If you suffocated in your sleep from a CPAP incident, it might just look like you "died quietly in your sleep."

The real world coroners/medical examiners aren't like the hotshots on TV crime show. When Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia died in his sleep while not connected to his CPAP machine, there was no autopsy, and there was no medical exam. The officials involved are some combination of overworked, underfunded, ignorant, lazy, and lacking in incentive to do anything more than go through the motions if there's no evidence of foul play.

[Wulfman...]

It absolutely blows my mind that our machines don't come included with some sort of battery backup unit.

So you want to pay at least $500 more for them? For something that is very rarely used? In the almost 7 years I have been using a cpap machine I have had TWO nights where the power went out for over 1 hour - TWO!

And, I've experienced power outages maybe THREE times in about 11 years. And, each night I had already gotten or was able to get my minimum of 4 hours (to satisfy my own personal compliance criteria).

There are decent battery backup UPS devices for less than $50.00 at many Walmart stores which will keep your machine from going off immediately and will help you wake up to alert you (if it has an alarm). I bought two of them in the last couple of years.


Den

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[AMK]

Thanks for sharing that, archangle. I hadn't thought of that and it's sobering. It definitely sounds like if nothing else I need the alarm to wake me up if the power goes out. No wonder I feel so awful today since I spent an hour and ten minutes re-breathing my air in addition to being up between 2:30-4:30. I've just been sitting like a lump, too tired to even get breakfast. Den, I'm definitely going to consider your idea. I know that the UPS I have in my office for my computer would scare the living crap out of me if it started its warning beeping during the night right next to my bed, but that's better than suffocating.

[CapnLoki]

I followed the links on your page Krelvin and it looks to me like these backup batteries are not something that can be left in place in case of an unexpected power outage. That's what I need. I had no idea I would lose power last night.

I believe Krelvin is describing a system that I originally setup. It can certainly be used in "UPS Mode," running most of the time from the battery charger, but falling back to the battery when the power goes out. Mine has sat by the bed 24/7 and I switch to this mode when a storm is threatening. The only caveats I would add is that if you really want to run in UPS mode full time you should have a larger trickle charger, and if your humidity needs are high, or outages are very frequent or lengthy, you might want a larger battery.

[ozley62]

I'm lucky that even a few hurricanes have only killed my power around 45 minutes once. I was traveling a lot for a while and the constant wrapping of my power cord caused a short that caused my bipap machine to stop one night. I woke up pretty quick though. I use a nasal mask and when it's running seems to keep a suction on my mouth and keeps it closed. I always woke with a dry mouth from my mouth getting blowed open when I used a full face mask.