Amara View rides up my face overnight, & other newbie issues
Amara View rides up my face overnight, & other newbie issues
Hey everyone; great forum so far as I try to learn more about all of this. I'm going on nearly two weeks of using the BiPAP (no prior experience with any of this) and I'm hoping to see improvement. I've read lots of the posts in the newbie results pinned thread and I'm afraid I'm going to be one of those people who only notices the benefits of this when I don't have it.
So I get the mask adjusted to what I think is a comfortable setting, then settle in for the night. Something happens during the night (gremlins, maybe?) and the mask inches up my face. I woke up this morning with the band between the inside nose hole and mouth hole pressing painfully against the bottom of my nose. (That's the most sensitive part; which is why they put rings in bulls' noses there - not pleasant, but not a deal breaker.) I had the same thing happen with a [sorry - don't know the name of the other mask] which has a forehead strap and is more triangular shaped. The top point of that mask would end up practically over my eyes.
I don't think I have a cone shaped head!
If I tighten the bands at the bottom of the View, then it creates a leak which blows air right in my eyes. If I tighten the upper straps then at least it's only leaking air out of the bottom. But maybe that's pulling the mask upward? If I leave them both loose then air leaks everywhere. (Settings on the BiPAP are 21/17, or is it 17/21?) If I moderately and evenly tighten both sets of straps, then I wake up with it pressed up against the bottom of my nose. Weird, eh?
It's mostly rambling beyond this point. Thanks for reading along.
Last night I also used one of those Remzzz (I think they're called) mask liner inserts. That at least kept the mask from sounding like a whoopee cushion when an air leak would develop. I was told not to cut on the Remzzz, but I would think having one larger hole for your nose would be better than one for your nose and one for your mouth as they come - since you're supposed to be breathing through your nose? Isn't it just supposed to line the mask, to keep it from sounding like a whoopee cushion when there's an air leak?
Another change I did last night; I set the BiPAP on the floor next to the bed. My bed is perhaps 3ft off the ground or so. The pressure seemed...different somehow. Better, I think. I had it level or just a couple inches higher than my bed on my nightstand prior to this. Is this the thing to do?
My "numbers" are all over the place. I'm just using the Philips DreamMapper app on my phone as I don't have any other software for it. For my first sleep study the regular CPAP only brought me down from 60 AHI to 27 or so and the second one determined I needed a BiPAP; so that's what I'm using. I'm still not too sure what these numbers all mean, in terms of sleep quality, but last night I had AHI of 1.2 and mask fit 70%. Night before, AHI 6.0 and fit 12%. Prior night, 0.9 AHI and 38% mask fit. 4.2 / 25%, 1.4 / 88%, 4.7 / 100%, 5.2 / 99% and so on...
Anyway, I'm not sure what correlation I'm supposed to be drawing from the numbers just yet. I'm not sure who is being monitored either, but I haven't really noticed an appreciable difference just yet. I was hoping to need a few less hours in the bed, maybe look forward to mornings, even have some energy throughout the day.
But, I gather that for some people it's just a gradual thing and the differences are very subtle. Or maybe I'm just still getting accustomed to the whole thing. Does it take some time to subconsciously adjust to having the mask on your face all night? I don't have any conscious anxiety or objection to wearing it.
Anyway, the main thing I need is anyone's recommendation on a way to keep the mask from sliding up my face during the night. ... That, and any encouragement that I'll eventually feel rested in the morning and not feel sleepy during the day. I think the thing to do is to just fight through my normal daily routine, fight through my workouts (which I need to start back on), and "fake it till I feel [rested]". Thoughts?
Is there a way I could get an actual fighter pilot's mask, or a WW1 gas mask, to hook up to the BiPAP? Those seem like they'd be pretty good options as far as sealing and staying put.
So I get the mask adjusted to what I think is a comfortable setting, then settle in for the night. Something happens during the night (gremlins, maybe?) and the mask inches up my face. I woke up this morning with the band between the inside nose hole and mouth hole pressing painfully against the bottom of my nose. (That's the most sensitive part; which is why they put rings in bulls' noses there - not pleasant, but not a deal breaker.) I had the same thing happen with a [sorry - don't know the name of the other mask] which has a forehead strap and is more triangular shaped. The top point of that mask would end up practically over my eyes.
I don't think I have a cone shaped head!
If I tighten the bands at the bottom of the View, then it creates a leak which blows air right in my eyes. If I tighten the upper straps then at least it's only leaking air out of the bottom. But maybe that's pulling the mask upward? If I leave them both loose then air leaks everywhere. (Settings on the BiPAP are 21/17, or is it 17/21?) If I moderately and evenly tighten both sets of straps, then I wake up with it pressed up against the bottom of my nose. Weird, eh?
It's mostly rambling beyond this point. Thanks for reading along.
Last night I also used one of those Remzzz (I think they're called) mask liner inserts. That at least kept the mask from sounding like a whoopee cushion when an air leak would develop. I was told not to cut on the Remzzz, but I would think having one larger hole for your nose would be better than one for your nose and one for your mouth as they come - since you're supposed to be breathing through your nose? Isn't it just supposed to line the mask, to keep it from sounding like a whoopee cushion when there's an air leak?
Another change I did last night; I set the BiPAP on the floor next to the bed. My bed is perhaps 3ft off the ground or so. The pressure seemed...different somehow. Better, I think. I had it level or just a couple inches higher than my bed on my nightstand prior to this. Is this the thing to do?
My "numbers" are all over the place. I'm just using the Philips DreamMapper app on my phone as I don't have any other software for it. For my first sleep study the regular CPAP only brought me down from 60 AHI to 27 or so and the second one determined I needed a BiPAP; so that's what I'm using. I'm still not too sure what these numbers all mean, in terms of sleep quality, but last night I had AHI of 1.2 and mask fit 70%. Night before, AHI 6.0 and fit 12%. Prior night, 0.9 AHI and 38% mask fit. 4.2 / 25%, 1.4 / 88%, 4.7 / 100%, 5.2 / 99% and so on...
Anyway, I'm not sure what correlation I'm supposed to be drawing from the numbers just yet. I'm not sure who is being monitored either, but I haven't really noticed an appreciable difference just yet. I was hoping to need a few less hours in the bed, maybe look forward to mornings, even have some energy throughout the day.
But, I gather that for some people it's just a gradual thing and the differences are very subtle. Or maybe I'm just still getting accustomed to the whole thing. Does it take some time to subconsciously adjust to having the mask on your face all night? I don't have any conscious anxiety or objection to wearing it.
Anyway, the main thing I need is anyone's recommendation on a way to keep the mask from sliding up my face during the night. ... That, and any encouragement that I'll eventually feel rested in the morning and not feel sleepy during the day. I think the thing to do is to just fight through my normal daily routine, fight through my workouts (which I need to start back on), and "fake it till I feel [rested]". Thoughts?
Is there a way I could get an actual fighter pilot's mask, or a WW1 gas mask, to hook up to the BiPAP? Those seem like they'd be pretty good options as far as sealing and staying put.
Re: Amara View rides up my face overnight, & other newbie issues
well, if you imagine it's working better, run with it.bpb21 wrote:Another change I did last night; I set the BiPAP on the floor next to the bed. My bed is perhaps 3ft off the ground or so. The pressure seemed...different somehow. Better, I think. I had it level or just a couple inches higher than my bed on my nightstand prior to this. Is this the thing to do?
the weight of 3 feet of air is insignificant to the pressure delivery, air's pretty light, unlike water, which is what they measure the pressure in. you'll hear recommendations in some cases to put the machine lower than your bed, so that any water that condenses in the hose will run back down into the humidifier.
I think you're taking this whole "I'm a jet pilot" fantasy a bit too far.bpb21 wrote:Is there a way I could get an actual fighter pilot's mask, or a WW1 gas mask, to hook up to the BiPAP? Those seem like they'd be pretty good options as far as sealing and staying put.
though, theoretically if you want to get a helmet, and a mask, and very carefully calculate the right size holes to make in it so that it vented the right amount of air out (so you didn't suffocate and die your first night) .... let us know how it sleeps, goose.
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Accounts to put on the foe list: dataq1, clownbell, gearchange, lynninnj, mper!?, DreamDiver, Geer1, almostadoctor, sleepgeek, ajack, stom, mogy, D.H., They often post misleading, timewasting stuff.
Accounts to put on the foe list: dataq1, clownbell, gearchange, lynninnj, mper!?, DreamDiver, Geer1, almostadoctor, sleepgeek, ajack, stom, mogy, D.H., They often post misleading, timewasting stuff.
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Re: Amara View rides up my face overnight, & other newbie issues
When I was using the simplus mask, I would run two pieces of tape from the mask down under my chin to keep the mask from riding up on my face. With the amara view, I don't need to use the tape. However, I now use a soft cervical collar and that firmly holds the bottom strap in place which prevents the mask from riding up.
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Re: Amara View rides up my face overnight, & other newbie issues
[quote="Okie bipap"]When I was using the simplus mask, I would run two pieces of tape from the mask down under my chin to keep the mask from riding up on my face. With the amara view, I don't need to use the tape. However, I now use a soft cervical collar and that firmly holds the bottom strap in place which prevents the mask from riding up.[/quote]
That's interesting...I haven't gotten in to taping (either my mouth or my mask) just yet but I've read about it on here.
That's my main remaining issue. It's so weird; it's like that strip that separates the nose hole and the mouth hole gets pushed up in between my nostrils - most uncomfortable. Maybe I'll try that...or maybe a slight modification/addition to the straps to go under the chin and keep it down?
That's interesting...I haven't gotten in to taping (either my mouth or my mask) just yet but I've read about it on here.
That's my main remaining issue. It's so weird; it's like that strip that separates the nose hole and the mouth hole gets pushed up in between my nostrils - most uncomfortable. Maybe I'll try that...or maybe a slight modification/addition to the straps to go under the chin and keep it down?
Re: Amara View rides up my face overnight, & other newbie issues
[quote="palerider"][quote="bpb21"]though, theoretically if you want to get a helmet, and a mask, and very carefully calculate the right size holes to make in it so that it vented the right amount of air out (so you didn't suffocate and die your first night) .... let us know how it sleeps, goose.[/quote]
Mission status pending; just gotta conquer this mask wedgie and I'll be ok.
I'm surprised there aren't a slew of novelty/themed masks like that. Then again, maybe we're all too tired to care about them!
Mission status pending; just gotta conquer this mask wedgie and I'll be ok.
I'm surprised there aren't a slew of novelty/themed masks like that. Then again, maybe we're all too tired to care about them!
Re: Amara View rides up my face overnight, & other newbie issues
Forget fighter pilot -- I'm holding out for Darth Vader! Or the Dr Who character I use as my avatar...bpb21 wrote:I'm surprised there aren't a slew of novelty/themed masks like that. Then again, maybe we're all too tired to care about them!
I lost a bunch of weight over the past year, and one of the completely counter-intuitive things that happened is that I went UP a size in masks. The main symptom that I noticed is that I was spending the night pushing the mask down. I also had to pretty seriously mod the headgear to make it smaller -- I cut the strap the goes over top and the one in back, and safety-pinned them back together with a good inch/inch-and-a-half overlap. Given my experience, I'm always open to the possibility that some particular mask is just not going to fit the shape of my face no matter what the size. Unfortunately this is mostly trial and error to figure out what works for your face.
Re: Amara View rides up my face overnight, & other newbie issues
There's tons of ideas: Bane, Stormtrooper, Jaws (from that old James Bond movie! Or at least that would make a good mouth seal for the mouthbreathers.), Immortal Joe (from the newest Mad Max movie - seriously can't believe that hasn't hit the market yet), I guess any character with a nose/mouth covering would work. I would totally buy an elaborate Predator CPAP mask where the air hoses all connected like the do in the movie!
Anyway, I'm one of the unlucky (or lucky, depending on how you look at it) persons who's apnea is not due to weight. I haven't slept well all my life and I was always a skinny child with a high metabolism. I was into bodybuilding in college, really lean, and I still snored to shake the walls (and no, my neck isn't huge either). So, I just don't breathe correctly I guess; can't blame it on weight. I can see how your face changing with your weight would require a different fit.
But that's interesting on modifying your mask. The View has a strap that goes over the head but not under; I'm wondering if I could reverse that somehow.
The really strange thing is that the mask feels fine when I put it on and initially fit it, and even early in the night (as best I can tell) when I'm sleeping. But after about 3 hours it's all up on my nose. Maybe I'll see what I can come up with/rig up that won't cause an air leak at the top (and into the eyes). Thanks for the tip.
Anyway, I'm one of the unlucky (or lucky, depending on how you look at it) persons who's apnea is not due to weight. I haven't slept well all my life and I was always a skinny child with a high metabolism. I was into bodybuilding in college, really lean, and I still snored to shake the walls (and no, my neck isn't huge either). So, I just don't breathe correctly I guess; can't blame it on weight. I can see how your face changing with your weight would require a different fit.
But that's interesting on modifying your mask. The View has a strap that goes over the head but not under; I'm wondering if I could reverse that somehow.
The really strange thing is that the mask feels fine when I put it on and initially fit it, and even early in the night (as best I can tell) when I'm sleeping. But after about 3 hours it's all up on my nose. Maybe I'll see what I can come up with/rig up that won't cause an air leak at the top (and into the eyes). Thanks for the tip.
Re: Amara View rides up my face overnight, & other newbie issues
Kind of like a "drip loop" for aquarium accessories. Anyway I know what the change was: I just can't hear the BiPAP breathing when it's on the ground. That's the change. Might actually be a good tip for those bothered by the sound their machine makes (although most are pretty quiet these days).palerider wrote: well, if you imagine it's working better, run with it.
the weight of 3 feet of air is insignificant to the pressure delivery, air's pretty light, unlike water, which is what they measure the pressure in. you'll hear recommendations in some cases to put the machine lower than your bed, so that any water that condenses in the hose will run back down into the humidifier.
Too far? Not far enough! Maybe I should go ahead and patent this idea so I can make some money off of it...palerider wrote:I think you're taking this whole "I'm a jet pilot" fantasy a bit too far.
though, theoretically if you want to get a helmet, and a mask, and very carefully calculate the right size holes to make in it so that it vented the right amount of air out (so you didn't suffocate and die your first night) .... let us know how it sleeps, goose.
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Re: Amara View rides up my face overnight, & other newbie issues
I am in the process of trying out an Amara View full face mask. The instructions said to adjust the strap over the top of the head until the straps rides just over the ear. At first I had mine too high and the mask would ride up as you said. After adjusting it slightly and trying it for a night or so I now have it set properly. I also had to to adjust the top straps a little at a time. The combination of adjustments seems to have stopped the riding up issue for the last couple of nights.
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Re: Amara View rides up my face overnight, & other newbie issues
Thanks for the tip; I'd been sort of leaving the top strap as is. I'll try this tonight.ClayL wrote:I am in the process of trying out an Amara View full face mask. The instructions said to adjust the strap over the top of the head until the straps rides just over the ear. At first I had mine too high and the mask would ride up as you said. After adjusting it slightly and trying it for a night or so I now have it set properly. I also had to to adjust the top straps a little at a time. The combination of adjustments seems to have stopped the riding up issue for the last couple of nights.
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Re: Amara View rides up my face overnight, & other newbie issues
[quote="bpb21"]
So I get the mask adjusted to what I think is a comfortable setting, then settle in for the night. Something happens during the night (gremlins, maybe?) and the mask inches up my face. I woke up this morning with the band between the inside nose hole and mouth hole pressing painfully against the bottom of my nose. (That's the most sensitive part; which is why they put rings in bulls' noses there - not pleasant, but not a deal breaker.) I had the same thing happen with a [sorry - don't know the name of the other mask] which has a forehead strap and is more triangular shaped. The top point of that mask would end up practically over my eyes.
I don't think I have a cone shaped head!
If I tighten the bands at the bottom of the View, then it creates a leak which blows air right in my eyes. If I tighten the upper straps then at least it's only leaking air out of the bottom. But maybe that's pulling the mask upward? If I leave them both loose then air leaks everywhere. (Settings on the BiPAP are 21/17, or is it 17/21?) If I moderately and evenly tighten both sets of straps, then I wake up with it pressed up against the bottom of my nose. Weird, eh?
quote]
The Amara View has this problem, bpb21. First off, if you have the sizing guage (it should have been provided in your mask bagging) then resize yourself and make sure that you are using the right size of mask. Remember, the mask only fits to the size of your nose, not the size of your mouth. The mask size will be located on the bottom of the cushion.
After you know you have the right size loosen all of the straps nearly entirely and start over. This is how I tighten this particular mask.
1. Hold the mask in position snug and tight the top frame straps to wear the mask holds in place, but is not pushing tighting on the tip of your nose. This will be for support mainly and should not be tightened again.
2. Think of the mask cushion like a square. The bottom frame straps control the sides and bottome of the cushion surrounding your mouth. Tighten these slightly tighter than your top frame straps.
3. The top head gear strap (sitting on the strap across the top of your head) tight to the center of your head allowing the cushion to move upward on your nose.
Apply pressure and adjust the top strap and bottom straps as needed. You should not have to adjust the top frame straps again (hopefully). If that does work after re-application you may consider a full face mask with a forehead support. I hope this information helps!
So I get the mask adjusted to what I think is a comfortable setting, then settle in for the night. Something happens during the night (gremlins, maybe?) and the mask inches up my face. I woke up this morning with the band between the inside nose hole and mouth hole pressing painfully against the bottom of my nose. (That's the most sensitive part; which is why they put rings in bulls' noses there - not pleasant, but not a deal breaker.) I had the same thing happen with a [sorry - don't know the name of the other mask] which has a forehead strap and is more triangular shaped. The top point of that mask would end up practically over my eyes.
I don't think I have a cone shaped head!
If I tighten the bands at the bottom of the View, then it creates a leak which blows air right in my eyes. If I tighten the upper straps then at least it's only leaking air out of the bottom. But maybe that's pulling the mask upward? If I leave them both loose then air leaks everywhere. (Settings on the BiPAP are 21/17, or is it 17/21?) If I moderately and evenly tighten both sets of straps, then I wake up with it pressed up against the bottom of my nose. Weird, eh?
quote]
The Amara View has this problem, bpb21. First off, if you have the sizing guage (it should have been provided in your mask bagging) then resize yourself and make sure that you are using the right size of mask. Remember, the mask only fits to the size of your nose, not the size of your mouth. The mask size will be located on the bottom of the cushion.
After you know you have the right size loosen all of the straps nearly entirely and start over. This is how I tighten this particular mask.
1. Hold the mask in position snug and tight the top frame straps to wear the mask holds in place, but is not pushing tighting on the tip of your nose. This will be for support mainly and should not be tightened again.
2. Think of the mask cushion like a square. The bottom frame straps control the sides and bottome of the cushion surrounding your mouth. Tighten these slightly tighter than your top frame straps.
3. The top head gear strap (sitting on the strap across the top of your head) tight to the center of your head allowing the cushion to move upward on your nose.
Apply pressure and adjust the top strap and bottom straps as needed. You should not have to adjust the top frame straps again (hopefully). If that does work after re-application you may consider a full face mask with a forehead support. I hope this information helps!
Re: Amara View rides up my face overnight, & other newbie issues
Thanks for all the tips. After I readjusted, as per your directions, here's what I did:
I took a headband and ran both bottom straps of the mask through it, so the headband was held under my chin (under my jaw, really), just tight enough. This kept my mouth closed during the night and it prevented the mask from riding up to the point of discomfort.
So, I'm glad to say that last night was a success with my modified chin strap! Thanks to all contributors on the forum!
I took a headband and ran both bottom straps of the mask through it, so the headband was held under my chin (under my jaw, really), just tight enough. This kept my mouth closed during the night and it prevented the mask from riding up to the point of discomfort.
So, I'm glad to say that last night was a success with my modified chin strap! Thanks to all contributors on the forum!
Re: Amara View rides up my face overnight, & other newbie issues
i have amara view and i cut the inner nose strip off so i don't get that painful bull nosering sore, it really helps a lot. i think it's a design flaw to have that thin piece of rubber across bottom of nose. also i switched to a different mask and have a brand new in package, never opened amara view headgear/mask size Medium i'd be willing to sell dirt cheap if interested let me know. My insurance paid for it and i tried to take it back to medical supply place and said i couldn't return it after 7 days so i'm stuck with it. Sean/Iowa
Re: Amara View rides up my face overnight, & other newbie issues
I figured it must be happening to others. I've got the medium and the large and I didn't cut that piece out because I figured I hadn't had it long enough for warranty purposes (if I had to swap it for another one) but I have wondered about it. So thanks but already got a medium. Using a large presently. I may try cutting that piece out of the medium, just to see. I wasn't sure either why they have a divider piece between the nose and mouth. Between your nostrils on your nose is one of the most sensitive places on one's body, so it is a lousy area for a restraining piece of a mask!iowan wrote:i have amara view and i cut the inner nose strip off so i don't get that painful bull nosering sore, it really helps a lot. i think it's a design flaw to have that thin piece of rubber across bottom of nose. also i switched to a different mask and have a brand new in package, never opened amara view headgear/mask size Medium i'd be willing to sell dirt cheap if interested let me know. My insurance paid for it and i tried to take it back to medical supply place and said i couldn't return it after 7 days so i'm stuck with it. Sean/Iowa
Re: Amara View rides up my face overnight, & other newbie issues
Of course, why didn't I think of the size issue before!
I've been using the Amara View for 3 weeks now and it felt fine at first, when I was only managing 4-5 hours a night of CPAP. Now that I'm sleeping 7-8 every night, the tip of my nose is getting really sore from getting pushed just *slightly* up and back during the night. (Unlike you, I'm not getting any pain on the underside of my nose.)
I just ordered a nasal pillow mask yesterday to try out, but I didn't even think of trying a different size mask cushion for the Amara! Something in this conversation just jostled that idea loose...
I've been using the Amara View for 3 weeks now and it felt fine at first, when I was only managing 4-5 hours a night of CPAP. Now that I'm sleeping 7-8 every night, the tip of my nose is getting really sore from getting pushed just *slightly* up and back during the night. (Unlike you, I'm not getting any pain on the underside of my nose.)
I just ordered a nasal pillow mask yesterday to try out, but I didn't even think of trying a different size mask cushion for the Amara! Something in this conversation just jostled that idea loose...
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