Heart failure and CPAP

Cpapian · Post by **Cpapian** » Wed Apr 24, 2019 12:55 pm

Two things you might consider to help you on you way....

One is a Sit/Stand desk. It is a desk that you can raise to a standing position or lower to a sitting position. It would give you 'exercise' while working. You could change the position every hour or so.

The other would be one of those smart watches. Although they are essentially toys, they do provide feedback on heart rate and steps and exercise as well as reminders to move.

I got a fitbit for free through points. I used it for three months and then got bored. .... mostly with wearing it. It kept a list of exercise frequency and duration with a computed calorie burn. It also had the ability to track food intake if that would be something that would interest you.

CreativeChris · Post by **CreativeChris** » Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:02 pm

Jack Burton wrote: ↑
Wed Apr 24, 2019 12:17 pm

CreativeChris wrote: ↑
Tue Apr 23, 2019 9:18 am
As far as experience do you see a big difference with blood pressure and sleeping longer than 6-7 hours?
You mean this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heart_failure ?

In answer to your question, not so much.

My blood pressure was 180ish over 120ish last year at this time.
I had already been on cpap for ~5 years.

Things that helped me.
1. Getting a blood pressure monitor, glucose meter and scale to track my stats in a spreadsheet.
2. Taking blood pressure and diabetes medication.
2. Eating high fat and low carb.
3. Getting a gym membership and a good pair of walking shoes.
4. Cutting way back on the booze.

My blood pressure this morning @8:00 was 123/73 which is pretty typical for me now.

What drugs are you on for the BP?

Damn good stats!

chunkyfrog · Post by **chunkyfrog** » Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:28 pm

Frequent bp checks are a good idea.
I wish the bp kiosks could switch sides.
Some of us cannot do it on the left arm.

CreativeChris · Post by **CreativeChris** » Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:44 pm

raisedfist wrote: ↑
Wed Apr 24, 2019 12:41 pm
CPAP does indeed have positive benefits on blood pressure and heart rate. My heart rate is much lower and steady when using PAP therapy. My BP is normal as long as I don't do stupid things like abuse caffeine. I also don't have to get up in the night to use the restroom anymore.

I would kill to have to get up in the middle of the night twice to go to the bathroom!

Jack Burton · Post by **Jack Burton** » Wed Apr 24, 2019 3:02 pm

CreativeChris wrote: ↑
Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:02 pm
What drugs are you on for the BP?

Damn good stats!

pms-perindopril erbumine
Thanks
I wonder if it would be even better without my 1-1.50 litres of high test coffee per day

CreativeChris · Post by **CreativeChris** » Wed Apr 24, 2019 3:13 pm

Jack Burton wrote: ↑
Wed Apr 24, 2019 3:02 pm

CreativeChris wrote: ↑
Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:02 pm
What drugs are you on for the BP?

Damn good stats!
pms-perindopril erbumine
Thanks
I wonder if it would be even better without my 1-1.50 litres of high test coffee per day

Yeah with that much coffee my heart would just explode!

dogsarelife · Post by **dogsarelife** » Wed Apr 24, 2019 9:56 pm

Hi - it seems you have been a member of cpaptalk longer than me, so I'm sure you know all of the general info about making sure your pressures are optimized with whatever software is available, and maybe having a journal of how you feel, as opposed to relying solely on AHI.

I am younger than you and I would call this luck honestly- my blood pressure normalized right away with xpap. I know that's not the case for everyone. However, after about 10 months on xpap, my blood pressure started going back up, which was a clue for me something wasn't right. My pcp suggested buying a home bp monitor, and checking 2 x a week.

The other thing I check is my resting heart rate, which was fairly high until recently, when I really feel like I got my pressures correct and I also altered my bilevel pap settings (trigger, cycle, timin, timax, rise time, for an AirCurve 10S - thanks raisedfist) for my specific health issue (scoliosis/neuromuscular weakness) that was making it harder for me to fully inhale. Do you think it's possible something like that could be happening with you?

If I have a bad night of sleep however, I still wake with a racing heart rate. It's a work in progress.

Have you been checked for all the other causes of shortness of breath in addition to those related to heart failure - I'm thinking iron deficiency, asthma, allergies, I'm sure there are others.

Anyway back to heart health - in addition to a bp monitor, I also bought a pulse oximeter that I wear on my finger overnight - so it tracks O2 saturation levels and pulse all night long - and it was helpful because my heart rate was spiking at times that I was having events that weren't necessarily being caught in Sleepyhead or Resscan. If you search cpaptalk I think Pugsy or palerider link to a pulse oximeter that does recording and costs about $50.

I did read of someone on here, I think in the "success stories" thread recently who had been on xpap for a while and struggled, as they were hoping for it to help with heart failure, and then I think they ended up having surgery for heart failure, after which their success story was that post surgery (they called it a replumbing if i remember right) they found that xpap worked much better for them and they felt like a new person. But I know surgery is a risky endeavor and a bridge many do not want to cross.

Last but not least - I work from home, and I know there is debate about if there is such a thing as sleep debt or not, but I feel that I had a major debt to repay, and while on vacation, I slept 10-14 hours a day for a while, and I feel that my body needed that restful sleep - at the right pressures and bilevel settings!!!! - for getting my heart rate and blood pressure stuff more stable. Before, I could walk around, and my heart rate would spike to 120-140; now it's 100 just puttering around and doing housework. Good luck. with everything. It's a hard fight to make progress and I hope you can see some.

multicast · Post by **multicast** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 2:08 am

CreativeChris wrote: ↑
Wed Apr 24, 2019 9:18 am
It makes me happy to hear that you are doing so well! But 220 lb at 6'4" is pretty damn good! I am 250lb at 5'11" so have a long ways to go.

It's 6'6'', just to be correct :^)

Mike

CreativeChris · Post by **CreativeChris** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 8:51 am

multicast wrote: ↑
Thu Apr 25, 2019 2:08 am

CreativeChris wrote: ↑
Wed Apr 24, 2019 9:18 am
It makes me happy to hear that you are doing so well! But 220 lb at 6'4" is pretty damn good! I am 250lb at 5'11" so have a long ways to go.
It's 6'6'', just to be correct :^)

Mike

LOL! Whatever. I was close enough! Anyone over 6' is just tall to me!

CreativeChris · Post by **CreativeChris** » Thu Apr 25, 2019 8:55 am

dogsarelife wrote: ↑
Wed Apr 24, 2019 9:56 pm
Hi - it seems you have been a member of cpaptalk longer than me, so I'm sure you know all of the general info about making sure your pressures are optimized with whatever software is available, and maybe having a journal of how you feel, as opposed to relying solely on AHI.

I am younger than you and I would call this luck honestly- my blood pressure normalized right away with xpap. I know that's not the case for everyone. However, after about 10 months on xpap, my blood pressure started going back up, which was a clue for me something wasn't right. My pcp suggested buying a home bp monitor, and checking 2 x a week.

The other thing I check is my resting heart rate, which was fairly high until recently, when I really feel like I got my pressures correct and I also altered my bilevel pap settings (trigger, cycle, timin, timax, rise time, for an AirCurve 10S - thanks raisedfist) for my specific health issue (scoliosis/neuromuscular weakness) that was making it harder for me to fully inhale. Do you think it's possible something like that could be happening with you?

If I have a bad night of sleep however, I still wake with a racing heart rate. It's a work in progress.

Have you been checked for all the other causes of shortness of breath in addition to those related to heart failure - I'm thinking iron deficiency, asthma, allergies, I'm sure there are others.

Anyway back to heart health - in addition to a bp monitor, I also bought a pulse oximeter that I wear on my finger overnight - so it tracks O2 saturation levels and pulse all night long - and it was helpful because my heart rate was spiking at times that I was having events that weren't necessarily being caught in Sleepyhead or Resscan. If you search cpaptalk I think Pugsy or palerider link to a pulse oximeter that does recording and costs about $50.

I did read of someone on here, I think in the "success stories" thread recently who had been on xpap for a while and struggled, as they were hoping for it to help with heart failure, and then I think they ended up having surgery for heart failure, after which their success story was that post surgery (they called it a replumbing if i remember right) they found that xpap worked much better for them and they felt like a new person. But I know surgery is a risky endeavor and a bridge many do not want to cross.

Last but not least - I work from home, and I know there is debate about if there is such a thing as sleep debt or not, but I feel that I had a major debt to repay, and while on vacation, I slept 10-14 hours a day for a while, and I feel that my body needed that restful sleep - at the right pressures and bilevel settings!!!! - for getting my heart rate and blood pressure stuff more stable. Before, I could walk around, and my heart rate would spike to 120-140; now it's 100 just puttering around and doing housework. Good luck. with everything. It's a hard fight to make progress and I hope you can see some.

I actually am going back to my cardio next week for a check up. I have been keeping a journal of my health and will let him know everything that is going on. I may need to have my lungs checked as well. I was a heavy smoker from my late teens until I was 35. We shall see!

Muse-Inc · Post by **Muse-Inc** » Sun Apr 28, 2019 6:10 am

CreativeChris wrote: ↑
Thu Apr 25, 2019 8:55 am
...I actually am going back to my cardio next week for a check up. I have been keeping a journal of my health and will let him know everything that is going on. I may need to have my lungs checked as well. I was a heavy smoker from my late teens until I was 35. We shall see!

Ask doc about taking Ubiquenol 300 mgms/day for heart failure like this one https://smile.amazon.com/Qunol-Ubiquino ... r=8-7&th=1.

At my sleep apnea diagnosis, my BP was 210/115 waaay up from my family's low BP, mine usually ranged 65/50-55. New doc wanted to hospitalize me BUT I had had 200/70 or almost a week when endo was tweaking thyroid meds. It took a year of CPAP therapy for my BP to begin to start dropping. I was on Cozzar, diuretic, strict low-salt, and small can low-sodium V8 (for potassium). We stated dropping dose of Cozzar. Took another 6-7 months to get off Cozzar (BP 130/70) and begin exercise without wobbly legs and feeling lightheaded afterwards. After losing 55#s, I dropped the diuretic with no increase in BP. Still take magnesium in taurate, citrate, and mag-tein forms along with the low-sodium V8 and stick to a lower salt diet. With the stress of ongoing grief, I now have increased systolic, so upped magnesium & ubiquenol, switched to just 1 cup of coffee and decaff, and getting more regular exercise, forcing myself to get outside in sunshine even if just a few minutes each day (ugh pollen laden air), and back to eating to lose more weight. Oh, I also drink hibiscus=based herb teas because 4 cups/day as effective as some BP meds. Also, eat low carb, no gluten, no sugar.

CreativeChris · Post by **CreativeChris** » Thu May 30, 2019 5:32 pm

Muse-Inc wrote: ↑
Sun Apr 28, 2019 6:10 am
Ask doc about taking Ubiquenol 300 mgms/day for heart failure like this one https://smile.amazon.com/Qunol-Ubiquino ... r=8-7&th=1.

At my sleep apnea diagnosis, my BP was 210/115 waaay up from my family's low BP, mine usually ranged 65/50-55. New doc wanted to hospitalize me BUT I had had 200/70 or almost a week when endo was tweaking thyroid meds. It took a year of CPAP therapy for my BP to begin to start dropping. I was on Cozzar, diuretic, strict low-salt, and small can low-sodium V8 (for potassium). We stated dropping dose of Cozzar. Took another 6-7 months to get off Cozzar (BP 130/70) and begin exercise without wobbly legs and feeling lightheaded afterwards. After losing 55#s, I dropped the diuretic with no increase in BP. Still take magnesium in taurate, citrate, and mag-tein forms along with the low-sodium V8 and stick to a lower salt diet. With the stress of ongoing grief, I now have increased systolic, so upped magnesium & ubiquenol, switched to just 1 cup of coffee and decaff, and getting more regular exercise, forcing myself to get outside in sunshine even if just a few minutes each day (ugh pollen laden air), and back to eating to lose more weight. Oh, I also drink hibiscus=based herb teas because 4 cups/day as effective as some BP meds. Also, eat low carb, no gluten, no sugar.

Sorry for the long time since you posted this! Since I was last on I started working from home which DRASTICALLY reduced my stress. I now have time to truly monitor my food and get in actual exercise. I told my cardio that I wanted off at least one of the drugs (cozzar) which was making me drag and put me on Bystolic which is FAR better. I'm not in a constant fog and the wooden feeling is gone. My BP is still stable and a recent cardiac MRI shows higher EF which is truly amazing to me. I was taking Ubiquenol and stopped after I ran out maybe 6 months ago. I will order more. I wanted to take hawthorne for my heart but my cardio told me to hold off as it may interfere with the drugs... Maybe after I lose more weight I'll try it.

Miss Emerita · Post by **Miss Emerita** » Thu May 30, 2019 8:07 pm

Chris,it’s great to hear that things are going so well—congratulations!

Muse-Inc · Post by **Muse-Inc** » Sat Jun 01, 2019 2:22 am

Miss Emerita wrote: ↑
Thu May 30, 2019 8:07 pm
Chris,it’s great to hear that things are going so well—congratulations!

Ditto, ditto ditto!!!

CHris, check with doc re hibiscus-based tea, tasty stuff. I love Tazo Passion, either hot or iced. Great news much less stress. I take plnt brand ashwagandha, an adaptogen, for stress (helps tamp the effects of high cortisol) as well as Solaray Passion Flower Extract that helps boost the GABA neurotransmitter that calms the brain.

ADD: Make sure you are getting at least 400-600 mgms of magnesium daily. I take multiple forms (taurate, citrate, glycinate, mag-tein) divided at meals. Magnesium helps smooth muscle relax, such as heart, lining of blood vessels, lining of lung tissue, etc. The mag-tein is for the brain.

chunkyfrog · Post by **chunkyfrog** » Sat Jun 01, 2019 3:20 pm

Always check with your doctor before adding any supplement.

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