Sleep disorders and pulse rate?

i know with things like sleep apnea the spo2 levels drop etc,but what does it mean when it comes to pulse rate? the spo2 assistant anaylisis parameters are change in rate by at least 6 bpm,for a minimum of 8 seconds.why does the pule rate come into play with sleep apnea? iv used my new pulse oximeter twice,once for 5 hours and once for 3 hours,so i havent had a full nights sleep but my oxygen seems ok,yet pulse is all over the place.or doesnt it matter if your oxygen is fine anyway? will keep doing it for some time to see if it changes etc though.

Try a little experiment. Clip the oximeter on your finger and note the reading. Then hold your breath and watch. As your SPO2 level drops your pulse will increase indicating stress. Same thing happens during sleep. If you are having significant oxygen desaturations, they should correspond to increased pulse rate. If your pulse is "all over the place" but your SPO2 is above 90 then there is most likely another cause for the variation. Might be time to run the data by your cardiologist.

It can take 15 seconds or so for the blood in the capillary bed beneath your fingernail to respond after you begin holding your breath. You're likely to see an increase in pulse rate before you see the decrease in SPO2 level.

i carnt hold it long enough for it to change on the oximeter lmao,just held it for 30 seconds yet idnt change,hr goes up but oxygen doesnt change.maybe 1 or 2 up and down but thats it

Slartybartfast wrote: . . . hold your breath and watch. As your SPO2 level drops your pulse will increase indicating stress. Same thing happens during sleep. . . .

My understanding is that things can be more complicated during apnea while asleep.

"The heart rate slows during and at the end of an upper-airway obstruction (apnea or hypopnea) due to a reflex bradycardia with high negative intrathoracic pressure (involuntary Mueller maneuver). There is a rapid increase in the pulse with rebreathing during the arousal. This strategy does not apply to the interpretation of central apneas, because there is no negative intrathoracic pressure during a central apnea." -- CHEST.2001;120(2):625-633. doi:10.1378/chest.120.2.625 -- http://journal.publications.chestnet.or ... id=1079870

Yes, I was also thinking that holding your breath is not the same physiologically as having your airway close and struggling to breathe. That is a stress reaction for the body accompanied by increased adrenaline, etc. My first night on titration I saw that my heart rate shot up to 155 at some point. I'm not sure I could purposely hold my breath long enough to reproduce that state (nor do I want to try !). Though the experiment could at least show you how your heart rate starts to go up if you hold your breath. If you're concerned about your heart rate variabiity I'd also recommend seeing a cardiologist.

How do you feel physically when this happens? Can you see your sleep data and compare the two to see what is going on when your pulse races? Are you having events? Did the sleep lab report say you have restless legs?

During a home sleep study I could see the HR on the recording pulse oximeter. It was around 90 beats per minute every time I looked and I could feel the hard beating under the ribs too.
About 1.5 years on APAP later the Dr asked if I could test drive a new pulse-ox recorder for him. Could also see the numbers on this one...about the size of a man's wrist watch and worn the same way. Each time my pulse was around 60! Yes... SA puts a heavy load on the body. It makes sense that the heart is racing to get what O2 there is in the blood to the brain and other parts.
I'm not a Dr, nor do I work in the medical field. However....If your machine and therapy is working the way they should it is good you wonder why your heart races. It could be a sign something else is going on. As was already suggested, take a printout to your family Dr. or cardiologist. Cardiologist would be better.
Best wishes,
Cindy

i havent been diagnoised with sleep apnea but iv had loads of symptoms for years,and for example i can sleep 12 hours and feel reallly unwell all day long.il feel like iv had zero sleep basicly.just wanted to see if there was a problem with breathing when im asleep etc.i havent had a full nights sleep since i got the oximeter 2 days back as iv had to get up early to do stuff etc.for example i slept this afternoon for 3 hrs 30 mins,and spo2 assistant says 0 spo2 events and 68 pr events.

I've taken my pulse-ox out for a lively walk;
and observed my pulse rate raise as my body uses oxygen.
I have also observed my pulse rate slowing as my oxygen levels return to normal.
The oxygen percentage does indeed lag behind the change in pulse rate.
I like my pulse-ox. Almost a toy!

chunkyfrog wrote:I've taken my pulse-ox out for a lively walk;
and observed my pulse rate raise as my body uses oxygen.
I have also observed my pulse rate slowing as my oxygen levels return to normal.
The oxygen percentage does indeed lag behind the change in pulse rate.
I like my pulse-ox. Almost a toy!

hahaha me to its smart,i mainly got it because i think iv got a condition called POTS which is to do with tachycardio and blood circulation,but got one with memory so i can kill 2 birds with one stone yano

sunzzofman wrote:

chunkyfrog wrote:I've taken my pulse-ox out for a lively walk;
and observed my pulse rate raise as my body uses oxygen.
I have also observed my pulse rate slowing as my oxygen levels return to normal.
The oxygen percentage does indeed lag behind the change in pulse rate.
I like my pulse-ox. Almost a toy!

hahaha me to its smart,i mainly got it because i think iv got a condition called POTS which is to do with tachycardio and blood circulation,but got one with memory so i can kill 2 birds with one stone yano

I tested positive for POTS about 16 years ago, when it wasn't really recognized (even by the cardiologist who did my tilt test). It most definitely plays havoc with your pulse, circulation, blood pressure and other functions controlled by the autonomic nervous system by making your ANS hyperexcitable. How smart of you to investigate this on your own.

it still isnt really recongnised i told my gp my heartrate can sometimes double from sitting to standing and she told me not to worry if my heart goes up a bit lol.because iv felt so bad even after have a really good sleep,sometimes feel even worse i thought looking into sleep apnea and ticking it off my "list" would help a diagnoisis.im shocked the chance of speaking to someone on here who has pots is extremely low lol.

jnk wrote:

Slartybartfast wrote: . . . hold your breath and watch. As your SPO2 level drops your pulse will increase indicating stress. Same thing happens during sleep. . . .

My understanding is that things can be more complicated during apnea while asleep.

I don't doubt that's true. Just relating that to illustrate that low oxygen level causes an increase in cardiac output. Blood pressure, too, if you can measure it. When I got my oximeter, I spent a lot of time taking it on short walks, uphill hikes, etc. Quickly learned that if you're moving around it doesn't record very well. But sitting still holding my breath, I found that I could get as low as 82% SPO2 before I simply couldn't hold it any longer. Was seeing spots by then. What got my attention was comparing how I felt at 82%, then considering that I spent considerable time at that level and dropped as low as 66% during my initial study. That has to have taken a toll.

sunzzofman wrote:hahaha me to its smart,i mainly got it because i think iv got a condition called POTS which is to do with tachycardio and blood circulation,but got one with memory so i can kill 2 birds with one stone yano

My wife has Hyperadrenergic POTS with mast cell activation. This form is rare, 1 in 6.67 Million. I pride myself because after studying POTS on my own for the 4 years she's manifested significant POTS symptoms, I'm the one that made the final diagnosis. Univ. of MN made the first POTS diagnosis, then I saw the adrenalin problem which hospitalized her and after that we went to Mayo for their POTS battery of tests and they confirmed the adrenaline and so I was looking for the cause of the hypotension and found the mast cell activation part, and today at 11 AM the cardiologist at the Minneapolis Heart Institute confirmed / concurs.

One of her treatments is propranolol, which gives nightmares and damages sleep (EEG looks like she's being tortured), so we cut back the dose in the evenings. She does not have sleep apnea, thank goodness, as I can only imagine her trying to deal with both.

sunzzofman wrote:it still isnt really recongnised i told my gp my heartrate can sometimes double from sitting to standing.

I believe an increase by 30 bpm going from sitting to standing, no exertion, is generally (informally perhaps) diagnostic, per the neurologist we talked to, Eduardo E. Benarroch, at the Mayo Clinic. VERY sharp man. We noted many more symptoms in my wife, such an increase being only one. There are many forms and manifestations to this disorder, it varies quite a lot from person to person; in cause, symptoms and also treatment.

MaxDarkside wrote: I pride myself because after studying POTS on my own for the 4 years she's manifested significant POTS symptoms, I'm the one that made the final diagnosis.

You should be proud, Max! Your wife is lucky to have you , and to have been evaluated by the right doctors. I'm sure my dysautonomia has complicated both my SA and my adjustment to CPAP -- might even explain those wacky flow lines I've posted and continue to see in my SleepyHead data. Floods of adrenaline with every RERA!

Best to you both.