Switching from pillows to mask...poor results so far

Hello,
I have used nasal pillows for a month now. That seemed to work ok except the extra pressure caused me to exhale through the mouth and this would wake me during the night.
I switched to a mask the past couple of nights and can't get any sleep. Either leaks will wake me, an itch on my nose, comfort issues...etc. I feel like I'm receiving no treatment whatsoever.
My question is this: Is there just an adjustment period or should I learn to live with what sleep I can get with the pillows?

I had the same problem and I went back to the nasal pillows and I use an elastic chin strap that's not too tight...just to remind my mouth to stay closed and I tape my lips. I know that a lot of people are against the tape but it works for me and I never thought I would tolerate it but it has been great.

I presume you switched to a full face mask.

There's no "correct" answer. Some people have a harder time adapting to a FFM. Some get it over time. Some people can train themselves not to mouth breathe by positioning their tongue against the roof of their mouth.

Some have success with an oral or hybrid mask.

Thanks for the advice. Perhaps I'll try the tape although it seems a little drastic. My mouth stays shut during sleep. A shame to switch back to pillows...I already shaved Thx again, I've gotta get this figured out soon. I can barely function.

With nasal pillows, or for that matter any nasal interface mask, there is the chance that the air going into the nose and down the airway will try to exit (prematurely) through the mouth if the tongue doesn't block the opening into the mouth. If we sleep with mouth shut or tape when the air enters the mouth the cheeks will inflate and poof...we have chipmunk cheeks and pretty much then the air has to escape via the mouth. Unwanted of course because not only does it mean we are losing therapy pressure (which might not be such a huge deal if mouth would immediately go back to being shut) it is highly annoying because it wakes us up and anything that wakes us up is unwanted.

So what do we do? Full face masks are an option but they come with their own demons....more surface area to leak, can't get to itches easy, uncomfortable along with possible wakes ups from those issues.
Might not have the wake ups from chipmunk cheeks though and of course therapy pressure is stable.

Nasal pillows or over the nose only mask have their own demons..chipmunk cheeks being a huge one.
If a person can effectively keep their tongue in place to block the door from the airway then the air will go on down the airway like it is supposed to and won't try to exit through the mouth. Easy to do while awake...keep your tongue placed in the roof of your mouth. Not so easy to do when asleep. The tongue has a mind of its own. Taping or chin strap may prevent the air from exiting the mouth but the cheeks inflating is still a disruption.

So a person has to pick their poison...which choice allows for the best quality of sleep?
For me, the demons of a full face mask were much worse than the demons associated with nasal pillows.
It didn't take me long to get into the habit of keeping my tongue in the roof of my mouth while asleep so episodes of chipmunk cheeks were rare.

Any time I make a change it seems to take a few nights to get used to it. Right now I am trying to adjust to the Hybrid mask. I need a FFM because I don't like using tape on my mouth. When I started this journey, a cousin said the mask was the hardest part of the whole thing -- and she was right. Hope you find something that works for you -- and soon!!!

Yeah, I suppose I need to try to be a little more patient and maybe only change 1 thing at a time, and dial it in. I'm just desperate for rest. On the same topic, does the mask typically require more pressure than the pillows? Seems to in my case.

nedi wrote:does the mask typically require more pressure than the pillows? Seems to in my case.

Supposedly no. The pressure needed for a nasal interface mask should be the same for a full face mask.
Though there are some who say that they need more pressure with a full face mask as opposed to nasal mask and have the reports to back them up. In theory X amount of pressure to the airway is the same amount of pressure no matter what the delivery system. That's the theory anyway. I have seen reports where there is as much as 3 or 4 cm difference in pressure needs to get the same results so I am thinking that the theory may have a few exceptions to it. Personally, I have zero experience to fall back on since I have never used anything but a nasal pillow mask.

Pugsy wrote:

nedi wrote:does the mask typically require more pressure than the pillows? Seems to in my case.

Supposedly no. The pressure needed for a nasal interface mask should be the same for a full face mask.
Though there are some who say that they need more pressure with a full face mask as opposed to nasal mask and have the reports to back them up. In theory X amount of pressure to the airway is the same amount of pressure no matter what the delivery system. That's the theory anyway. I have seen reports where there is as much as 3 or 4 cm difference in pressure needs to get the same results so I am thinking that the theory may have a few exceptions to it. Personally, I have zero experience to fall back on since I have never used anything but a nasal pillow mask.

Perhaps the extra pressure is due to slow leaks. Thanks, Pugsy.

Eureka wrote:Any time I make a change it seems to take a few nights to get used to it. Right now I am trying to adjust to the Hybrid mask. I need a FFM because I don't like using tape on my mouth. When I started this journey, a cousin said the mask was the hardest part of the whole thing -- and she was right. Hope you find something that works for you -- and soon!!!

(off topic, is that a dulcimer in your lap?)

Hi! I started out using the Swift FX nasal pillows mask and it was more comfortable than I had feared that a mask would be. What bothered me about it was the intensity of all that air flow going directly into my nostrils. I had to use a chin strap with it also. I have tried several full face masks, none successfully as of yet. So then I decided to try a nasal mask, and am currently using the Resmed Softgel mask, along with the Respironics Premium chinstrap. This combination is working for me and is pretty comfortable. The Swift FX was the most comfortable in terms of how little "stuff" was on the face and head, but it felt like more pressure, since it was directed into the nostrils. The nasal mask feels like less air flow because it is not being blown directly up my nose.

I highly recommend the cpap library mask trial program. You can try out a mask for a week and just pay $14 which covers the shipping both ways. They give you the return shipping label, and since you have pre-paid it, you can just drop it off at the post office to return.

Jill

jilliansue wrote:Hi! I started out using the Swift FX nasal pillows mask and it was more comfortable than I had feared that a mask would be. What bothered me about it was the intensity of all that air flow going directly into my nostrils. I had to use a chin strap with it also. I have tried several full face masks, none successfully as of yet. So then I decided to try a nasal mask, and am currently using the Resmed Softgel mask, along with the Respironics Premium chinstrap. This combination is working for me and is pretty comfortable. The Swift FX was the most comfortable in terms of how little "stuff" was on the face and head, but it felt like more pressure, since it was directed into the nostrils. The nasal mask feels like less air flow because it is not being blown directly up my nose.

I highly recommend the cpap library mask trial program. You can try out a mask for a week and just pay $14 which covers the shipping both ways. They give you the return shipping label, and since you have pre-paid it, you can just drop it off at the post office to return.

Jill

Wow,I didn't know such a thing existed! I will look into it. Hoping they service outside the U.S.

nedi wrote:Yeah, I suppose I need to try to be a little more patient and maybe only change 1 thing at a time, and dial it in. I'm just desperate for rest. On the same topic, does the mask typically require more pressure than the pillows? Seems to in my case.

Are you talking more air pressure or more pressure on the straps?

It will probably take more pressure on the straps because there's more surface area.

A number of people say that full face mask may take more CPAP pressure than nasal masks because it can push your jaw back, making your throat collapse more easily. Some of the experts on binarysleep are quite adamant about it.

If the FFM jaw theory is correct, it probably affects some people badly, and some not at all.

Now for the obligatory warning about taping your mouth.

Taping your mouth risks suffocation or other problems if the machine quits blowing and you don't wake up with a nasal mask. You will be rebreathing your own exhaled air. Oxygen will decrease and CO2 will increase. This can cause you to sink deeper into unconsciousness and stop breathing. This is why the FDA requires all full face masks to have an anti-asphyxia valve.

Most people will wake up and be able to take the mask or tape off, but it's not a sure thing.

There is a risk of aspiration pneumonia if you vomit before you can get the tape off. Aspiration pneumonia is very bad. Google it.

Many people tape anyway despite the risks. The risk may be small, but you'll probably be doing this for the rest of your life so risks add up.

Interesting,I use both the swift FX and the nasal softgel. I tend to switch from one to the other as I find this gives the best results. The softgel gives me some nose bridge problems and the swift tends to lack stability. I find I dont need a chinstrap anymore as My tongue sticks to the top of my mouth quite well now. I do go to the trouble of changing the mask setting on the machine but its probably not necessary.

The mask trial is for US residents. I don't think they ship outside the US. Perhaps you could utilize it next time you are in the states.
http://www.cpaplibrary.com/mask-trials.html

Are mask issues causing you to wake often during the night? Obviously frequent awakenings make for lousy sleep. With the nasal pillows....what is the main problem? Same question with the full face mask? BTW which full face mask?

Is there something else disturbing your sleep? Do you feel like it is mainly mask issues or just having all this stuff in general?