Sleeping on my back

I'm hoping someone out there has an idea/suggestion on how I can stay on my back at night? I wear a full-face mask and a lot of nights I wake up on my side or my stomach and air is leaking out of my mask. I don't know what to do. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks!

Im sorry I dont have any tips on how to stay ON your back, as most everyone is trying to get off their backs, it usually being the worst position
for apnea events..

however, I have some tips on how to sleep on your side with your mask..

If you put your hand under your chin as if youre deep in thought, right hand if youre on your left side, vice versa for right side..
this will make a safety space for your mask.. you can train yourself to go to sleep like that.. I did.. it took awhile but it works..

Also if you put your head on the EDGE of the pillow, and put a pillow between your knees, and one under your arm, the three pillow
system, you are less likely to jostle about..

Also there are cpap pillows designed for this very problem.. just google cpap pillow and look at the models to choose from..
they have a special indention for full face masks..

I think if you use the three pillow system (small soft pillows) it will help keep you off your tummy..

Sleeping on your side generally results in fewer apneas, so tricks to keep the mask from leaking while on your side are certainly in order here. You might look into getting a buckwheat hull pillow. I purchased mine from cpap.com, and once I removed about 1/4 of the hulls it has really been a big help. The trick is to keep the mask stable, which probably means hanging part of your face off your pillow.

I agree with Elena88, you need to avoid sleeping on your back.

My AHI during the sleep study was 33, but it doubled to 65 when I was in the "supine position", i.e on my back.

Use whatever combination of pillows, etc to avoid back sleeping.

A contrarian view.

Sleep on your back with your body elevated at a slight angle. Your head should lean backwards.

Kevin G. wrote:A contrarian view.

Sleep on your back with your body elevated at a slight angle. Your head should lean backwards.

Kevin
The number one cause of obstructive sleep apnea is your tongue relaxing down your throat and blocking your airway.............if your head leans backwards and you are on your back it makes it sooooo much easier for your tongue to block your air.
We are not encouraged to sleep on our backs.
N

For those suffering from true OSA, sleeping on one's back is about the worst position that one can sleep in, for any variety of reasons.

If you are okay with sleeping on your side now that you know how bad sleeping on your back is going to be I have the following suggesting that works extremely well for me.

Go to your doctor and get a heavy dose of Viagra... 'use nightly as directed'. Then just before retiring take TWO Viagra pills (lasts longer). The results will be that you will now NEVER be rolling onto your stomache and smooshing the mask and it will have the added benefit of preventing you from rolling out of bed.

As to preventing you from rolling back onto your back.... all you need to do is get the room cooled right down and use a very heavy blanket well tucked in. Rest assured that rolling onto your back during sleep will result in an awakening in short order.

As to your mask leaking... this is one of the top challenges in finding your 'magic bullet' and I have found that in order of usefullness for myself.... nasal pillows have been the worst in terms of leakage as if I smoosh my nose into the pillow - gonzo! They either leak like a sieve or get crushed and turned into a pressure washer, drilling holes through my sinuses into my eyeballs. Nontheless I have bought a half dozen that I am going to try out when I get to it. In the meantime, my #2 worst choice in masks are nasal masks. I say this although I have found that the Mirage Activa LT with forehead brace and the Respironics Comfortgel with forehead brace both seal fairly well, take 'mild' pillow smooshing without increasing the leakage too badly and allow reasonable vision for watching television when a nap is bound to happen. My BEST choice in masks turns out to be the Mirage Quattro full face mask and I generally get very low leakage even when smooshed into the pillow and rolling around during the night. Funny thing is that I get 'face farts' while sitting and putting it on but once I lay down it seems to seal solidly. So I do my initial installation sitting, lay down and make any fine adjustments that may be necessary while laying in bed. So far so good but I am still going to try a few other masks to search for perfection (if it is out there).

Really, as a scientist and businessman, there is a finite formula for finding the 'magic bullet' to your XPAP treatment and without numbering things in order of importance, they include:
-getting a machine that will provide data feedback and using that data on a daily basis to see how you are doing and what is working for you.
- getting a pulse oximeter like the Contec CMS50E that records, comes with software, downloading the data every night and watching it for desats in SaO2 regularly.
- Finding the best mask(s) for YOU (wer are all different) that provides maximum comfort for minimum leak rate.
- Working with an educated and co-operative MD that will take the time and effort to discuss your results (that you will print out daily and keep in a binder).
-getting supplemental O2 infused if your nightime blood oxygen saturation dips or varies widely to ensure maximum L4 and REM sleep.
- ensuring that when you feel that you are approaching your magic bullet you are able to get a sleep study with EEG to see just how much L4/REM sleep you are getting.

Even without maximizing your REM sleep, treatment for OSA is critical as it will improve your bodily functions, especially your liver function, which is essential to so many processes. Low SaO2 is going to shoot your blood pressure up during the night and create a major health hazard. It needs to be watched closely. The final and end result of all of this effort will be the REM sleep; you will be healthier and feel tons better when you have achieved your magic bullet.

Talking seriously about sleeping on your back... this is something that you need to discuss with your MD's.... it may be that with XPAP therapy there is no reason for you not to sleep on your back. Or it may be that even with XPAP therapy that sleeping on your back is, as they say "contraindicated". The numbers coming out of your equipment will tell the tale on an ongoing basis as well.... and are thus very important for you to be watching.

You are in the right forum; take all of the advice with a grain of salt but keep in mind that many of us have been where you were and have the T shirt. I have reached the point where my nasal mask and full face mask both work for me as I need them to; my S9 Auto gives me the data I want and need along with my Contec CMS50E recording oximeter and I am now striving for an SaO2 level that is constant and above 90 % all night... preferably 95% and steady.... and am working on that. My oxygen concentrator is on order and my oxygen analyzer has already been ordered and should be on the way.

We each, in our own way, search for that 'magic bullet' that will give us maximum health and a good night of sleep while battling our demons. Keep at it. Be tenacious as a pit bull and never take "no" for an answer, nor "I don't know". I actually had one doctor tell me that "they didn't teach me about that in medical school". Sic.

We're here to help.

And if that Viagra doesn't work for you, I have a couple of acquaintances on here that will take it off your hands.

to nanwilson

Please excuse me if I get better sleep on my back. We are all different and thus we need to experiment and find what works for us. Rules such as not sleeping on your back can be helpful in finding what works but they should not be taken as absolutes

Yes, I also sleep on my back. It is the only sleeping position that is pain free for me. I have slept on my back, with cpap, for 8 years now (and longer than that because of Rheumatoid Arthritis). If I didn't sleep on my back I would not sleep at all - cpap or no cpap!

I have an AHI almost always under 2 (was under 1 on my M Series - under 2 on the System One), no leak problems and sleep a good 7 hours a night. My therapy is working very well for me but I have to sleep on my back to be able to sleep at all.

You are right Kevin G, these "rules" about not sleeping on your back are NOT absolute.

The rules about sleeping or not sleeping on your back are not absolute but one must point out that OSA is heightened by sleeping on one's back. That is all. And then take it from there. If, in fact, XPAP therapy resolves the OSA issues while sleeping on your back there is no reason in the world not to. And this is from one who has arthritis and the most severe pain you can imagine on some nights from sleeping on my side. I often find myself awakening to sleeping.... on my back! However, I am also a pillow smoosher... so I have a bit of double trouble. Back sleepers have a major advantage in not having their masks messed about with by different pushes and shoves on them as they smoosh into the pillow. THE MOST important thing is to get that OSA/etc. under control so that your BP is normalized, your SaO2 is normalized and you are getting good REM sleep and body functions (especially that liver). Sometimes back sleeping has to be tempered with pain medications (contraindicated in OSA sufferers) taken at night. I was on Oxycodone at one point the pain was so bad and they wanted me to go to a methadone clinic to get off it... nonsense. I cut back and then eliminated it, going to Oxycocet and then cut back and eliminated that. I am presently on Tylenol #2's at bedtime and intend to even eliminate those if I can as I'm not sure they do any good in an event.... excepting to suppress my autonomic breathing, especially during REM, where I need all the help I can get.

As I say in my post, this is not rocket science but rather more of an art in finding your 'magic bullet' and it can be done in a rational and logical manner but it takes time and sometimes sacrifices need to be made. What sacrifices are only for you to decide along with your MD's perhaps. You ARE on the path. Keep at it! You ARE on the path.

I never sleep on my back anymore, because I think my apnea is somewhat positional. If YOU HAVE to sleep on your back due to injury, surgery, etc.
I did it using pillows under my arms, one under each arm. Also if you put a pillow under your knees, that helps..

I did an experiment last night, and put pillows on either side of me and slept on my back.. normally on my side, my ahi is under two or one.
I had 0.3 one night when I slept on my tummy..
When I slept on my back last night it was seven. I dont have any health issues where I would have to sleep on my back, so I will stay on my side.
(Also sleeping on your left side is supposed to be better if you have acid reflux, which many osa people have)

here is a graph on my back from last night of five hours. This tells me personally, not to sleep on my back.

elena88 wrote:I never sleep on my back anymore, because I think my apnea is somewhat positional. If YOU HAVE to sleep on your back due to injury, surgery, etc.
I did it using pillows under my arms, one under each arm. Also if you put a pillow under your knees, that helps..

I did an experiment last night, and put pillows on either side of me and slept on my back.. normally on my side, my ahi is under two or one.
I had 0.3 one night when I slept on my tummy..
When I slept on my back last night it was seven. I dont have any health issues where I would have to sleep on my back, so I will stay on my side.
(Also sleeping on your left side is supposed to be better if you have acid reflux, which many osa people have)

here is a graph on my back from last night of five hours. This tells me personally, not to sleep on my back.

Holy shmagegies elena88! I couldn't even count all of those apnea events. I don't want to get off on a tangent but have you tried to address them? I was having at least as many or more and adjusting the APAP pressure range upward slightly brought me down eventually to one or perhaps two at most each night. There are many nights where I have zero now. Your mask looks pretty well sealed too. Got to be pressure being presented when an apnea event presents itself. I got my leak rate down. Then I adjusted my pressure range (all over the place to be honest until I hit my 'sweet spot') to get rid of the events. Now I'm working on stabilizing my SaO2.

Thanks everyone for replying! I think I'm going to try sleeping on my side and use extra pillows to keep from sleeping on my back. Whether or not it's good to sleep on my back, I can't seem to stay on it anyway. So I guess I will try more effective ways to sleep on my side without letting air escape from under my mask. Might have to look into some of those cpap pillows, but they're kind of expensive (50, 60 bucks). Anyway, thanks agan, I really appreciate everyone's input!!

db238 wrote:Thanks everyone for replying! I think I'm going to try sleeping on my side and use extra pillows to keep from sleeping on my back. Whether or not it's good to sleep on my back, I can't seem to stay on it anyway. So I guess I will try more effective ways to sleep on my side without letting air escape from under my mask. Might have to look into some of those cpap pillows, but they're kind of expensive (50, 60 bucks). Anyway, thanks agan, I really appreciate everyone's input!!

Until you can get a cpap pillow, just practice hanging your face on the side of the pillow, like its a little cliff, and do put another pillow
under your arm, and between your knees, it will make it much easier to stay on your side.. I know you wear a full mask, have you tried the
nose pillows and failed? I find it much easier to not have leaks with the nose pillows, but that is just me..

Holy shmagegies elena88! I couldn't even count all of those apnea events. I don't want to get off on a tangent but have you tried to address them? I was having at least as many or more and adjusting the APAP pressure range upward slightly brought me down eventually to one or perhaps two at most each night. There are many nights where I have zero now. Your mask looks pretty well sealed too. Got to be pressure being presented when an apnea event presents itself. I got my leak rate down. Then I adjusted my pressure range (all over the place to be honest until I hit my 'sweet spot') to get rid of the events. Now I'm working on stabilizing my SaO2.

HI TCPG,
thanks for checking out my graph... this only happens on my back, so its not a big deal, and whether I have a higher ahi, or a low ahi, I feel the same way
in the morning.. Im such a werido..