UPDATE: Respironics FullLife Mask - Release on July 20

[jqp]

I'm sorry you're so confused. I'll speak slower.

Government can't fix the apathy and stupidity of Apria employees.

[jdm2857]

No, they can't fix Apria.

But if they break the cozy insurer-DME relationships and allow you to go to any DME, you can take your business elsewhere.

[jqp]

Actually, I do have several options. (Apria, Lincare, plus several smaller shops)

I've found they're all just as worthless.

I would love it if Aetna would pay me back for a CPAP.com order. I tried filing for my Devilbiss Intellipap AUTO I bought out of pocket. The mountain of paperwork they wanted just wasn't worth it.

I can see, however, why Aetna would want you to go to a brick and mortar DME for liability reasons... the problem is, taking the advice of the DME is more detrimental than going it alone.

[jdm2857]

I am paying for my own equipment, so I don't have to deal with a DME. But from what I have read here, they are more of a problem than a solution.

But under the current system, the DMEs have financial incentives to make relationships with doctors and insurance companies, and none to make relationships with the patients, whom they just view as a source of endless complaints. Since you have at least a limited choice are you sure that you are using the best of the bunch?

[lfzguud]

No, they can't fix Apria.

But if they break the cozy insurer-DME relationships and allow you to go to any DME, you can take your business elsewhere.

...IF you can get the approval for any CPAP equipment in the first place. IF you can get a sleep test while you are still alive, IF we don't have to raise the Chinese National Flag over our government buildings first.

I have TRICARE - (military health insurance). It has taken me 14 months to get just one replacement mask because of all the government red-tape and "oops, we lost the paperwork."

I have my own cash and am already 'allowed' to take my business elsewhere. It just means the money comes out of my pocket twice - once for what I already pay for medical insurance and the second time for the products I have to get on my own while waiting for the government contract medical provider to come around.

[carbonman]

As usually, Apria is really making me mad!

But I am going for it anyway!

CAmonk, you go for it!
I hope you can hear me cheering you on.
Don't get mad.
Drive'em like a rented mule.

I'm love'n it...every minute.
Keep us informed.

Go the distance!

[vines]

I just with someone at my DME (Landmark) actually used a mask, or knew anything about a mask, or knew how to fit a mask, or knew more than just how to point to the shelves and say 'Here's what we've got. Which one do you want?'.

[Lesbesser]

1VKUU
I have tried many masks but this is the most user unfriendly one so far. Putting it on or removing it is quite troublesome. Respironics should copy the MOJO magnetic clips!
I cannot apply pressure to the nose region and it leaks air into my eyes.
Trying it with AutoVPAP the mask moves with the change of pressure.
Useless, don't waste your time and money.

[Eric_M]

No, they can't fix Apria.

But if they break the cozy insurer-DME relationships and allow you to go to any DME, you can take your business elsewhere.

...IF you can get the approval for any CPAP equipment in the first place. IF you can get a sleep test while you are still alive, IF we don't have to raise the Chinese National Flag over our government buildings first.

I have TRICARE - (military health insurance). It has taken me 14 months to get just one replacement mask because of all the government red-tape and "oops, we lost the paperwork."

I have my own cash and am already 'allowed' to take my business elsewhere. It just means the money comes out of my pocket twice - once for what I already pay for medical insurance and the second time for the products I have to get on my own while waiting for the government contract medical provider to come around.

I have tri-care as well (soon to be retired USAF, but have only been on CPAP for 2 months, so I have not ran into any of these issues (yet). Reading you post though almost makes me think it may be your DME. Fot this link I am about to post, I have no idea if they are good or not, but do know this, I went to create an account because I thought it may link me to some sort of store to look at prices or something, but all of the sudden it told me that someone would contact me. So later that day, they did call me.... told them it wasnt what I thought it was, but had some questions for them. They were telling me about a new mask, hose, filters and water tank every quarter and if you deploy they send you a years worth of stuff. I was like hmmmpppfff... interesting. They seem to specialize in tricare.. so maybe they can help.

http://www.militarysleepsolutions.com/index.asp

Good luck!

[socalmonkey]

LATEST UPDATE: Finally I got a definitive answer from the big "A", about getting this mask through them.

After, making numerous unanswered calls today, to the local DME therapist (who was suppose to be looking into this)... I then called the corporate office today. They directed to the local branch manager. After talking to him, and being told he would have someone call me. I finally did get a call from the purchasing manager (the person who can actually put it in there system).

I had to direct her to the Respironics FullLife product page, and then to the Part List page. She asked me some "medical necessity" questions, and then said she would contact the manufacture. Within 5 minutes, she called back to say the "FitPack" is on "back order", and did she want me to proceed. Yes, of course! "Back order"... I can live with that!

So finally, I have a contact person who has the authority to order it! And promises to keep me informed. We shall see.

No wonder the FitPack is back ordered... CPAP.com has 14 of them in stock! On-line suppliers are doing a booming business with this mask (or keeping the traditional DME's from ordering it).

So I am getting more hopeful I will be finally able to get this through my (in-network only) insurance soon!

[2ndGenCPAPgal]

MY REVIEW

I picked up the FullLife fit pack on Friday. Since I was one of the folks who was all excited about this mask I probably should have posted before this, but I kept hoping that I would like the mask more if I used it more nights. While I have adjusted some, I am still having some issues w/ this mask. After 4 nights and several naps, I don't think my opinion is going to change much without some lab ratting or other "comfort" modifications. I really really wanted to love this mask, but while it resolved some of the issues I had w/ my other mask it has its own (currently harder to deal with) issues. Right now I can only get data when my DME reads my card but once I get the software in a month or so I'll do another comparison "by the numbers."

First, I am very very glad I got the FitPack. Without it, I probably would have ordered the small (even with the benefit of the sizing guide). I think I must need a small+ or a medium- because neither is "just right." The small hurt and squeezed my nose just while trying it on (without pressure) and the chin part was all but in my mouth...the medium fixes both of those issues but is just tall enough that it is just as close to my eyes as the Quattro (an issue I was hoping to fix). After much back and forth, I decided to go w/ the medium. At least I got good at changing the cushion...which is pretty easy as long as you follow the directions they give.

The cushion is a pretty nifty design and I like this part a lot better than the typical seal and hard mask body that most other masks have. The cushion is pretty much the whole mask and it is just stabilized by the frame. The cushion seems to tolerate a better range of headgear tightness than the Quattro but I still found that I got a better seal with looser rather than tighter straps. I do find it difficult to get rid of every single leak and usually end up with a tiny one (can barely feel the air flow but definitely feel the coolness) near my mouth. Leaks from my mouth opening happen less easily than they do w/ my other mask, but they are still there.

The frame is more flexible than most mask bodies but still sturdy enough to support the cushion well. The frame seems a bit narrow for my rather round face and I found the longer "bars" that hold the chinstrap to be a bit annoying against my face. I had pictured the side pieces giving a bit of clearance and not sitting right next to the skin. I was finally able to sleep on my side with it pressed into the pillow and not be totally annoyed by it...finally. One other item to note is that the opening where air comes in is much larger than the opening on the Quattro (not sure about other masks). I could feel a difference at first but hardly notice it now.

The headgear is the part that I have the most trouble with. Between the pieces of frame that it attaches to and the headgear itself, it feels like there is a lot of "stuff" around my lower jaw area. This took the longest for me to begin to tolerate. It still bugs me but the other night I was able to fall asleep without thinking about it as much as previous nights. The chinstrap definitely does a lot to help with leaks near the nose and eyes so I don't see that removing it is an option even though I dislike the feel of it in general, find the fabric itchy and have some slippage issues due to my extra chin. (I'm considering making my own substitute). All in all, there is just too much headgear and too many pieces and straps going all over the place. It requires a lot more "futzing" to get things right because each piece seems to change how the other functions. However, I do like being able to just flip the head piece off and let the mask dangle around my neck if I have to get up in the middle of the night. From what I have read they purposely eliminated the clips, but I think that is just going to be a bigger problem in the long run.

I see the lack of clips being a problem over time for several reasons:
1. You can put on/remove the mask without undoing any of the velcro, but I have concerns about how quickly it will wear out the neck strap because I have to stretch mine a good bit to get it back over my head.
2. The straps are a bit too narrow and I found myself having to re-do the velcro several times to keep any of the hard-loopy part from extending off the edge of the strap and ending up next to my face.
3. They could make the design of "comfort accessories" (like PadaCheeks) rather complicated. It looks like they will require something other than the wrap around or tube that currently works. This is compounded by the way the frame works too. While I don't use them for my other mask, I would definitely be interested in them for this one.
4. It makes for an awkward attachment of the chin strap. One end has a wrap around w/ velcro (like all the other parts) and the other is just folded over by about 1/4" to make it thicker so it can't slide through the frame easily. This raises concerns for durability with multiple cleanings for me.

Someone else had mentioned that putting the hose up over your head caused problems w/ fit and I found the same thing to be the case. I was able to fix this by still bringing the hose over the headboard but giving it more slack so that it ends up being more off to the side. Oh, and one odd issue is that for some reason the Auto-on feature doesn't work with this mask...it even makes mention of it in the instruction booklet. Side sleeping actually seemed to help my seal. The tiny leak that I mention above seemed to disappear once my head was on the pillow.

Probably way more than y'all needed/wanted to know. To sum it all up, overall, I'll probably end up switching off between the the FullLife and the Quattro because I like/dislike both for different reasons. And the search for mask utopia continues...

[mindy]

Thanks very much for the detailed review ... it was not too much info ... as a matter of fact I think it is *very* useful! I'm planning on trying this one (I also have the quattro for my FFM) and suspect I'll probably end up doing the same thing - swapping back and forth.

I keep thinking "the next mask will be different..." but I have quite a few. It takes me some months to decide if a particular mask won't work at all or if it will work in rotation

Mindy

[carbonman]

I held one in my hand last night.
I felt the pull....I felt the disturbance in the FORCE.....
against my better judgement, I put it to my face...
to feel the seal.....
I ran my fingers over it and caressed the creases of the seal.....
I fondled the frame and headgear.....
...and it called out my name......softly.....
...and I wanted it.

But, on this night, Obi-Wan and Yoda were with me....
the FORCE was strong w/in me.....

and I walked away.

GeneralCPAPgal, GREAT! review.

As I read the reviews, I applaud my own strength and courage to "walk away".

I applaud everyones efforts to deal w/de lure of de mask.
Thank you all for your reviews and those (CAMonk) that are determined to
have this mask in their hand through their DME, forge on.....
I'm w/you, I believe in you, you can and WILL do it.

Feel the FORCE.

[jdm2857]

I don't know about Respironics, but ResMed instructs that SmartStart (auto on/off) will not work properly with full-face masks.

Thanks for the excellent report. Lengthy posts are not a bad thing if they contain useful information. Yours does.

[mindy]

Ah yes, Carbonman - I need to FEEL THE FORCE! I think THE FORCE will drag me kicking and screaming away from more masks now that I'm working part time only and $$$ are much scarcer

Mindy