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Like the fellow said, turn off the flex and auto, Ramp. Set it for a straight pressure, and see what happens.

I did that last night. I managed to get in 6 hours of sleep using my Eson mask.

Glad to hear that. Now, stick with it.


Den

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But I was getting 4 to 6 hours before I did that to the machine. And last night was no picnic. I was up and down all night. I just want to lay down to sleep, uninterrupted, for 8 hours. I have yet to do that.

You're doing as well as most newcomers - it might take a year to get to 8 good hours of sleep. Be Patient.

MASK FITTING:
When I first started, I would get super pissed when a mask didn't work for me the first night. Or even the second. I followed the instructions that came with the mask. I watched videos. It must not be the right mask for me, is what I thought. I wasn't wrong about them being the wrong masks, but I was wrong about them being completely horrible. For one reason or another, none of them eventually worked out. What I did learn, however, is that it takes WAY more tweaking to get the mask to fight properly than any of the instructions (written, video, etc.) would have you believe.

My solution for this (not mine really; I got it the tip from this forum, but it did work for me), is to take your mask and machine to the bathroom, and fit the mask while standing in front of the mirror. It's kid of a PITA to drag everything in there, but well worth the hassle. The way I sleep (on my back; I had to adapt, as I can't wear these masks sleeping on my stomach), my chin tends to tuck in toward my chest. So, when I get the mask fitted properly (in front of the mirror with the machine on), I'll tuck my chin. Of course, this creates leaks. So, I'll then make any other fitment corrections so that it is as leak-free as possible. This way, you don't have to screw with it too much every time you go to bed. There will always be minor adjustments every night, but they're easy to deal with at that point.

COLD, CLAMMY NOSE:
I assume you've tried the machine without the heated hose? If not, maybe no heat would help with the col, wet feeling on your nose. If not, is there any way that you could raise your room temp at least 2 degrees? You'd be surprised at how much of a difference that can make. I generally keep my place at 68 degrees (it really dry out here as well; not sure how much of a difference that makes), and I've only gotten rainout once.

my 2 cents for mask fitting... sometimes tight is too tight. I fought my first and second mask big time for leaks. Then my 3rd I started to think that I must be doing something wrong. I started over with mask 3 - loosened everything up and started loose, turned the machine one and very slowly made adjustments. Eventually I did get it to work - for me it took a fee nights of slight adjustments to get it comfortable and mostly leak free. The mask is much looser that I thought is should be originally.

kona0197 wrote:But I was getting 4 to 6 hours before I did that [changed to fixed pressure and turned flex and the ramp off as per Wulfman's intructions] to the machine. And last night was no picnic. I was up and down all night.

Contrary to what Wulfman seems to believe, not everybody does better on fixed pressure and not everybody can live without flex or ramp.

Question: When you say you were up and down all night, does that mean that you got less sleep last night than you've gotten in previous nights?

Here's my first sincere suggestion: If you were able to get more sleep last night than you were getting when the machine was set to Auto, keep the current settings. But if you got (substantially) less sleep than you have gotten when using the machine in Auto, set it back to Auto.

I think a major part of your current problems are aggravated by changing too many variables way too frequently. It takes time for your body to adjust to the feel of having a mask on your face and the sensation of air being blown down your upper airway. And when you keep changing things around, that makes it even harder for your body to sort out what the new "new" is supposed to feel like.

So once you figure out whether switching to fixed pressure was a net gain or a net loss, set the machine's settings where you want them to be and leave them there for at least a week or two.

Next: The constant changing of masks is making it harder for you to learn how to sleep with a particular mask on your face. I understand that you are fighting leaks and dislike the chinstap. But constantly swapping the mask around makes it even harder for you to figure out what kind of tweaks might be possible to make a particular mask work better for you.

You write:

The most comfortable are the F&P Eson, F&P Pilairo (when it's not making my nose clammy and cold), and to a point the GoLife for men (when the straps are not digging into my cheek even with the headgear loose). The ones that are uncomfortable are the Full Face mask, Wisp, Nuance Pro, and a couple of FFM that I can't recall the names of.

If I were you, I'd pick either the FP Eson or the F&P Pilaro and try using them for at least a solid week---regardless of how bad the first couple of nights are.

My understanding is that the FP Eson is nasal cushion mask, which is a small nasal mask that covers the tip of your nose, but has a forehead support and a what looks to be a pretty substantial, but soft fabric headgear with a cushion that uses an "air seal" rather than a "gel" seal. The FP Pilario is a nasal pillows mask with a very minimal headgear. Figuring out how to make these two masks work requires using techniques that are quite different from each other.

Once you pick one of these two masks, you need to use it for at least 5-7 days in a row. You could start out by trying to use the mask without a chinstrap for a night or two. At this point, don't worry about any data except for the leak line and how long did you manage to sleep with the mask on each night. And I mean estimate the actual sleep time with the mask. Don't count the time you wear it while watching tv in an effort to get used to the mask.

Analyze the leak line in the morning and also keep a log of how long you think you slept with the mask each night and what ever your impressions are about how rough the night was. For the leak data you want to see just how bad the leaks are on paper to try to determine whether there's a lot of mouth breathing going on. If you can't find the leaks that bugged you during the night in the data, you'll know the problem is small, but irritating leaks most likely around the edges of the mask.

Once you finally figure out how to make one particular mask work--in terms of being comfortable enough to sleep with and in taming the small, but irritating leaks around the seal, you may find that the problem of taking the mask off all the time will start to resolve itself. If not, then that's the next problem that you'll need to work hard to fix.

I just want to lay down to sleep, uninterrupted, for 8 hours. I have yet to do that.

It is extremely important to have realistic expectations about CPAP. Until you manage to learn how to sleep with the mask of your choice on your nose, there's going to be some sleep disruption. But eventually things usually do get better: Your brain eventually learns how to fix small leaks without waking all the way up. Your brain eventually learns to trust the mask enough to quickly get back to sleep when you wake up in the middle of the night for no particular reason.

I meant to suggest in my last post (but forgot, obviously), that when you wear your mask while awake (in front of the TV, whatever), remove the SD card. Obviously, you'll need to remember to put it back in before you go to bed, but at least this way, you'll only ever be looking at "actual" data. Takes all the guess work out of trying to figure out when you used it for 2 hours in front of the TV, or when it was 3 hours, etc.

I also remember that there was something else that I was going to mention, but I cannot remember what that was for the life of me. I'm sure a lot of you can relate to that. Unfortunately. Maybe I'll remember later. Unlikely, but I can hope at the very least.

I have looked into those, and they never work for me. I'm almost 300 pounds. Having 3 or 4 blankets under me is the best way, and I sleep just fine that way.

You used to sleep fine this way but not anymore.
When you do sleep with your cpap machine, you sleep deeper and your body needs more support. I slept for many years on a hard futon, I was perfectly comfortable and didn't really like softer mattresses. After my first full night on cpap I was in lots of pain in my hips, neck and shoulders. I had to add a mattresses pad and duvet under me to survive the next night. Go to the charity shops and find foam yoga mats, camping mats, those foam multi coloured tiles for kids, old comforters and an air mattress. Even if it deflates some during the night by having a yoga mat under your hips and shoulders you will still have some support. If you lay on your side put a pillow under you upper knee to keep it from twisting your hips, this keeps you from pulling on the muscles which try to fight back by knotting up. Put a rolled up small towel in your head pillow to support your neck.
A comfortable supportive physical sleep environment is very important to sleep hygiene, the slightest discomfort will wake you or prevent you from sleeping. You don't need that at the moment.

kona0197 wrote: Not sure how to answer that as I am still experimenting with many masks. My DME lets me keep the masks because due to laws they can't take them back. I'm having good results with the F&P Eson, GoLife for Men, and F&P Pilairo. Problem is I still end up ripping each off my face in my sleep or right before I go to sleep. The Pilairo seems to make my nose real cold and damp, even with the humidifier set to maximum and heated tubing set to on. I would use the total face mask I just got if it would quit having so many leaks and fogging up.

I'm wondering if you try the Pilairo without the humidifier turned way down (or off). The heated tubing allows the air to stay warmer in the tubing and thus retain more of the moisture in the air and not have it condense on the inner walls of the tubing. The air thus contains more moisture and when it hits the mask pillows and your nose - if they are cold, then the moisture in the air will come out and condense on them. The moisture on the pillows and on your nose will then make it cold and clammy. And I believe you stated somewhere that you keep your room cool, so it may be likely that the mask and your nose are cold enough to draw that moisture out.

Thus my thought process is that you need less moisture in the air that comes out of the tubing - so turning down the humidity could help.

If you have good results with the Pilairo (which is what I'm using), you might find that the Airfit P10 may work for you. I found it to have a lot of the same benefits as the Pilairo (quiet, light, easy to use, minimal headgear).

--and a reminder: anybody can have a bad night once in a while.
They just get farther apart. (knock on wood)

kona0197 wrote:But I was getting 4 to 6 hours before I did that to the machine. And last night was no picnic. I was up and down all night. I just want to lay down to sleep, uninterrupted, for 8 hours. I have yet to do that.

I've been at this for almost 2 years now. I think I have managed 7 hours or more STRAIGHT for less than 10 times. Most nights, I have sleep sessions with the machine, the first around 4 hours, and the second around 2-3 hours. I still have problems taking off the mask. Sometimes I remember a drool issue or something. Sometimes I have no idea why it came off. Last night, I slept 3.9 hours with the machine, then about 1 1/2 hours without it, woke up for a bathroom break, then back to sleep for 3 hours with the machine until my alarm went off. So, about 7 hours with the machine and 1 1/2 without. That was a good night for me, even though I am disappointed that the mask came off. I really felt like I got up to use the bathroom only a few minutes after taking the mask off. I had more time in bed than a normal night as well.


This is not an easy road. But it does get better. My sleep quality, even in smaller sections is a ton better, and symptoms that I didn't even know were related are gone or much improved now.

I am actually going to start a new topic as I have really noticed a pattern in my quality of sleep. And if somebody here can help me figure it out, I may be able to improve my sleep and get 6+ hours STRAIGHT on a regular basis, something I have yet to achieve.

Keep in mind that this is a process and a lot of the improvements come in small steps, and rarely one huge leap. Even when I struggle, I keep at it, and that is why I try to read this forum every day. It keeps me focused on success and committed to the process.