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I live in a very dry climate, near the desert and appreciate warmed humidifcation very much in both summer (when we have no rain) and winter, when we have rain and central heating.

And the sound muffling is a great bonus too.

O.

Anonymous wrote:

Jerry69 wrote:Ric, the only reason I use the humidifier is because the CPAP seems quieter with it in place. I took it off and hooked the hose to the CPAP directly (after removing the ring gasket), but it seemed to make a noise. I'm a noise neurotic.

I tip my engineering hat in your direction! I had never thought of the HH as a muffler. But an EXCELLENT idea.

When I first got the APAP I also bought a 2ft, 6 ft, and 8ft hose, with connectors so I could have a 2,6,8,10,14, or 16 foot hose, to reach varying distances including in the closet, for the purpose of noise abatement. Now that I have the OZ hOZe I can go 22ft. If that didn't work I was planning to build a little house for it with high-tech acoustical insulation or carpet or something on the inside to make it quiet.

What I learned the hard way is that the tube serves as a stone-age intercom relaying audible signals from the machine to my face. That is, noise. (Not unlike the old-time intercoms they had aboard ships to talk from the captain's deck to the boiler room, etc.). So all the hose was mostly a waste. Actually putting it in the closet is still a good idea because the other person sleeping in the room will benefit from the diminished line-of-sight audio signals.

I had never thought of using a muffler. I see a whole new product line emerging. Great idea! <HIGH-5> <slap>

Have you considered filling your HH maybe half-way with cotton or something acoustically absorbent? No, probably not, sooner or later it would end up inside your mask. Or worse. I say don't.

Ric,

Maybe an egg crate of cardboard or plexiglass in the empty humidifier would prevent the noise transmission? Or, fill it full, or almost, of the sponge filter material? We don't won't to create too much resistance to the air flow, however. Baffles are what make an automobile muffler work. Or, in the old days, we used some called glas pacs to give a nice rumbling sound.

Jerry

LDuyer wrote:Jerry,

Goofproof is right in that cpap depletes the natural humidity in your throat. The humidifier, whether heated or not, is adding some humidity to replace what is lost due to cpap.

I notice you live in Florida. You may not need the heated humidification as much as those in colder dryer states, but there may come a time you could really benefit from the heated humidity. Better to have it and not use it heated than to find you need it later.

If I were you, I'd at least keep it as a passover so you're getting some moisture replacement even if not heated.

Also, you shouldn't have to replace the water or clean out the chamber every day. That might be necessary if you used tap. But most of us simply keep a jug of the distilled near the humidifier and refill. Maybe clean it rarely as needed, but distilled water keeps it pretty clean.

As an aside. I've been on cpap a year now.
Before that I used to have colds often. I swear, since the day I started cpap I've not had a single cold (knock on wood). I thought this was just a fluke, but I've heard some people report the same. Now that might not happen for everyone, and it might not have anything to do with using a humidifier, but I ain't changing it, just in case!

When I was a kid my folks added a house humidifier (not heated) and that made a world of difference in our home, and I feel there were less colds as well, for our whole family. Fluke? Maybe. But who knows.


Linda

Linda,

I used it as a passover (no heat) for several weeks, but I didn't like disconnecting and cleaning every day, as recommended by the DME. Most of you seem not to do this.

You say, "...clean it rarely, as needed." I will do this. I've been concerned about turning the heat on without water in the reservoir by accidentally pressing the 'Heat' button while trying to press the ramp button, especially while half asleep after a bathroom trip.

I'm a little concerned about mold getting in the reservoir, so I will be sure to clean it...at least once a week. Okay?

Jerry

Jerry69 wrote:Been on CPAP for a little over a month. Currently using the Remstar Pro II with integrated heated humidifier that my DME set me up with. But, I've not been heating the humidifier. I put water in it, but that's all. So, only the water that will evaporate at room temperature, 70 degrees, gets added to the air.

My question: why bother with the humidifier. Can't be doing that much.

Indeed a humidifier is an added feature to deal with a xPAP emergent symptom. Another “band-aid” to cover a “band-aid” compliments of our “modern medicine”.

Jerry69 wrote: And my DME left instructions to '...empty the reservoir and clean every day. Allow to dry before use.' Does that make any sense?

I suppose it does if your goal is to be sure that there are the fewest microbia involved in the system – and of course the DME might be found responsible for anything the microbia did...

Jerry69 wrote: And, I use distilled water in it, which is rapidly consumed with the above maintenance regimen.

Modern medicine is not known for economy.

Jerry69 wrote:Further, the logic of the humidifier escapes me. I've been breathing room air when I sleep for my entire life. Never used a room humidifier. Once lived in a house with very humid air in the summer (No AC) and very dry air in the winter. "But, we always cracked a window to combat the dryness.) Now, we use AC for most of the summer here in florida and a little heat in the winter. We still crack the window in the winter.

Apparently the use of CPAP changes things for many people but not so much for you.

Jerry69 wrote:Why should CPAP require humidification?

Indeed in terms of it's intended purpose the fact that it does tend to foster the need for added humidification (and how it does it) is contrary to it's intended purpose.

Jerry69 wrote: ( I tried heating the humidifier one night, but found it to be 'unnatural'. I couldn't feel the 'normal' cool air entering my nose.)

Your system has been processing cool air for a long time. It would not like the change I suppose.

Jerry69 wrote: I suppose the inclination is to say, 'But, you are increasing the air flow." I don't think that is the case. I think our flow is the same, i.e., whatever is required by the lungs to oxygenate the blood.

You are so right!!! With good chemoreflexes even adding a bit of pressure should be a small matter to compensate for. The air use should be the same as the metabolic issues have not changed. You are at rest and in bed so should use little air. You should use only the air you need to keep the body going (and apparently you do) - - but...

Jerry69 wrote: Granted, if we are in apnea or hypopnea a lot, we are not getting as much air flow, but that is the purpose of CPAP, isn't it: to reduce the apneas and hypopneas to 'normal.'

Well now there are indeed obstructive apnea and hypopnea true enough. But what about the “other kind” of apnea and hypopnea?

Indeed there are those poor souls who might well have an obstructive apnea but then follow it with a hypocapneic central apnea. The only thing that CPAP can help us with is preventing the closure of the airway by not letting the pressure fall below the “critical closing pressure”. But the pressure of CPAP, I do believe and as many in this thread have already attested, works toward increasing the amount of air used and so also works toward causing hypocapnic central apnea and hypopnea.

Jerry69 wrote:BTW, when I post, I don't use a lot of 'IMO's', because since I'm the poster, it is obviously 'IMO'.

Any thoughts?

Jerry

I am not a mouth breather. Yet sometimes while using CPAP I wake up with a dry mouth.

Consistently this clears as I bring my air use down to those levels more appropriate for being at rest and in bed.

While I do agree with those who have mentioned that there is increased air use and so more water would be moved away from the airway walls I think the bigger problem is a lack of circulation in those airway walls which limits the production and distribution of saliva and mucous along with the frustration of metabolism in the tissues of the airway. I believe that this is caused by less carbon dioxide in the blood (carbon dioxide washed out by the increased air use) and so vascular constriction and limited oxygen transport (Bohr effect) - - along with higher stress hormone levels from any events the CPAP either failed to prevent or caused.

Oh that we all were like you whose chemoreflexes seem to be good enough to well adapt to CPAP pressure. And I am glad that I can now use less pressure and so now no longer need and do not use a humidifier. But for many this “band-aid added to a band-aid” is likely helpful.

Todzo,

Thanks for your current responses to very old posts by me. (Was that really me? Seem as lucid as you. ) I'm still doing CPAP. I'm using the same Remstar machine at 10. But, I'm using the Quattro FX mask. I'm hosed for life.

Jerry

Jerry69 wrote:Todzo,

Thanks for your current responses to very old posts by me. (Was that really me? Seem as lucid as you. ) I'm still doing CPAP. I'm using the same Remstar machine at 10. But, I'm using the Quattro FX mask. I'm hosed for life.

Jerry

Hi Jerry!

Noticed that the post was old after I had composed my reply. I think someone posted a reply but then had second thoughts and withdrew the current post.

In the past ten years I have been able to reduce pressure by about half. In spite of age I still look forward to a time very much alive off the hose.

Have a lot of fun!

Todzo

Even a vote will push an years-old poll to the top.
If it brings an old cpap vet back to the fold--wonderful!
It's good to be reminded that long-term success is within reach.
Good health to you, Jerry.

Todzo,

When I joined this excellent forum, I was 69 and old, I thought. Now, I am soon to be 78. I am a happy camper and have many interests. I wish you the same.

I was a desperate new CPAPer, on the Swift Pillow, and felt like I was going to have an anxiety attack. I found this forum and it was like group thearpy. The Group pulled me through.

Jerry

I love it when a plan comes together...

And works!!!

Here is to your good health Jerry...

Jerry69 wrote:Todzo,

When I joined this excellent forum, I was 69 and old, I thought. Now, I am soon to be 78. I am a happy camper and have many interests. I wish you the same.

I was a desperate new CPAPer, on the Swift Pillow, and felt like I was going to have an anxiety attack. I found this forum and it was like group thearpy. The Group pulled me through.

Jerry

Glad to hear you are doing well.

The fact that you are happy without a humidifier likey means that your capacity to adapt to the pressure is good (you have good breathing "chemoreflexes"). I have come to see that as a key to making CPAP work long term.

I passed ten years on CPAP several months ago.

Jerry69 wrote:Todzo,

When I joined this excellent forum, I was 69 and old, I thought. Now, I am soon to be 78. I am a happy camper and have many interests. I wish you the same.

I was a desperate new CPAPer, on the Swift Pillow, and felt like I was going to have an anxiety attack. I found this forum and it was like group thearpy. The Group pulled me through.

Jerry

Isn't it amazing how one's definition of "old" changes as the years go by? At 10 you think 40 is positively ancient. Now, at 60, I think 100 is not beyond the realms of possibility, and I am planning to enjoy those years now that I have got myself under better control after sleep apnea - it is still there, but the treatment is effective! An AHI of 0 is not realistic, but I am feeling better now that mine has come down to 1.35 over the past year, and 0.91 over the last month! Jerry, I was not diagnosed when you were on here before, but it is great to see "old" folks come back and let the world know there is LIFE with CPAP. So, welcome back!

Goofproof wrote:BTW: Check for cops before hanging your head out of the window, most of them won't take kindly to the experment.

I'm watchin'...

Sheriff

I realized that I really didn't need a humidifier when my humidifier broke a few years back. Some folks like the comfort it provides, while others need it for sinus issues. Not using my humidifier reduces the "maintenance" I do for cpap therapy. I don't have to mess with the water, etc.... I encourage others to consider the need of a humidifier. If you are not sure, then go a week without it and see how you respond.

Sheriff

Sheriff Buford wrote:I realized that I really didn't need a humidifier when my humidifier broke a few years back. Some folks like the comfort it provides, while others need it for sinus issues. Not using my humidifier reduces the "maintenance" I do for cpap therapy. I don't have to mess with the water, etc.... I encourage others to consider the need of a humidifier. If you are not sure, then go a week without it and see how you respond.

Sheriff

Good advice, Sheriff. BTW, Sheriff Buford, played by Jackie Gleason, is one of my most memorable movie roles. Incredibly funny movie because of him. "...from my loins?"

Back to topic: I didn't really get comfortable with CPAP until I switched to the Activa nasal mask. But, I started puffing, so I had to go to the full-face type, presently on the Quattro FX...for quite a while. I still don't add water to the humidifier chamber but I leave it on the machine as it seems to "muffle" the sound.