CPAPtalk.com

M.D.Hosehead wrote:There is probably some selection bias at work here. Anyone who has ceased to have SA after losing weight will probably not be reading/posting on these boards.

Yes, both of them, and they probably still have sleep apnea, but being in De-Nile has allowed them to ignore the facts and cease treatment. Jim

old guy wrote:I did. Forget weight. Get off sugar, fluoride water and add magnesium supplements. Worked for me. Takes 4-8 months. Also add complete vitamin B to diet and plenty of Vitamin D3 plus oil.

If this gets posted I'd be happy to take questions. CPAP is a scam pushed by the same people wo gave you fluoride in the water. Fluoride is poison.

Fluoride in water is good stuff. It makes a big difference in dental health. We're finding out that tooth decay has a lot of long term debilitating effects. Fluoride occurs naturally in the drinking water in some areas in higher concentrations than treated water and has no obvious detrimental effects except at really high levels. Even then, it just darkens or damages the teeth.

Reducing sugar is probably good for most of us, but it's not magic. B vitamins and D3 only help if you have a deficiency. They're not something where more is necessarily better. Above a certain level, your body just throws away any excess. At some level, some vitamins become toxic, because your body can't dispose of them quickly enough. Many vitamin D supplements are at the high end of what's considered safe.

And if you think CPAP is a scam, you're obviously not very good at medical advice. The way they bill for it, and administer it is a ripoff, but the treatment itself is literally a lifesaver for many.

archangle wrote:

old guy wrote:I did. Forget weight. Get off sugar, fluoride water and add magnesium supplements. Worked for me. Takes 4-8 months. Also add complete vitamin B to diet and plenty of Vitamin D3 plus oil.

If this gets posted I'd be happy to take questions. CPAP is a scam pushed by the same people wo gave you fluoride in the water. Fluoride is poison.

Fluoride in water is good stuff. It makes a big difference in dental health. We're finding out that tooth decay has a lot of long term debilitating effects. Fluoride occurs naturally in the drinking water in some areas in higher concentrations than treated water and has no obvious detrimental effects except at really high levels. Even then, it just darkens or damages the teeth.

Reducing sugar is probably good for most of us, but it's not magic. B vitamins and D3 only help if you have a deficiency. They're not something where more is necessarily better. Above a certain level, your body just throws away any excess. At some level, some vitamins become toxic, because your body can't dispose of them quickly enough. Many vitamin D supplements are at the high end of what's considered safe.

And if you think CPAP is a scam, you're obviously not very good at medical advice. The way they bill for it, and administer it is a ripoff, but the treatment itself is literally a lifesaver for many.

Great post Archangle.

Just wanted to add that magnesium supplements are not harmless, particularly if you have a hypersensitivity to things like I do. Even when I tried taking a crumb of a mag supplement, my body rebelled big time.

Goofproof wrote:

M.D.Hosehead wrote:There is probably some selection bias at work here. Anyone who has ceased to have SA after losing weight will probably not be reading/posting on these boards.

Yes, both of them, and they probably still have sleep apnea, but being in De-Nile has allowed them to ignore the facts and cease treatment. Jim

Jim,

Do you have links to studies that show that losing weight does not get people off of the cpap? I think when I asked this before, someone said the success rate was not good with weight loss surgery in getting people off of the machine. But I am talking in general terms.

49er

The assumption here is being fat is the cause of SA. Not all SA is caused by Being FAT! I could weigh 90 pounds and still have sleep apnea.

I think there is evidence that at least some obesity is caused by apnea.
We can also agree that excess weight can complicate OSA.
It's a vicious cycle that some are not equipped to handle rationally.
Hence the denial.
"Ignore it and hope it will go away." is a sure-fire way to flush your health down the toilet.

Kam and CF, as a normal weight person with sleep apnea and who has thin relatives with it, I have no argument with your points. But again, because so many people on this board keep making claims that losing weight can't cure apnea, I am asking for links to studies that prove that contention.

And just so people know, I tried finding them myself and couldn't either way. Perhaps I am just not having a good search day but I did want to let people know I tried.

49er

49er wrote:Kam and CF, as a normal weight person with sleep apnea and who has thin relatives with it, I have no argument with your points. But again, because so many people on this board keep making claims that losing weight can't cure apnea, I am asking for links to studies that prove that contention.

And just so people know, I tried finding them myself and couldn't either way. Perhaps I am just not having a good search day but I did want to let people know I tried.

49er

Did you find studies showing weight loss "cures" apnea (and how "cure"
Is defined? Hard to prove a negative. But what are the stats for the opposite proposition?

Janknitz wrote:

49er wrote:Kam and CF, as a normal weight person with sleep apnea and who has thin relatives with it, I have no argument with your points. But again, because so many people on this board keep making claims that losing weight can't cure apnea, I am asking for links to studies that prove that contention.

And just so people know, I tried finding them myself and couldn't either way. Perhaps I am just not having a good search day but I did want to let people know I tried.

49er

Did you find studies showing weight loss "cures" apnea (and how "cure"
Is defined? Hard to prove a negative. But what are the stats for the opposite proposition?

Jan,

Sorry I wasn't clear as I haven't found studies supporting either position about whether weight loss cures apnea or not My point is that many posters on this board are stating claims that weight loss doesn't cure apnea as facts. I don't think we know either way.

49er wrote:

Goofproof wrote:

M.D.Hosehead wrote:There is probably some selection bias at work here. Anyone who has ceased to have SA after losing weight will probably not be reading/posting on these boards.

Yes, both of them, and they probably still have sleep apnea, but being in De-Nile has allowed them to ignore the facts and cease treatment. Jim

Jim,

Do you have links to studies that show that losing weight does not get people off of the cpap? I think when I asked this before, someone said the success rate was not good with weight loss surgery in getting people off of the machine. But I am talking in general terms.

49er

No! I dont, and don't care to. Links are just what others think, good and bad. I can think for myself. I dont have to worry about weight, it isn't going away for me, I have decided to bet my life on what works,XPAP treatment, I'd been dead 10 years ago without it. Not knowing I needed it almost put me in the ground. You won't find me "Blessing" any other treatment that doesn't keep my airway open at night.

Certainly any half baked study, too many fools out there with cred's withing and publishing, that in a few years are proven wrong. If you can't trust Pluto, who can you trust. I only trust people the invent and produce products, not people that produce words for a living. Jim

49er wrote:

Janknitz wrote:

49er wrote:Kam and CF, as a normal weight person with sleep apnea and who has thin relatives with it, I have no argument with your points. But again, because so many people on this board keep making claims that losing weight can't cure apnea, I am asking for links to studies that prove that contention.

And just so people know, I tried finding them myself and couldn't either way. Perhaps I am just not having a good search day but I did want to let people know I tried.

49er

Jan,

Sorry I wasn't clear as I haven't found studies supporting either position about whether weight loss cures apnea or not My point is that many posters on this board are stating claims that weight loss doesn't cure apnea as facts. I don't think we know either way.

DOCTORS routinely tell their patients that weight loss will cure apnea--with no evidence. What they are really saying is "you lazy fatass, you caused this. Quit stuffing your pie hole and get out there and exercise." Fat shaming, patient blaming.

All I can speak to is my N=1. 75 lbs down and I still have severe apnea.

Janknitz wrote:

49er wrote:

Janknitz wrote:

49er wrote:Kam and CF, as a normal weight person with sleep apnea and who has thin relatives with it, I have no argument with your points. But again, because so many people on this board keep making claims that losing weight can't cure apnea, I am asking for links to studies that prove that contention.

And just so people know, I tried finding them myself and couldn't either way. Perhaps I am just not having a good search day but I did want to let people know I tried.

49er

Jan,

Sorry I wasn't clear as I haven't found studies supporting either position about whether weight loss cures apnea or not My point is that many posters on this board are stating claims that weight loss doesn't cure apnea as facts. I don't think we know either way.

DOCTORS routinely tell their patients that weight loss will cure apnea--with no evidence. What they are really saying is "you lazy fatass, you caused this. Quit stuffing your pie hole and get out there and exercise." Fat shaming, patient blaming.

All I can speak to is my N=1. 75 lbs down and I still have severe apnea.

No argument there and the fact that they engage in fat shaming is disgraceful. Even though I have been thin for several years, I have never forgotten how I was treated by doctors when I was overweight.

But at the same time, I don't think it is good to claim that losing weight won't prevent apnea when we don't know either way. Everyone is different.

My sleep doc tried to blame my weight. Sorry pal, I used to weigh 100 lbs more than this and did not have apnea. So he switched tack and said it was my age combined with weight. I said that's interesting so how do you explain my husband's apnea? He is skinny and even had UPPP surgery years ago. Still had apnea while young. He continued with his speech about how I need to lose 10% of my body weight. Um, how about NO? Dieting helps nothing and just turns me into an insane, eating-disordered wreck.

As Joe50 says, lose the weight and see what happens. I think I read that roughly half of those who have gastric bypass no longer need a cpap after losing a lot of weight. The thing is, don't make it a goal. I remember in Weight Watchers, all these folks who lost weight and could eliminate their diabetes meds. I felt cheated when I lost weight and had to Go On diabetes meds. I didn't find out until some years later that the med I was on for a long time increases risk of developing diabetes. So not only did it not work, but it created a new problem.

It probably just depends on the person. My Dr said he was on a cpap, lost weight and got off it. He said if he puts weight on he has to get back on the machine. Seemed odd to me but I was more concerned about me than him at the time. Losing weight is a good thing regardless, if you need to. My personal opinion is BMI is flawed anyway. It's a bad system that assumes one size fits all. I'm trying to drop a few pounds with no intention of it impacting my cpap. I expect to use it until I'm fertilizer.