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Seven Nights on Autoset II - Going Well

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 5:03 pm
by macmermaid
Just thought I’d share where we are after my husband’s first week on Autoset II. Sorry this is such a long post!

We are very open to opinions you might have about the results, how we’ve interpreted them, and what we are planning to do. We just hope we can keep this from becoming another duel over CPAP vs. APAP. We made a choice to follow our doctor’s prescription for the machine to start with for one week, and then decide if we wanted to try some other settings, like narrowing the bracket for APAP, or trying straight CPAP mode.

Seven nights on APAP with settings from 4 – 20 (as prescribed by the doctor), and the bottom line is that we don’t seem to have enough experience yet to move from the current pressure settings. We have gotten some great results after working out some kinks, but haven’t had much experience without major kinks. Not that we don’t want to test some other settings, we just think it would be premature right now.

The most important measure for us is not necessarily the results reported by the machine, but how well my husband feels. We’ve been tracking the machine results numbers, but also two other subjective measures – how my husband feels the next morning compared to how he felt pre-APAP, and how well he thinks he slept. Several nights he thought he was awake a good part of the night because he: 1) was too excited about possibly getting a good night’s rest; 2) the mask was tugging when he moved in bed; 3) rainout; 4) dry mouth. We worked on all those things – getting a well-functioning hose hanger, cover for the hose, trying different humidifier settings, just getting into a routine with the equipment. The AHI readings from the machine during the seven days were all under 7.0, and if adjusted to cut out half the hypoapneas, less than 3.1. We realize those numbers are not the same as what a sleep study would measure, but fairly good for this machine.

The seventh night (last night), was the best night for my husband. He feels like he slept well AND he feels significantly more awake, rested and alert. This is the first time he gave me very positive ratings on both those subjective measures. However, last night the machine didn’t report the best results – he had a lower AHI on three other nights and lower leak rates on several other nights. The problem is, these numbers aren’t very comparable if he was awake for significant parts of some nights and if we were making major changes to the humidifier settings and hose management.

We are currently at a humidifier setting of 2.0. My husband still feels a bit of dry mouth in the morning, so he would like to go higher, but then he suffers from rainout, despite our hose hanger, hose cover and space heater. I think we may try the aussie-heated hose or the reptile cable. He despises the rainout – probably like most of you. Our home-made hose hanger solution is working great. He says he can move all around and doesn’t feel the mask move. We were going to get the Hozer, but this seems to be doing the trick.

Even though he had his best night last night, his leak rates were not the best for the week, but sort of in the middle. The 95th percentile liters / minute number ranged from 3.6 to 13.2, and was 7.2 last night.

If I throw out the extremes, pressure variations were narrow:
- Med pressure between 7.0 and 7.8
- 95th percentile between 10.4 and 10.8, and
- max between 11.8 and 12.6.
- min between 4.0 and 5.0

Should we try to narrow the bracket? To something like 7 to 12? Or try a straight CPAP setting of 10? Maybe, but I’d like to see how the numbers look if he continues to have nights as good as last night. Before we test out any other pressure settings.

The other thing we might do is turn on EPR.

To summarize, this is our plan:
1. Continue on the same pressure settings for another week and re-evaluate
2. Try the reptile cable to heat the hose (cheapest option first!)
3. Experiment with EPR

Re: Seven Nights on Autoset II - Going Well

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 5:07 pm
by KatieW
Do you have the software? It would be useful for others to see your data, in order to offer an informed opinion.

Glad your husband is feeling better though. I'm sure your support and involvement has been a tremendous help to him.

Re: Seven Nights on Autoset II - Going Well

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 5:11 pm
by Uncle_Bob
If you are experiencing an improving trend then i would stay with it until you reach a plateau.

Then try the next thing on your plan. Its very tempting to change things to quickly.

Just my 2¢ Good luck

Re: Seven Nights on Autoset II - Going Well

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 5:25 pm
by tattooyu
Very nice methodology macmermaid. I'm impressed. I was bit more haphazard in my changes, and certainly less statistical.

Since your 95th centile is roughly at 10.6-10.8, barring any comfort issues, you might try a straight CPAP at 11 cm. With EPR @ Level One: 12 cm, EPR @ Level Two: 13 cm, and EPR @ Level Three: 14 cm.

For APAP on an Autoset II, and your 95th centile being closer to 11 cm, my opinion would be to run pressures around 11-14. That way you know most events will be picked up.

Re: Seven Nights on Autoset II - Going Well

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 5:33 pm
by macmermaid
Does anybody know how I can paste a picture of my spreadsheet that will maintain the formatting? When I try to copy / paste, it loses all the formatting and the columns of my table get all out of whack.

Re: Seven Nights on Autoset II - Going Well

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 5:39 pm
by Wulfman
If you're going to run it in APAP mode for awhile longer, I'd suggest moving the minimum pressure up to at least 8 or 9. Since it's going up slightly higher than 10, the machine needs to be be closer to those numbers to respond sooner.


Den

Re: Seven Nights on Autoset II - Going Well

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 5:41 pm
by KatieW
macmermaid wrote:Does anybody know how I can paste a picture of my spreadsheet that will maintain the formatting? When I try to copy / paste, it loses all the formatting and the columns of my table get all out of whack.
Here's a link to instructions, written by Pugsy:

viewtopic/t47041/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=46 ... ot#p413222

Re: Seven Nights on Autoset II - Going Well

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 5:42 pm
by tattooyu
Have tried wrapping it inside of a quote code?
  1. Paste the text into your post.
  2. Highlight the text.
  3. Click on the "Quote" button next to Underline.

Re: Seven Nights on Autoset II - Going Well

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:36 pm
by Muse-Inc
macmermaid wrote:...1. Continue on the same pressure settings for another week and re-evaluate
He's making progress. Too many changes too often slow the brain's progress in learning it won't have to fight the slow suffocation of apnea. I'd go for Option 1 and let another week go by at those settings...tho if he complains it's not enough air, I'd bump the initial pressure to 5...most of us find 4 is just too low. If you're collecting titration info for the doc, I'd not change the pressure setting until the doc's seen 'em...unless that's wks away (call and schedule earlier if so).

Re: Seven Nights on Autoset II - Going Well

Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 10:02 am
by macmermaid
Well, it took me a while, but finally!!!!

Definitions are below the table for acronyms you don't recognize.

Image

AAHI = Adjusted AHI - 1/2 Hypoapnea Index plus Apnea Index

SQR = Sleep Quality Rating - User rating of how successful sleep was.
0 = First hour awake - Worse than pre-CPAP
1 = First hour awake - The same as pre-CPAP
2 = First hour awake - Better than pre-CPAP
3 = First hour awake - Much better than pre-CPAP

RO = Rainout
DM = Dry Mouth

SCR = Sleep Comfort Rating - User rating of how much sleep happened.
0 = Slept very badly.
1 = Slept not great, but not too bad.
2 = Slept OK but could be better.
3 = Slept good.

Pressure - Min: Minimum pressure observed after intial ramp.

Leak - Spikes: Count of spikes greater than 7.0

Other: Changes, comments
A. "I felt like I tossed and turned all night, could not get comfortable, did not feel like I slept that much".
B. "I didn't feel like I slept at all - had bad rainout."
C. Hose hanger, space heater, cover added. "Hose hanger is excellent, no rainout, still had toruble falling asleep and felt like woke up early".
D. "Felt foggy when I first woke up, like I used to all the time, then I noticed a difference when I woke up more."
E. "Rainout again. Feel better, but not as much better as I was hoping. Not better than yesterday."
F. "Still some rainout. Slept OK. Not sure.
G. "Slept good"