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BP,

Don't drive yourself crazy. If you feel the machine is working correctly, in the grand scheme of things, 17 hours is not a lot. You will put tens of thousands of hours on it, hopefully, if the machine holds up. Personally, if you got a returned/refurbished machine, there is also a great chance that absolutely nothing will be wrong with it because it would have already been checked out and anything that wasn't working right replaced/fixed.

In life, I find the least you upset yourself over things that don't HAVE to upset you, the better off you are. Now if only my BP would listen to that advice...really, I hope you're happy with the machine. It will also take some getting used to as with everything new, except Bentleys and Mercedes Benz's and the like. You get used to new ones of those right away...not spoken from experience .

I have the Autoset Spirit and there is definitely an up and down whining to it that drives me crazy LOL The ole Sullivan had a nice steady whir to it that put me to sleep

I have fans going as background noise so I couldn't hear either machine. When I turned off the fans to listen, the 420e and the remstar auto had about the same noise level. But, I could hear both inhale and exhale on the 420e
and only inhale on the remstar. I do love the small size of the 420 e. I am not using the humidifier, I will put that on in the winter.
I critiqued my 420e when I got it, and people got a little hot when I prefered certain things about the remstar. What are your other observations about the two machines. I still like the remstar buttons better--much easier to push. Once I FIND the 420 buttons they don't always respond to an easy touch. More than once I have turned it off and gone back to bed only to find it still blowing happily when I wake up. Also in pushing 2 buttons to program the machines, the remstar is much easier. Still I would choose the 420e again because of the size. It also doesn't look like hospital equipment.

More than once I have turned it off and gone back to bed only to find it still blowing happily when I wake up.

The machine is trying to tell you something important, seagull.

The machine is trying to tell you something important, seagull.

Read my mind, RG.

BP wrote:

whereas with the 420e the noise seems to be focused down the hose at the mask.

This reminds me alot of my concerns when I trialed a 420E WITHOUT a humidifier. To me, it seemed as though the sound of the machine travelled right down the hose to my face.

However, I ended up purchasing a 420E and the PB H2O humidifier -with the humidifier, no noise at all.

So, are you using a humidifier? If so, are you sure that the seal between the machine and the humidifier is a good one. Pull the silicone coupler off the 420E, don't turn it around or change its orientation in any way, and push it firmly onto the humidifier tank. Then, firmly insert the tank into the humidifier base, ensuring the the coupler lines up well with the machine.

Lori, thanks again for the kind words. I'll try not to drive myself crazy. It's funny, I've only been at this a couple weeks now, but things were going really well. From the very first night I've had 100% compliance, and for the last four or five days I've been sleeping really well. So I feel very good about that. I just didn't anticipate how different these machines can sound, and react. So I guess I'm going to have to start all over with getting used to a new machine. I've got both machines set up on my nightstand so that I can try and use the 420e, and if I just can't get to sleep I can switch over to the Remstar for the remainder of the night. Hopefully, in a couple of weeks I'll get used to the 420e.

Seagull, as far as comparisons:
- The 420e is tiny, that hits you immediately when you look at it.
- Overall, the Remstar seems a bit more rugged to me.
- I really don't see any difference in the usability with the buttons. I understand where you're coming from but to me it doesn't seem that much difference.
- The 420e is noisier to me, obviously. With the Remstar I just don't get the seesaw effect on inhalation and exhalation.
- I like the silverlining software, although the serial connection is a bit archaic. However, since my Remstar is not an auto I can't compare the software.

Will, I have tried it both with and without the humidifier. I do agree it is quieter with the humidifier, but I still notice the increased noise. I haven't done the resealing of the rubber seal yet. I'll try that and post a response.

Thanks everyone for all your help, I'm determined to get this problem resolved.

-BP

WillSucceed wrote:BP wrote:

whereas with the 420e the noise seems to be focused down the hose at the mask.

This reminds me of my concerns when I trialled a 420E WITHOUT a humidifier. To me, it seemed as though the sound of the machine travelled right down the hose to my face.

However, I ended up purchasing a 420E and the PB H2O humidifier -with the humidifier, no noise at all.

Both myself and a friend who have S8s (at the moment without the 3is) think that it is very noisy. He likened it to a small seaplane taking off. This noise also comes through the tube not from the actual unit. I was quite concerned at first until it dawned on me that the humidifiers act as a significant baffle.

He has persevered without the 3i h/h and says he is ok with it (despite the obvious noise). We have our 3is on the way & hopefully within a few days can report back on the difference.

DSM

How about putting on the humidifier NOW, instead of waiting until winter, and maybe just not turning the humidfier on, to see if that helps, just using it as a baffle.

I like my new 420E soooo much better than my previous Remstar Auto, so I guess its personal preference. I even prefer the buttons on the 420E. Easier to find them in the dark and work them by braille than the Remstar Auto which I tended to hit the wrong ones, during the night with my glasses off.

MY Remstar Auto made a LOUD mosquito whine noise that ruined my sleep almost as bad as Apnea for 2 years, while everyone insisted it was "normal". The 420E makes a lower tone whirring that is MUCH quieter and more importantly less irritating in its frequency to ME. But it doesn't SEEM to match the noise you are experiencing. I sort of wonder if ALL these machines just have quite a bit of variability in sound from unit to unit and its more luck of the draw than anything?

I don't remember my 420E having any hours on it when it was new. I do wonder if they attempted some extensive "debugging" at the manufacturer, and finally figured "good enough".

Definitely make sure you have a good seal when you add the humidifier. That is a bit tricky to make sure that gasket is seated properly.

I am REALLY liking the smallness and simplicity of my 420E so far. I am still working on getting the software to figure out what my results are.

BP,
I've observed the same noise issue, although perhaps not as much as you. I can't use either my Remstar or my 420e without a humidifier because of the noise traveling up the hose. With humidifiers, both are tolerable, although the 420e is still noisier. You're right; earplugs almost seem to make it worse. I also use a Respironics in-line HEPA filter at the junction of the hose and humidifier which seems to also cut down a little on the noise.

I also haven't been happy using my Activa with the 420e. It seems to have a lot more bellows action than with the Remstar. I tend to use my Swift, Breeze, or UltraMirage nasal mask.

People recently posted an alternate way to route the hose on the Swift, and since the hose ends up more out in front of your face than pressed against your temple, it seems to drop the noise to about nil.

Despite the noise, I still like the 420e for its size and data.

BP,
Just to tell you I too own a 420E - and I agree with the way you described the sound pattern.

I found it very annoying in the beginning, but taught myself to adapt to it.

It's worth it.

O.

snork1 wrote:Definitely make sure you have a good seal when you add the humidifier. That is a bit tricky to make sure that gasket is seated properly.

I have to agree with this. The only time my 420e makes any significant noise is if I'm careless about inserting the water container into the humidifier. A couple of times I've ended with a poor connection seal and had it whistle, particularly on exhale.

To make matters worse the frequency was one of those that are difficult to localize and I couldn't tell if it was the mask, my infamous nose whistle or something else. Turned out it was "something else" (the connection to the humidifier).

This thread makes me glad I chose the Remstar Auto. It is quiet and comfortable, and I love Cflex. My wife and I always have a fan on all night and have never noticed the Remstar. You might try a fan just for the background noise. Good luck

Well, just spent my second night with my new 420e. I was successful in reducing the noise by about 20%. It's strange, but earplugs really make the problem much worse. I tried taking out the earplugs and turning on a white noise generator. That helped a lot, but of course I'm not used that and not wearing earplugs, so after an hour or so of not sleeping I switched back to the Remstar. I'm just going to have to give it a couple weeks and see if I can adjust to it.

snork1, actually I've had the humidifier attached since day one. I'm not turning it all on but just using it in pass-over mode, since that seems to give me just the right amount of humidification. It's definitely quieter with the humidifier but still annoying to me. I've looked at the gasket several times, take it on an off, tried reversing it, and I'm pretty sure I have it seated properly. I agree with you I definitely think there is quite a bit of variation in these machines, I wouldn't have thought that initially. My Remstar plus is dead quiet, at least at the mask where I have problems with the 420e.

UKnowWhatInSeattle, maybe there is a relationship between the problem and the activa. It's like it's using the face as a kind of amplifier. Maybe I should try some different masks. It's funny you mention the bellows action. I've heard people talking about this but had never experienced it myself, it just doesn't happen with my Remstar and the activa, but it sure happens with the 420e. It's not a big deal it only happens when I first put it on, but it just highlights the differences in these machines.

ozij, I agree with you, it's something I will have to adjust to. The tough part was that I didn't expect it.

WAFlowers, I'm starting to think that mask selection is critical with certain machines. Of course, all of us are sensitive to different things. My issue just happens to be noise, I've always been very sensitive to it.

I'm going to say "dittos" on what Sleepyman wrote.....except that I have the Pro 2 CPAP w/CFLEX. (Don't use a fan, either) My snoring probably drowns out what little amount of noise it does make.....which I don't hear either.

Good sleepin', y'all, (noises or not)

Den