CPAPtalk.com

sleepinginseattle wrote: Peace of mind for me comes from getting a good night's sleep. I don't need to read data to know if that happened. My body tells me.

You know my body didn't feel so good when I started. It took some detective work to find out why. I would never had known without data.
Last time I looked in the mirror I saw an adult quite capable of making my own financial decisions and weighing the factors involved with data capable machine. I don't remember seeing you there.

I am so glad your body is so much smarter than everyone else's. You might as well sell your data capable machine and get a Plus model.

Does this forum have a member ignore feature??? I can tell right now I need one.

Everyone's path to better sleep is different. I hope to offer a counter point to those that might be tempted to conclude that the data collection route is best. Good luck with your therapy.

What happens if you stop feeling good? You go to the doctor. What does that cost?
Having no data, the doctor either guesses at what to do (now that's priceless), or he sends you for another sleep study. What does that cost?

If you initially buy a machine without data to save $75, and later regret it, you have to buy another machine. That's enough to make $75 look very cheap.

But if you want to sleep in the dark, so be it.

sleepinginseattle wrote:I beg to differ, the main difference is the price. The Elite 11 offers data recording that is of negligible value for a $75 premium. That $75 would be better spent on mask research.

Also, there's little evidence that the Elite 11 is any quieter than the Escape 11. Both are advertised as being <25db on Resmed's site.

Repeated trips back to the doctor or additional sleep studies will eat up any "savings" in a heartbeat.

Pay now or pay later.......


Den

i repeat....don't feed the trolls...

...I thought that was only after midnight.

SleepyT wrote:i repeat....don't feed the trolls...

That's not very nice. I've made a lot of contributions to this site but I have one repeated experience, when I disagree with a particular group of user's way of thinking (the "data collection" group, for instance), I sometimes find little support.

I made my opinions clear. Enough said.

sleepinginseattle wrote:Everyone's path to better sleep is different. I hope to offer a counter point to those that might be tempted to conclude that the data collection route is best...

I was sold the Escape 17 months ago and it worked and still works fine; I have no complaints about it, it's small, lightweight, easy to use, easy to travel with, and blessedly quiet! However, without data to track my overnight events and leaks, when they started sometime since last February, I've backslid into many apneic events while sleeping. Taken me months to realize exactly why I was feeling so bad; drug side effects, a layoff, and hospital stay for IV antibiotics all interfered with my my realizing I was having events...wasn't until I joined here that I finally understood what was going on. It wouldn't have taken months, it would have been days for me to understand this, if I'd had a data capable machine. I regret that my massive muddleheadedness at the time of my Sleep Study prevented me from understanding I had treatment options or I'd have demanded a data capable machine even tho my SDB was certainly plain ole massive hypopneas.

I believe everyone, regardless of how plain vanilla their OSA look like in the PSG, should be using an efficacy and not just compliance data capable machine. The ResMeds LED displays provide much information for those who are technophobes or don't want to fiddle with details; later they can purchase a car reader and software for detailed data if so inclined.

jdm2857 wrote:...I thought that was only after midnight.

seattle wrote,
"That's not very nice. I've made a lot of contributions to this site but I have one repeated experience, when I disagree with a particular group of user's way of thinking (the "data collection" group, for instance), I sometimes find little support.

I made my opinions clear. Enough said."

You're right. It was cruel. I just felt you were stirring the pot....but you certainly have the right to disagree. My apologies.

Sleepyt

sleepinginseattle wrote:

SleepyT wrote:i repeat....don't feed the trolls...

That's not very nice. I've made a lot of contributions to this site but I have one repeated experience, when I disagree with a particular group of user's way of thinking (the "data collection" group, for instance), I sometimes find little support.

I made my opinions clear. Enough said.

That's true, you have been a forum member for about 3 1/2 years.
On the other hand.....
I find it "interesting" that you speak AGAINST data collection when you have a data-capable machine listed in your profile (REMstar Pro 2).


Den

The argument against efficacy data is weaker than a malnourished kitten.

You might save a small amount of money, but you have no idea whats going on with your therapy.
And if you want to know, you have to schedule a sleep study, go to it, pay for it, then take time off work to go to the Dr.'s office to find out the results. And pay for that visit. Hardly seems cost effective.

Anyone want a car with no tach, speedo or odometer? I'll knock off a full $1000.

No takers? Shocking.

The opinion that efficacy data is bad or unnecessary is certainly allowed here. However, isn't my opinion that people holding that opinion are nuts equally valid?

Wulfman wrote:

sleepinginseattle wrote:

SleepyT wrote:i repeat....don't feed the trolls...

That's not very nice. I've made a lot of contributions to this site but I have one repeated experience, when I disagree with a particular group of user's way of thinking (the "data collection" group, for instance), I sometimes find little support.

I made my opinions clear. Enough said.

That's true, you have been a forum member for about 3 1/2 years.
On the other hand.....
I find it "interesting" that you speak AGAINST data collection when you have a data-capable machine listed in your profile (REMstar Pro 2).


Den

You misinterpret my posts. I am not against data collection, per se. But I am for the purpose of self titration.

OTOH, my Remstar Pro 2 is my prescribed machine. My doctor reads the data but I don't. My therapy has been very successful by my own account, which is what matters most IMHO and I have always had a backup machine. The former PB Goodknight 420G died, now there's a Resmed Escape II. Basic machines for basic purposes.

Should a basic machine like a Escape II be prescribed as a primary unit? I think the professional sleep community have a lot of reasons not to. But in my opinion, for therapy it does exactly what the Remstar does without added expense.

How did I miss this thread until now?

wow. Talk about some drama.

I am not taking sides in any way, but do want to interject torwards Seattle... This is in now way meant to stir the pot or take sides on either side of the field...

I am not your typical osa patient. 40 years old, BMI 24.4Kg, 6"1, average weight, non smoker (for a few months now), seldom drink. I found my way into this world because I was in a doctor (ENT) office because I had a clogged ear. I casually mentioned I snored. Teach me to open my mouth... that bought me 2 nights in a sleep lab, and the discovery that without cpap I drop to 62% oxygen in my blood levels, and have a mere 112 obstructive, 108 hyponeas in a night. Wake up feeling ok though, so still in denial.

Sadly, it took 2 months to get both reports from the doctor showing before and after using a cpap. During this time I faithfully recorded all efficacy data from my resmed machine...(ai, hi, ahi, and leak rates). I also came in here and read a lot and asked a lot of questions (as I continue to do).

All things being equal, I feel the same as I did before I started this journey. I have adjusted my pressure a few times, changed masks, changed the epr and started using a chin strap. Granted, eveyone is different, but to me, data was all I had to go on.

There is a lot of members in here that know if they have a good night or a bad night based on how they feel. I am lucky that I am not one of them. At least not yet. it is that efficacy data that has kept me 100% compliant. As corny as it may sound, trying to achieve an ahi < 5 was (and still is) my goal. I was able to get my leak rate down to 0 most nights on the resmed, but the other numbers? Just could not get there. I saw my doctor for a follow up last week and left him speechless. I wound up going in and telling him my therapy and what I need (I wanted an auto machine, to try and improve on my situtation). He agreed and wrote me a new prescription. I now have a new machine that is an auto, but lacks efficacy data. The doctor, the dme and the fisher and paykel sales rep all agree to give me the performance maximizer software (for free). not only that, but the sales rep is going to come install it and teach me how to use it. 2 nights on a machine without efficcy and it is stressful to me not knowing. I still feel the same, but all this machine tells me is that I had an ahi of 2 one noght and 3 the next. So what does that mean? For me at least, for compliance and peace of mind, I need to see where I am having events, when my mask is leaking, at what range do I recieve maxium benefit.

I am very fortunate in that I do not experience bad problems now, hopefully it is a result of catching it early enough. I feel your pain if you have headaches, and a lot of the other ill effects of it. I am also fortnate to have a dme (well now I am on the second one, as the first did not have this machine) that cares. I have read too many horror stories of other dme's that make death seem a less painful choice.

Sorry, I think I sort of went on a spin there, but bottom line: I think a machine that provides efficacy data (if a crd reader and software are not an option) is a no brainer. Most people will wake up and know they feel good or bad, but to truly know if your therapy is working, I think we need more. I would suspect that si why the compliance rate with cpap is not what it should be.

drubin007 wrote:...now have a new machine that is an auto, but lacks efficacy data...

Can you get it swapped out for an efficacy data machine? IMHO, it'd be a better choice as you obviously want to and are capable of optimizing your therapy, but with your current APAP it's like flying blind.