CPAPtalk.com

Raj wrote:........... Still, I'm convinced that calmness, even for a limited period of time, is very, very good for human beings both physically and mentally. .........

BlackSpinner wrote: Many years ago (in the 70's) I started Yoga and learned meditation. Later to deal with my migraines I learned other "relaxation techniques". .......... It works great to deal with pain, headaches, stress and anxiety and lots of other aliments.

Raj and BS,

Time has to be allocated and so far, I took the position that I would allocate the time to exercise instead of relaxation techniques. Maybe I am Type 'A' personality, so the exercise suits me better and it would be difficult to learn relaxation techniques. Besides, it sounds so wimpy.

I think I relax naturally (except in traffic - locally famous for my international one-finger salute).

My question to you is, am I better keeping a strong, consistent exercise program or do I need to allocate part of my time to relaxation techniques?

BlackSpinner wrote:....... So I have a routine where I breath 3 breaths for my hands on my stomach ( to feel that I am breathing right) then 3 breaths for each finger on each hand (while holding the finger)and then 3 breaths to end which should equal 36 which according to my acupressure teacher is a complete cycle of renewal for all your meridians.

I need a third hand to hold an index card with these instructions.

Thirty+ years of undiagnosed sleep apnea has taken a big chunk out of my brain.

Glad it did not destoy the part that loves to have fun!

My question to you is, am I better keeping a strong, consistent exercise program or do I need to allocate part of my time to relaxation techniques?

You can meditate and exercise at the same time - that is what Yoga does.
The trick is that when you exercise you pay attention to your breathing and what you are doing only No working out problems, no obsessing about work or relationships. Focus totally on the breathing and movement. Especially if you are running - stay there with your breath and your body. If you start thinking than just remind your self to get back to focusing on your breath. Try for deep slow breaths . Before doing a particular exercise bring your attention back to your breath - breath in through your nose at a count of 4(say it in millions), hold to 4, breath out through your mouth at 4 and hold 4. Breath with your diaphragm, your stomach should move with your breaths - not your shoulders. You can also count with your heart beats if you can feel them.

The autogenic relaxation techniques that I learned take exactly one minute but you need to do them at least 30 times a day at first to train your reactions.

rooster wrote:What do you think about this? http://www.resperate.com/us/welcome/ind ... xwodkQMTFg
Would it not be great for helping us train for healthier breathing?

-SWS wrote:I just ordered one of their Duo versions.

rooster wrote: ...it sounds so wimpy.

If it wasn't for the emotional support provided on this site, I don't think I'd bother owning a computer...

I need a third hand to hold an index card with these instructions

I taught this to grade 3 kids
Just remember - hold a finger and count to 3 and move on - that is the most important part.

-SWS wrote:

rooster wrote: ...it sounds so wimpy.

If it wasn't for the emotional support provided on this site, I don't think I'd bother owning a computer...

Actually I was referring to Yoga and meditation.

RESPeRATE sounds high tech and would go well with my heart monitor watch, altimeter watch, BG meter, BP meter, EncoreAnalyser software, and EncorePro software.

And no, you don't have to remind me that any one of those cute chicks I regularly watch on cable 337 doing Yoga in those cute outfits could beat my ass.

Rooster
CPAP: No protection from opinionism.

Don't you worry one iota about my own psyche, Mr. Rooster. You just look after yourself...

I'll pull through this just fine... if I can somehow manage to focus on the prospect of light at the end of the old emotional tunnel... or is it roller coaster?

Anyway, there's no problem here. No sirree. I'm as good as healed... I hope.







j/k

rooster wrote:My question to you is, am I better keeping a strong, consistent exercise program or do I need to allocate part of my time to relaxation techniques?

I wouldn't give up any part of your strong, consistent exercise program to relaxation techniques, but as said below, you can incorporate relaxation techniques into you exercise program. Back before my UPPP, when I could still "snort" (not drugs) if I wanted to do so (and even if I didn't want to do so...in fact I never really wanted to snort on purpose ), I would use relaxation techniques at part of my running program. I would use them on 15 to 20 mile training runs and sometimes use them between speed work at shorter distances.

But it was pretty embarrassing...because I was actually having to hold my upper palate up (although I didn't know it at the time) so when I would 'relax' into my long run, have loose shoulders and get rid of any tension, I'd start snorting...I guess my version of snoring when awake. That's when I began to realize how much obstructive 'stuff' was affecting me...even when I was awake. When I was asleep, my husband never noticed me snoring...instead it was a situation where I was breathing, then I wasn't breathing because everything would close, and then I would wake up with a jerk and breathe.

And ha ha about it sounding so wimpy You he-man chicken you
mar

robertmarilyn wrote:......... then I would wake up with a jerk .......

My wife also says that.

rooster wrote:

robertmarilyn wrote:......... then I would wake up with a jerk .......

My wife also says that.

Ha ha, your poor wife
mar

rooster wrote:My question to you is, am I better keeping a strong, consistent exercise program or do I need to allocate part of my time to relaxation techniques?

I agree with the suggestion of combining those two. They're both important. And you can fit them both into every-day ordinary tasks for a healthy lifestyle.

For instance, while lying on the couch... why not vigorously alternate beer lifting arms? Then every second or third beer, don't just stroll your way to the small room. Kind of jog there... as part of a new and health conscious lifestyle! Just an uplifting thought...


...Seriously, if it came down to a choice between regular meditation or a good cardiovascular workout at least three or four times a week, the latter wins hands down IMHO. A workout entails de-stressing, improved autonomic patterns, improved metabolism, improved sleep, and so much more. Just my opinion, and YMMV.

I taught childbirth classes for many years. I could just use the relaxed, slow deep breathing that I taught for early labor to any of the music I have that I find very soothing- lots of acoustic guitar stuff- did I mention I have a real thing for guitar players?? (and married one,too! ) Never thought about using it with my CPAP, but it sounds fun-and it won't cost me that much- I will search online for a metronome-that might make it even more relaxing,if I had that in the background-I'll try it with something. My b/p is much better than it was for many years, I am not even on any meds any more- but I would like to keep it that way! Thanks for that suggestion!
~joan


"Do you think that's air you're breathing?" Morpheus, the Matrix, 1999

Rooster, the question as to whether exercise or relaxation practice would be better for you really depends on what you most need. Both are vital to your health, but if you truly go through life in a peaceful state, intelligent exercise obviously trumps relaxation. Unfortunately, many people never become calm enough to realize how stressed out they are, and they live on the surface of life, jostled by every random wave that comes along, unaware that they live in a constant state of tension because they're too busy reacting to everything that happens. So it might be useful for you to try a bit of relaxation just so that you can clearly assess your state of mind. Besides, even if you are generally relaxed, it may be very good for you to enter deeper states of relaxation, even for relatively brief periods of time.

I do think it's wise to do both, but you needn't cut down your exercise time since a relaxation response only requires a minimum of about fifteen to twenty minutes per day, once you've found a technique that works for you. I'm not a great believer in combining the two, although I think certain aspects of relaxation practice enhance aerobic exercise: deep, steady diaphragmatic breathing done exclusively through the nose (or at least inhaling through the nose), which pulls air to the bottom of the lungs and supposedly stimulates the parasympathetic nervous system; concentration on the exercise to maintain proper form (particularly important for joggers and runners); and a generally positive attitude toward the activity. The same principles apply to weight-lifting (except the breathing patterns are automatically altered by uneven oxygen requirements). My feeling is that trying to squeeze both relaxation and exercise into one unit will tend to denature the effectiveness of both.

As to counting and breathing at the same time, one classic approach (mantra meditation) is to string a series of syllables together of whatever length you wish to achieve, perhaps a phrase that has meaning to you or even nonsense syllables will work, and say them to yourself (not out loud) as you breathe in. Then you can use the same syllables (perhaps adding a few extras to extend the exhalation), or a different set as you breathe out. That way no counting is required.

Mediation, BTW, is a very imprecise term because it has so many meanings. I mainly think of it as the process of entering an insightful state through concentration, but the term has generally become synonymous with the relaxation response.

Very nice comparative summary between the benefits of physical exercise and meditation, Raj.

In my opinion the two entail overlapping benefits regarding physiology, psychology, and even spirituality. I view that physical exercise tends to offer primarily physiologic benefits, followed by incidental psychological and even spiritual gain if sought---perhaps most often in that order of benefit. And I tend to think of deeper meditation as reversing that order of priority regarding the intended spirit, mind, and body benefits.

States of ultra deep concentration or deep meditation are mutually exclusive of the mental or cognitive vigilance required for vigorous physical exertion in my own opinion as well. For those with a scientific bent about this topic, here are quite a few white papers jointly mentioning both terms "meditation" and "physical exercise":
http://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en ... tnG=Search

That's not to completely bash that exercise-while-relaxing-on-the-couch idea I came up with for our neat friend, Rooster.



j/k about the beer---it's a social benefit!

Mediation, BTW, is a very imprecise term because it has so many meanings. I mainly think of it as the process of entering an insightful state through concentration, but the term has generally become synonymous with the relaxation response.

Yes this is true. Not only are there many different types of meditation (as in the official spiritual practice) and relaxation techniques but there are also many "depths" to be obtained.
I first learned it as part of a yoga class in 1972 and I didn't know that it was meditation we were practicing. Since then I have been exposed to many different forms of relaxation techniques (for pain control) , various Indian, Tibetan and Japanese meditation methods, shamanic journeying, ecstatic dance, drumming, chanting to "bells", toning, hypnosis and guided visualizations. Not all at once of course and some only as secondary parts of healing courses I took - (you don't really want to hear me chanting or toning as I am tone deaf) so many have never become part of my personal practice.

One thing I found that many many western people start out using these techniques as part of pain or stress control and if it clicks with them they will eventually deepen their practice.

Also for some people they need movement in order to go into the trance state so that ecstatic dance or exercise works better then trying to make them sit still. One good example of this locally is the "Tam-Tams" on the side of Mount Royal every Sunday in the summer. Several hundred people with drums show up and they play while many people watch, listen and dance. This is a totally un organized event, as long as it isn't raining people just show up with drums, the better players take turns leading and the others follow. The rhythmic drumming of many drums just gets into your system, after a while there is nothing in your head except for the rhythm of the beat and your body starts to move on its own. The city long ago gave up trying to evict them from the park and now it is considered a tourist attraction.