Page 19 of 27
Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 9:13 pm
by ozij
Oh, I agree SAG's humor takes getting used to - but on the other hand, his many posts on other threads have shown that he is kind-hearted (in his own way) and helpful to be that thin-skinned and insulted.
O.
Jumping the Gun...
Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2008 6:21 am
by StillAnotherGuest
rested gal wrote:SAG was joking, too.
Let's go with "Sort of joking".
Casiesea wrote:...it was more about doctors and pharmacuetical companies (specifically his doctor giving him a medicine for sleep...that messes up sleep....
See, the thing is, the rationale of the physician hasn't been presented yet. Similar to dial wingin' is pill poppin'. "Try this!" "Didn't work? Throw it out! Double the dose! Whatever!"
Interestingly, there is a "back-door" application for fluoxetine that has at least some theoretical value here. However, my guess in the pool is that the guy who ordered the Prozac don't know what it is. Did you get his reasoning behind it?
SAG
Re: Jumping the Gun...
Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2008 7:43 am
by ozij
StillAnotherGuest wrote:Interestingly, there is a "back-door" application for fluoxetine that has at least some theoretical value here. However, my guess in the pool is that the guy who ordered the Prozac don't know what it is. Did you get his reasoning behind it?
SAG
According to Wikipedia:
Fluoxetine hydrochloride (Prozac) is an antidepressant of the selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor (SSRI) class.
Didn't know that the F word was also the P word, though I assumed as much from SAG's post...
Mind boggling, that info SAG posted on Prozac and isnomnia, and the Rx for sleeplessness.
Similar to dial wingin' is pill poppin'. "Try this!" "Didn't work? Throw it out! Double the dose! Whatever!"
Ah yes, the Voodoo school of medical science... little taught but rather prevalent...
O.
Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2008 8:41 am
by Casiesea
He won't take it, he won't take anything now. He is on a medication strike, I guess. Can't say I blame him.
The only thing he said to me about physician rationale was "He told me it would help me sleep". The doctor (FP) called back but I wasn't here, now we are playing phone tag.
Last night went well. Doc #1 said they were going to start on CPAP with the full face mask - just incase she missed something. Then they would go back to the ASV if needed. It WAS needed. They did come in a few times to adjust the mask, but didn't turn the lights on and they tried not to wake him. They didn't give him any hints as to how it went. Doc #1 will not read the results till Monday.
I am thinking about getting my own bedroom. I slept great last night.
Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2008 9:00 am
by ozij
[quote="Casiesea"]
I am thinking about getting my own bedroom. I slept great last night.
Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2008 5:47 pm
by Casiesea
Doc #1 called a few hours ago to see how hubby felt about last night. She told us that she couldn't help but take a peak at the results this morning. She said the cpap numbers were interesting, but she hasn't sat down with all the info yet.
Doc #1 had quite a few people in there last night to make sure they got everything they needed. They called her a few times during the night for discussions (lots of opinions on the numbers I guess).
One thing she did say, he is going to stay on the ASV regardless of what the numbers show. If they do decide cpap is the choice, they will use the Adapt as a cpap. Does that make sense?
I just wanted to keep everyone up to date.
Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2008 6:21 pm
by Banned
Casiesea wrote:
If they do decide cpap is the choice, they will use the Adapt as a cpap. Does that make sense?
It would be an expensive CPAP machine. But you could revert to ASV mode in a heartbeat. I was never titrated on a bilevel machine and I setup my Adapt SV with the results of a CPAP PSG. Bilevel/ASV PSGs and titrations maybe over-rated.
Banned
Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2008 6:54 pm
by Casiesea
Yeah, I know! Lucky we don't have to pay for it. Last nights titration was on the house, too.
Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2008 10:31 pm
by rested gal
Banned wrote:I was never titrated on a bilevel machine and I setup my Adapt SV with the results of a CPAP PSG. Bilevel/ASV PSGs and titrations maybe over-rated.
And maybe
you're underrating the seriousness of getting the settings
right on ASV type machines for people who very much
need that specific kind of machine, as opposed to someone who
chose that machine for himself.
I'm as much of a "tweaker" as anyone on this board, but even I have sense enough to know that there are
some sleep
breathing disorders and
some other health issues and
some machines (ASV machines in particular when being used
FOR the reasons they were designed) that
aren't appropriate for a "try this and see how you feel", then "try that and see how you feel" approach to the settings.
If I
needed an ASV machine, rather than just choosing (as you did, Banned) to use one, I would certainly want the settings to be adjusted in a full PSG titration sleep study while actually using the ASV.
Just my thoughts.
Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 12:37 am
by Banned
rested gal wrote:If I needed an ASV machine, rather than just choosing (as you did, Banned) to use one, I would certainly want the settings to be adjusted in a full PSG titration sleep study while actually using the ASV.
You would be correct that I did have the unique circumstance to choose what I considered the correct equipment to mitigate my gasping episodes while on CPAP. I don't know if my settings are on-the money but it's close enough to to keep this 59 year old working, swimming 5 miles a week, going to the gym on the non-swim days, and lately i'm starting to have dreams, again. I think what I was trying to say is that a good CPAP study can be a valuable tool.
Banned
Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 5:59 am
by dsm
Banned,
I can identify with your self made choice as I was only ever titrated on a cpap & there is *no* way I will go back to straight cpap from my Bilevel & backup S8 with EPR.
The week I started with a Bilevel changed my success with sustained effective cpap therapy (IMHO )
So I can join in your enthusiasm for your own choice of the Adapt SV, I will soon be trying an SV machine but only to get a feel for it & won't keep it. I am more than happy with what I have.
DSM
Show Me The Data!
Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 6:09 am
by StillAnotherGuest
Casiesea wrote:He won't take (fluoxetine), he won't take anything now. He is on a medication strike, I guess.
You mean he's "sorta" on a medication strike, given that the half-life of fluoxetine is 1-4
days and its chief metabolite is over a week.
If there is a use for fluoxetine as a primary sleep aid (as opposed to, "This boy's depressed, so fix depression > improve sleep)(but fluoxetine really isn't a "sleep-friendly" ADM, there's a bunch that are better at it), I'd sure like to know what it is.
Journal of the American Geriatrics Society, October 2006
To determine if previous findings also apply to older women residing in the community, including those without depression, Dr. Kristine E. Ensrud, from the Veterans Affairs Medical Center in Minneapolis, and colleagues analyzed data from 223 SSRI users and 2,630 subjects who did not use any antidepressants. The participants, all at least 71 years old, represented a subgroup of women enrolled in an osteoporosis study.
To monitor sleep function, the women were given an actigraph to monitor sleep function that they wore, on average, for four consecutive 24-hour periods. Based on Geriatric Depression Scale scores, 2337 had no evidence of depression and the remainder did, the investigators note.
In the overall group, as well as the subgroup without depression, sleep disturbances were more common in SSRI users than in nonusers.
For women without evidence of depression, SSRI use increased the risk of sleeping for 5 hours or less, sleeping well less than 70 percent of the time and, taking 1 hour or longer to fall asleep, and experiencing eight or more lengthy episodes of sleepless per night by 2.15-, 2.37-, 3.99-, and 1.75-fold, respectively.
It can generate PLMs:
This gets better and better, don't it?
Also, be sure to keep everything that Moe and Larry say in proper context.
SAG
Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 8:11 am
by Banned
dsm wrote:
I will soon be trying an SV machine but only to get a feel for it & won't keep it. I am more than happy with what I have.
..waiting for Doc 1's new sleep study results. grabs more popcorn So which SV machine are you going to try, and when?
Banned
Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 10:51 am
by Casiesea
SAG - I don't remember seeing any signs of depression. Though, he has been struggling with sleep for a quite a while. I actually thought prozac may have been making him depressed. About two weeks ago I told him I thought he needed to try something else. The FP decreased his dose to 20mg qd, but talked him into staying on it. Thinking back, his mood could have been related to smoking cessation (guess thats why I'm not a doctor).
You might like this Ozij...My husband told me the doctor had given him "fluoxetine" to help with sleep...He had been on it about a month when I asked him "do you need me to refill your prozac at the drug store?". He said "huh?". He had no idea he was taking prozac.
I think he is done with that FP.
Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2008 5:33 am
by dsm
Banned wrote:dsm wrote:
I will soon be trying an SV machine but only to get a feel for it & won't keep it. I am more than happy with what I have.
..waiting for Doc 1's new sleep study results. grabs more popcorn So which SV machine are you going to try, and when?
Banned
Bipap AutoSV - is just being released from Australian Customs - I believe I will have it next week (Monday).
Got it for a price I couldn't refuse ( )
Apart from price was attracted by the multitude of settings even though I think this aspect may possibly lead to some folks having trouble with this machine if they change settings without being fully aware of the impact. I suspect it isn't sophisticated as the Adapt SV but seeing as I don't really have irregular
breathing problems (well I don't think so) am willing to experiment with it.
DSM
_________________
CPAPopedia Keywords Contained In This Post (Click For Definition):
bipap