Sleep Apnea Short term? Constructive recommendations only

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
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KENSKIP1
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Sleep Apnea Short term? Constructive recommendations only

Post by KENSKIP1 » Mon Jun 13, 2022 10:48 am

OK, So I had the ResMed in use for over a week now. I have not noticed any improvement at all in my health, dealing with anxiety, ext. However last night I attempted to go to bed without it. What a wake up call. I hardly slept a wink. It seemed as if it was difficult to inhale. What appears to be happening is that using the device forces air into the lungs. This is OK however, the lungs are made to expand and contract. The machine forces air into the lungs and in all actuality the lungs are just in for the ride. We are only using 50% of what the lungs are designed for. I checked my pulse ox level several times. 85-90 was average. Yes this is low. While trying to sleep I noticed how shallow my breathing was. So the bottom line is, am I required to use the device every night for the rest my life? Am I supposed to be tethered to a hose while sleeping letting a machine force air into my lungs? I was under the impression that I could be free of Apnea and get along with my life. So it appears as if this device is being used as a crutch. I will not allow this to continue. My lungs are in great condition as I had a PFT a few months ago. My heart is also in good working order, as I was on a tread mill for 8 minutes and passed with flying colors, however my prostate cancer, well this could be a cause of my anxiety. The sleep Study was interesting. Yes I had a Echocardiograph and an EKG. They told me that I have the heart of a 40 year old. I welcome your suggestions . I am not well known for my patience.
And in closing I will state that I invite your opinions along with constructive words of advice. Thank you for your time, Ken

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Re: Sleep Apnea Short term? Constructive recommendations only

Post by Dog Slobber » Mon Jun 13, 2022 11:25 am

You decided before you even put the mask on, you were going to fail and it would end up in the bottom of a closet.
KENSKIP1 wrote:
Sat Jun 04, 2022 8:30 pm
This should be an interesting night. Hopefully I may get some benefit from it. Otherwise it will find it's way to the bottom of my closet. I have very little patience relying on a mechanical device to aid my respiratory anomalies.
Your poor attitude and was easily predicted and when it was pointed out to you to make sure someone else could benefit, you got all pissy instead. How prophetic.
palerider wrote:
Sat Jun 04, 2022 10:09 pm
Oh, let's hope you sell it instead, so someone can benefit from it.
You just started pushing buttons, ignoring advice including advice that your device was misconfigured. Your response to that was idiotic.

Nobody here is going to beg you to use the machine.

Hopefully, you'll do the right thing and return the machine so somebody can benefit.

You can't be helped.
Last edited by Dog Slobber on Mon Jun 13, 2022 11:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Sleep Apnea Short term? Constructive recommendations only

Post by chunkyfrog » Mon Jun 13, 2022 11:26 am

CPAP does not "force" air into your lungs.
Put a latex party balloon on the end of your hose.
Turn the cpap on--nothing happens!
Blow the balloon up with your mouth alone. See the difference.
One week is not nearly enough to feel a difference.
Try a month--or three; give living a chance.
If not, get professional help for your self destructive impulses.

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Miss Emerita
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Re: Sleep Apnea Short term? Constructive recommendations only

Post by Miss Emerita » Mon Jun 13, 2022 11:33 am

Welcome to the forum, Ken.

A few thoughts about PAP treatment for apnea. Except for some very specialized machines, the PAP machines aren't intended to force air into our lungs. Instead, they are meant to "stent" our airways. This just means the air pressure gently pushes on the tissues lining the airway to keep them open. I say "gentle" because the amount of pressure at a setting of, say 10, is what it takes to blow bubbles through a straw into 10 centimeters of water.

PAP machines don't cure apnea; they treat it. A lot of people have the kind of reaction you're having: "What, I'm supposed to use this thing for the rest of my life?" The more you get used to it, though, the more it will seem like using eyeglasses or contact lenses to improve your vision. I wonder whether you could just promise yourself not to try to decide anything now and instead to wait for three months before you assess the situation.

Can you tell us what your AHI was when you were diagnosed with sleep apnea? And can you tell us what it is when you use the machine? If you don't see the information about your AHI on the screen of your machine, you can change the settings to get it. You can enter the clinician's menu by pressing and holding the home button and the round knob simultaneously for a few seconds. Once you're in that menu, you can choose to have a fair amount of detail shown on your screen for each night. Be sure to set the frequency to one day.
Last edited by Miss Emerita on Mon Jun 13, 2022 12:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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KENSKIP1
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Re: Sleep Apnea Short term? Constructive recommendations only

Post by KENSKIP1 » Mon Jun 13, 2022 11:50 am

Dog Slobber, My attitude is just fine. What I was unaware of is how long I would be required to use the device. I set the machines pressures to something that was comfortable not forcing air beyond a reasonable limit. As of now the pressure is at 13 inhale and 8 exhale. The humidity level is set to level 4. I have the PS set at 3. And no you idiot, I did not just start pushing buttons. I read the manual carefully and followed the English instructions.
I just got off the phone with my raspatory therapist. She looked at my records from ResMed and told me that I am doing very well and that I should be prepared to use it nightly. I mentioned that I was informed that the Apnea could clear up, however I have not noticed any improvement. She told me that this information is not correct.
Apparently "Sir" you are not a good judge of character. Yes I have a short temper and very little patience however, I am able to recognize a person with little knowledge but one who has a flair using insipid comments.
I welcome your constructive comments with open arms. BTW, My first post may be mistaken for phrases that I did not intend to make. Even a well educated individual like yourself has made mistakes. Yes I have made many and will continue to do so. If we do not make mistakes then we are not learning.
In closing I am awaiting your vast knowledge with the greatest of exuberance. Thank you and have a wonderful day, Ken

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KENSKIP1
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Re: Sleep Apnea Short term? Constructive recommendations only

Post by KENSKIP1 » Mon Jun 13, 2022 12:00 pm

Miss Emerita wrote:
Mon Jun 13, 2022 11:33 am
Welcome to the forum, Ken.

A few thoughts about PAP treatment for apnea. Except for some very specialized machines, the PAP machines aren't intended to force air into our lungs. Instead, they are meant to "stent" our airways. This just means the air pressure gently pushes on the tissues lining the airway to keep them open. I say "gentle" because the amount of pressure at a setting of, say 10, is what it takes to blow bubbles through a stray into 10 centimeters of water.

PAP machines don't cure apnea; they treat it. A lot of people have the kind of reaction you're having: "What, I'm supposed to use this thing for the rest of my life?" The more you get used to it, though, the more it will seem like using eyeglasses or contact lenses to improve your vision. I wonder whether you could just promise yourself not to try to decide anything now and instead to wait for three months before you assess the situation.

Can you tell us what your AHI was when you were diagnosed with sleep apnea? And can you tell us what it is when you use the machine? If you don't see the information about your AHI on the screen of your machine, you can change the settings to get it. You can enter the clinician's menu by pressing and holding the home button and the round knob simultaneously for a few seconds. Once you're in that menu, you can choose to have a fair amount of detail shown on your screen for each night. Be sure to set the frequency to one day.
I hope that this is what you requested. I am new to all these acronyms,

There were 0 central apneas, 0 obstructive apneas and 27 hypopneas. The apnea-hypopnea index was 8. The REM stage AHI was 26/hr. The supine AHI was 20/hr. Light to moderate snoring was noted. The mean oxygen saturation during sleep was 94% and the lowest recorded was 71%. The patient spent 0.1 minutes of sleep time withsaturationsof88% or less.

On the machine it was preset. I have now changed the setting to 13 inhale and 8 to exhale. The PS is now set to 3 I believe.
Thank you for assisting me. Just the few short sentences have helped me greatly, Ken

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KENSKIP1
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Re: Sleep Apnea Short term? Constructive recommendations only

Post by KENSKIP1 » Mon Jun 13, 2022 12:04 pm

chunkyfrog wrote:
Mon Jun 13, 2022 11:26 am
CPAP does not "force" air into your lungs.
Put a latex party balloon on the end of your hose.
Turn the cpap on--nothing happens!
Blow the balloon up with your mouth alone. See the difference.
One week is not nearly enough to feel a difference.
Try a month--or three.
Or just curl up and die . . . (You know you want to.)
"Lighten Up Francis"

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Re: Sleep Apnea Short term? Constructive recommendations only

Post by Miss Emerita » Mon Jun 13, 2022 12:14 pm

Glad to have been of some help, Ken. When you have a chance to read information about your current AHI off your machine, I'd be interested to know what it is.

One detail you might like to know. Your settings of 8 and 13 are your minimum pressure and your maximum pressure. During the course of the night, the pressure will vary depending on whether the machine has recently detected hypopneas, obstructive apneas, snores, or flow limitations. These pressure changes are not abrupt but unfold over multiple minutes.

You have EPR set at 3. That's a good way to help resolve your hypopneas. EPR of 3 drops your pressure by 3 when you exhale; by the same token, it increases your pressure when you inhale. That boost can be helpful for hypopneas and flow limitations. EPR is a breath-by-breath change in pressure, unlike the maximum and minimum settings.
Oscar software is available at https://www.sleepfiles.com/OSCAR/

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Re: Sleep Apnea Short term? Constructive recommendations only

Post by lazarus » Mon Jun 13, 2022 12:29 pm

PAP just keeps the airway stable so you can breathe well enough to get good sleep. Full stop. Full start.

Don't think breathing is important? Stop using PAP. Don't think sleep is important? Stop using PAP. But if you are as dependent on, and as addicted to, good breathing and good sleep as I am, you'll likely eventually come to see PAP as the simple, practical, healing blessing and lifeline that it has become to me.

Brushing and flossing? Hassle. Wearing glasses? Another hassle. But PAP is hassle-free to me because it only happens when I'm asleep--blissfully, happily, truly asleep, not partially suffocating and in various stages of a blind panic all night as my body and brain struggle for hours to get what they most desperately need. Because trying to live life without air and sleep is no life at all. And frankly, I love life. Which is why I feel actual love for the inventers, researchers, practitioners, pros, and forum helpmates who have done their part to save my life and the lives of many others around them.

Embrace the machine. It is the start of a new era for you and the end of an old one. Soon you may be the most patient person you know. Seriously, man.

Hope that was constructive enough for you, Ken.

-Jeff
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Re: Sleep Apnea Short term? Constructive recommendations only

Post by VVV » Mon Jun 13, 2022 12:31 pm

I don't post here often, but this just needs to be corrected lest someone new to CPAP sees it and becomes discouraged.
KENSKIP1 wrote:
Mon Jun 13, 2022 10:48 am
The machine forces air into the lungs and in all actuality the lungs are just in for the ride. We are only using 50% of what the lungs are designed for. I checked my pulse ox level several times. 85-90 was average. Yes this is low. While trying to sleep I noticed how shallow my breathing was. So the bottom line is, am I required to use the device every night for the rest my life? Am I supposed to be tethered to a hose while sleeping letting a machine force air into my lungs? I was under the impression that I could be free of Apnea and get along with my life. So it appears as if this device is being used as a crutch. I will not allow this to continue.
The machine does not force air into the lungs. It does not breathe for you. It does not make the muscles involved in breathing any less strong. In fact, it might make them stronger because you are breathing out against a small pressure all night long.

I've been using CPAP for 17 years. I am now 73 and still physically active.
.....................................V

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Re: Sleep Apnea Short term? Constructive recommendations only

Post by KENSKIP1 » Mon Jun 13, 2022 12:42 pm

Miss Emerita wrote:
Mon Jun 13, 2022 12:14 pm
Glad to have been of some help, Ken. When you have a chance to read information about your current AHI off your machine, I'd be interested to know what it is.

One detail you might like to know. Your settings of 8 and 13 are your minimum pressure and your maximum pressure. During the course of the night, the pressure will vary depending on whether the machine has recently detected hypopneas, obstructive apneas, snores, or flow limitations. These pressure changes are not abrupt but unfold over multiple minutes.

You have EPR set at 3. That's a good way to help resolve your hypopneas. EPR of 3 drops your pressure by 3 when you exhale; by the same token, it increases your pressure when you inhale. That boost can be helpful for hypopneas and flow limitations. EPR is a breath-by-breath change in pressure, unlike the maximum and minimum settings.
The IHI setting is now at 2.2

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Re: Sleep Apnea Short term? Constructive recommendations only

Post by Julie » Mon Jun 13, 2022 12:50 pm

Anyone ever suggest you NOT sleep on your back (there are ways to keep from flipping in your sleep) because it provokes hypopneas?

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Re: Sleep Apnea Short term? Constructive recommendations only

Post by chunkyfrog » Mon Jun 13, 2022 2:10 pm

Cpap is most useful when apnea are most common--like during REM, or when supine.
I am eternally grateful for cpap, because as a lifelong side sleeper,
I could only sleep on my back for several months following surgery for breast cancer.
(Yes, silicone frog-knockers!)

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Re: Sleep Apnea Short term? Constructive recommendations only

Post by Miss Emerita » Mon Jun 13, 2022 2:30 pm

Your AHI of 2.1 is a big improvement over your AHI on the night of your sleep test. I'm going to guess that it may come down further as you get used to the machine. No hurry on this, but can you now also see the breakdown of your AHI? It'll give you the total AHI, the AI (apnea index), and the CI (central apnea index). We can then figure out the hypopnea index by subtracting the AI from the total AHI.
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Re: Sleep Apnea Short term? Constructive recommendations only

Post by chunkyfrog » Mon Jun 13, 2022 2:55 pm

Cancer tends to aggravate depression.
Your posts indicate this rather strongly.
If you can get help, do so at the earliest opportunity.

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