CPAP Dependency Guidance

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
dataq1
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Re: CPAP Dependency Guidance

Post by dataq1 » Thu Jun 09, 2022 9:54 am

jrd42 wrote:
Wed Jun 08, 2022 2:09 pm
How do i get the doctor to move forward with me?
Is the only option i have to Purchase a CPAP machine out of my own pocket?
Your Drs reluctance to prescribe a new Pap machine may be due to restrictions from his employer (for example an HMO), but if that is not the case, AND your DR has determined that using a Pap machine is not detrimental to your health (first do no harm) then there is no reason for his reluctance. In any event, unless you acquire a new machine from a non-approved source, you WILL need a Drs prescription.

The rub here is: Will insurance cover any part of your purchase?

Many insurance companies will not cover the purchase/rental, if you have a AHI less than 15. However, if you have comorbidities that threshold drops to 5 AHI. Your BMI likely places you at the 5 AHI threshold group.

Bottom line is that you will need a Drs prescription, unless you purchase on the "grey market". If you current Dr is unwilling to prescribe, and you are adamant, you may need to find another Dr.

An alternate plan (to obtain a Rx) might be to sign up with a on-line service (like sleepmedrx.com) and begin with a home sleep study that includes a their Dr consultation and potential Rx.
"THE INFORMATION PROVIDED ON CPAPTALK.COM IS NOT INTENDED NOR RECOMMENDED AS A SUBSTITUTE FOR PROFESSIONAL MEDICAL ADVICE."

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chunkyfrog
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Re: CPAP Dependency Guidance

Post by chunkyfrog » Thu Jun 09, 2022 10:19 am

palerider wrote:
Thu Jun 09, 2022 12:02 am
chunkyfrog wrote:
Wed Jun 08, 2022 11:34 pm
Maybe the OP is in an HMO, where the motivation is to save money--not people.
We have heard many accusations that a positive dx is a scam.
I guess a phony negative is even more likely--considering the money . . .
I've heard lots of stories from people who have had false negatives... false positives are rare though,
Apparently, both are possible.
I'd like to think the errors are pure chance; but I can easily see
how intent either way can be connected to money.
If my initial positive dx was false, then I got used to sleeping
with a harmless device, and am now unable to sleep without it.
The other way around--I could be dead.
The OP needs a second opinion--or just buy his own machine.

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dataq1
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Re: CPAP Dependency Guidance

Post by dataq1 » Thu Jun 09, 2022 11:47 am

Regarding the false/negative results. It was previously alluded to here, but a more comprehensive discussion was held at viewtopic/t184245/Cease-CPAP-Use-Two-We ... t=residual.

I recently found a interesting medical study https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl ... %20calibre wherein the "Effect of chronic continuous positive airway pressure (CPAP) therapy on upper airway size in patients with sleep apnoea/hypopnoea syndrome" was studied.

What was interesting was that the authors found that after 3 months of CPAP use the posterior airway space had increased when compared with preCpap treatment.

Whether this increase in the airway space lasted for any significant time period (days, weeks) was not studied. But what it suggested was that a post-PaP sleep study may be influenced by 'recovery' ' of the upper airway to a pre-Pap status (

The implications, to @jrd42 issue of a questionable sleep study results, potentially may be related to time between ceasing Pap use and the study.
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chunkyfrog
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Re: CPAP Dependency Guidance

Post by chunkyfrog » Thu Jun 09, 2022 1:32 pm

The differential in airway space may be temporary,
thus the requirement to skip using cpap before a redundant sleep study.
Bonus!!! Stopping cpap treatment could result in an outcome
benefitting the HMO--(death of the patient, easily attributed to existing comorbidities)
No penalty--huge profit.

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ChicagoGranny
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Re: CPAP Dependency Guidance

Post by ChicagoGranny » Thu Jun 09, 2022 2:23 pm

This thread is starting to ignore important statements by the OP,
I am 39 year old 375 lb male who 12 years ago was classified with severe obstructive sleep apnea with 83.2 events per hours. ... i am 12 years older and 10 lbs heavier than my first sleep study...

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chunkyfrog
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Re: CPAP Dependency Guidance

Post by chunkyfrog » Thu Jun 09, 2022 3:01 pm

ChicagoGranny wrote:
Thu Jun 09, 2022 2:23 pm
This thread is starting to ignore important statements by the OP,
I am 39 year old 375 lb male who 12 years ago was classified with severe obstructive sleep apnea with 83.2 events per hours. ... i am 12 years older and 10 lbs heavier than my first sleep study...
Not ignored at all--but how can 12 years older and 10 pounds heavier "cure" apnea?

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ChicagoGranny
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Re: CPAP Dependency Guidance

Post by ChicagoGranny » Thu Jun 09, 2022 3:14 pm

chunkyfrog wrote:
Thu Jun 09, 2022 3:01 pm
how can 12 years older and 10 pounds heavier "cure" apnea
The extra 10 lbs. causes the dactylion to offset the pull from the hallux and open up the purlicue to increase the height of the airway. Meanwhile, the extra 12 years causes the gowpen philtrum to harden its position and hold the gnathion up which in effect eliminates the dewlip and increases the width of the airway. Unfortunately, by the 13th year, everything is reversed and OSA again. :cry:

Tec5
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Re: CPAP Dependency Guidance

Post by Tec5 » Thu Jun 09, 2022 5:03 pm

@ Granny - very funny, I’m sure that the OP will appreciate your contribution.
I am neither a physician nor a lawyer, so DO NOT rely on me for professional medical or legal advice.

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zonker
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Re: CPAP Dependency Guidance

Post by zonker » Thu Jun 09, 2022 5:06 pm

ChicagoGranny wrote:
Thu Jun 09, 2022 3:14 pm
chunkyfrog wrote:
Thu Jun 09, 2022 3:01 pm
how can 12 years older and 10 pounds heavier "cure" apnea
The extra 10 lbs. causes the dactylion to offset the pull from the hallux and open up the purlicue to increase the height of the airway. Meanwhile, the extra 12 years causes the gowpen philtrum to harden its position and hold the gnathion up which in effect eliminates the dewlip and increases the width of the airway. Unfortunately, by the 13th year, everything is reversed and OSA again. :cry:
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chunkyfrog
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Re: CPAP Dependency Guidance

Post by chunkyfrog » Thu Jun 09, 2022 7:27 pm

I thought veeblefetzers had been outlawed . . .

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zonker
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Re: CPAP Dependency Guidance

Post by zonker » Thu Jun 09, 2022 8:37 pm

chunkyfrog wrote:
Thu Jun 09, 2022 7:27 pm
I thought veeblefetzers had been outlawed . . .
when veeblefetzers are outlawed, only outlaws will have veeblefetzers.
people say i'm self absorbed.
but that's enough about them.
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Applecheeks
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Re: CPAP Dependency Guidance

Post by Applecheeks » Thu Jun 09, 2022 8:38 pm

Are you guys making fun of jrd42 or are you just not taking him seriously?

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zonker
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Re: CPAP Dependency Guidance

Post by zonker » Thu Jun 09, 2022 8:43 pm

Applecheeks wrote:
Thu Jun 09, 2022 8:38 pm
Are you guys making fun of jrd42 or are you just not taking him seriously?
*I* am making fun of chicago granny.
people say i'm self absorbed.
but that's enough about them.
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chunkyfrog
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Re: CPAP Dependency Guidance

Post by chunkyfrog » Thu Jun 09, 2022 8:43 pm

I have not decided yet.
This does not happen often--and #42 only has 2 posts.
I accept my dependence on cpap.
My life is better because of it.
The OP needs to see a REAL doctor--not the moron who thinks there is no apnea.
I suffered for several years because an HMO quack gave me a sleeping pill and an EKG,
then pronounced me "normal".
Said it was a "sleep study". I assume he is dead now--and damned for sure.

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Applecheeks
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Re: CPAP Dependency Guidance

Post by Applecheeks » Thu Jun 09, 2022 9:29 pm

chunkyfrog wrote:
Thu Jun 09, 2022 8:43 pm
The OP needs to see a REAL doctor--not the moron who thinks there is no apnea.
You seem to be judging jrd42's Doctor rather harshly.
If he is an HMO doc, he may confined to the protocols established by the HMO, rather than somehow acting out of ignorance or avarice.

His doctor did not say there is no apnea, the two sleep studies said that 2.9 is below the threshold for PaP treatment.

What it sounds like jrd42 is saying, or asking, is how can he get a study that demonstrates >5 AHI so he can have insurance foot some of his cost.

I think Dataq's reply gave him a path forward, but if yet another study still is < 5, he may have to forgo insurance support.