CPAP Rental vs. Purchase?

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
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Pugsy
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Re: CPAP Rental vs. Purchase?

Post by Pugsy » Tue Jun 07, 2022 6:19 pm

Unless side sleeping actually meant NO OSA and NO CPAP machine I wouldn't be worrying about sleeping position.
It's extremely hard to stay off one's back anyway....been there and done that but not for OSA reasons. It's extremely painful for me to be on my back and the pain wakes me up.

Just set the machine to a setting in auto mode where it can increase the pressure IF NEEDED when on one's back and let the machine sort it out.
Not everyone will have significant pressure need changes from supine to side sleeping anyway.
I don't...not with sleeping supine but I sure do with REM worsened OSA....and can't do anything about REM anyway.

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sleepquest21
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Re: CPAP Rental vs. Purchase?

Post by sleepquest21 » Tue Jun 07, 2022 6:53 pm

Thanks the tennis ball sounds a bit scary, but the stuffed backpack or pillow might work. I ordered a new mask and tubing, so I can use my existing machine until I can decide which one to order, but if I can stay off my back in the meantime, I might still be able to catch some zzz's...

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Re: CPAP Rental vs. Purchase?

Post by Janknitz » Tue Jun 07, 2022 7:09 pm

Pugsy wrote:
Tue Jun 07, 2022 6:19 pm
Unless side sleeping actually meant NO OSA and NO CPAP machine I wouldn't be worrying about sleeping position.
It's extremely hard to stay off one's back anyway....been there and done that but not for OSA reasons. It's extremely painful for me to be on my back and the pain wakes me up.

Just set the machine to a setting in auto mode where it can increase the pressure IF NEEDED when on one's back and let the machine sort it out.
Not everyone will have significant pressure need changes from supine to side sleeping anyway.
I don't...not with sleeping supine but I sure do with REM worsened OSA....and can't do anything about REM anyway.
I respectfully disagree. Since Sleepquest has had "varied results" and "never gets the type of benefit that [he hoped] for (e.g., wake feeling fully rested)" with his current treatment for 10 years (!), it's certainly worth a try. And with our help he can look at the data to see if it makes any SIGNIFICANT difference, rather than just rejecting staying off his back out of hand.
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Pugsy
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Re: CPAP Rental vs. Purchase?

Post by Pugsy » Tue Jun 07, 2022 7:22 pm

Janknitz wrote:
Tue Jun 07, 2022 7:09 pm
Pugsy wrote:
Tue Jun 07, 2022 6:19 pm
Unless side sleeping actually meant NO OSA and NO CPAP machine I wouldn't be worrying about sleeping position.
It's extremely hard to stay off one's back anyway....been there and done that but not for OSA reasons. It's extremely painful for me to be on my back and the pain wakes me up.

Just set the machine to a setting in auto mode where it can increase the pressure IF NEEDED when on one's back and let the machine sort it out.
Not everyone will have significant pressure need changes from supine to side sleeping anyway.
I don't...not with sleeping supine but I sure do with REM worsened OSA....and can't do anything about REM anyway.
I respectfully disagree. Since Sleepquest has had "varied results" and "never gets the type of benefit that [he hoped] for (e.g., wake feeling fully rested)" with his current treatment for 10 years (!), it's certainly worth a try. And with our help he can look at the data to see if it makes any SIGNIFICANT difference, rather than just rejecting staying off his back out of hand.
Of course it is worth a try and apparently some time available to try side sleeping and see what happens.
It is important to note this was a Type 3 sleep study done at home. Nothing was done to actually measure sleep status for real and any arousals were based on the accelerometer thingy.
And it was never said that there was zero OSA when side sleeping that I could find anywhere. Only that it was 7.4 times more worse when supine.

I wasn't rejecting staying off his back out of hand...sorry if that is the impression I gave.
I only meant that if I am going to be using cpap anyway then I would let the machine sort it out because it isn't always so easy to avoid ending up on one's back.
So a person can certainly try to avoid going supine but if they find that they can't/don't always succeed....then let the machine sort it out.

Now as to past 10 years not feeling well rested....that could be a whole other can of worms going on there.
There is so much that we don't know about what has been going on.

But by all means...try staying off one's back and see what happens and how he feels. There are always options.
I never said not to try....only what I would do.

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sleepquest21
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Re: CPAP Rental vs. Purchase?

Post by sleepquest21 » Wed Jun 08, 2022 4:31 pm

Pugsy wrote:
Tue Jun 07, 2022 7:22 pm
Now as to past 10 years not feeling well rested....that could be a whole other can of worms going on there.
There is so much that we don't know about what has been going on.
Thanks to everyone for the advice. Pugsy, here is my "can of worms:"

Aside from sleep apnea, much of my sleep issues in the past revolved around "burning the candle at both ends" when I was a teacher, hard-core commuter [my commuting time to Boston is around 3-4 hours per day], and parent to my own high school students at home who needed homework help often late into the night. While CPAP is helpful for making the most of sleep times, you really cannot expect a machine to make up for the missing hours of sleep. My big breakthrough came when COVID grounded me from commuting, which instantly meant at least two additional hours of sleep time every day. Instead of getting up at 5am, I was able to sleep in until around 8am. That was a major life changer, and the first time in years that I actually felt rested most days. This year, I returned to having to commute to work two days per week, which has prompted the need to reorganize things. Just two days per week of having to get up early is starting to take its toll on me physically. I am back to falling asleep while sitting at my desk sometimes in the middle of an email. I found a new sleep doctor, took the home sleep study, and started looking to replace my old machine. I have an iWatch app that tracks my sleep every night fairly reliably, so I know that I average about 6 hours of sleep, though deep sleep is always illusive, averaging only around 30-40 minutes per night. On a good month, I might hit 8 hours of sleep once or twice, and on a bad one, never. On the plus side, I fall asleep almost instantly, and I average over 85-90% efficiency (i.e., when I am in bed, I am mostly sleeping).

CPAP has never been easy for me, and I typically do not manage more than about 3-4 hours of compliance in a given night; a "good" night would be about 5 hours. I tell myself that if I woke feeling well rested I would be more compliant, but the truth is I am usually not conscious of when the mask comes off during the early morning hours. I am hoping that getting a new machine that will allow me to track my sleep better may help, but I also need to make some lifestyle changes. I have started turning off my computer and phone around 10pm, so I can focus on getting to bed earlier though it is common for me to still be up at 11pm some nights. It is, as they say, a work in progress... Paradoxically, I sleep best when I am not really that tired. The more tired that I am when I finally hit the sack, the more likely that my sleep will be disturbed by snoring, tossing and turning, and bathroom visits.

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Janknitz
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Re: CPAP Rental vs. Purchase?

Post by Janknitz » Fri Jun 10, 2022 2:48 pm

It may be that you are ripping off the mask during sleep because your machine is not adequately treating your apnea in the first place. When you get your new machine, data will help tell the story. So it will be interesting to see what the data shows, and it may be something can be tweaked in your settings that will help. But I want to attack your logic a little.

When you are not using your machine, you undoubtedly have more apneas and hypopneas. Your body responds to the inability to breathe by secreting stress hormones to wake you up and get your breathing. So any time you are spending sleeping without CPAP, you are bathing your body in stress hormones--epinephrine and cortisol to name a few. You are prevented from going into a deep sleep because every time you do, you have an event that rings the alarm bells in your body and brings you to a lighter sleep stage so you can wake enough to breathe. As long as this keeps up, you will never feel "well-rested", you will never get that deep sleep you crave, and your daytime anxiety will also be increased because you spent part of the night bathing in stress hormones. The only thing that will accomplish that is to have full compliance, not the other way around. Telling yourself you will comply when you are more well-rested is setting yourself up for defeat. Compliance is essential to being well-rested.

You will have a better picture once you have a new machine and plenty of data. But in the meantime, you may want to do a search on this forum for tips on how to keep from taking the mask off in your sleep. Because that's going to be essential in any case. You must use the CPAP every minute you sleep to see the full benefit.

It's true you have a busy life. I started CPAP with two young kids, working two jobs and attending a doctoral program at night, so I get busy and stressed, but once I adjusted to CPAP I have had 100% compliance always. I credit properly treated sleep apnea for getting me through all that and more. Half-ass treatment would not have permitted me to cope with all I've accomplished . Not using CPAP consistently was simply NOT an option --I would probably be dead now.

I also wager you won't feel so burdened by your schedule and life once you are getting better sleep.
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Re: CPAP Rental vs. Purchase?

Post by clownbell » Sat Jun 11, 2022 5:50 pm

If I recall correctly, OP mentioned positional apnea. The new sleep study appears to show clusters of events, which would also suggest positional apnea. I suggest that OP carefully read the wiki about positional apnea and consider a soft collar to deal with the clusters.
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sleepquest21
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Re: CPAP Rental vs. Purchase?

Post by sleepquest21 » Fri Jun 24, 2022 3:10 pm

Thanks for your post, I will read up on positional apnea and look into getting the right pillow. The advice from the group on ways to sleep on your side has already helped, even without the CPAP.

Good news! My insurance finally pre-approved me to get the new CPAP machine. I ordered the Air Sense 10 from cpap.com and got a nice discount to boot. I have a new mask and tubing, so once the machine arrives I will be all set to try it out. Will probably need help figuring out how to pull the sleep data card and set up Oscar software, but I am looking forward to better sleep.

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Re: CPAP Rental vs. Purchase?

Post by chunkyfrog » Fri Jun 24, 2022 3:59 pm

I hope the new machine is an AUTOSET.
Anything less will not be as useful.

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