Apap is hissing and pressure feels too low

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
User avatar
strawberryfields
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 7:10 am

Re: Apap is hissing and pressure feels too low

Post by strawberryfields » Sat Aug 07, 2021 1:26 pm

ChicagoGranny wrote:
Sat Aug 07, 2021 12:37 pm
strawberryfields wrote:
Sat Aug 07, 2021 4:05 am
If I don't figure it out by Monday, I'm gonna call remsed and send both machines to repair.
Which country? In the US, warranty issues are handled by the equipment suppliers, not machine manufacturers. Nothing to get hung about.
Haha good one :)
I am in Germany, my equipment supplier is Resmed. Here they have branches in different cities where people are supplied with their cpap equipment directly by them.
Airsense 10 For Her
F20 full face mask

User avatar
strawberryfields
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 7:10 am

Re: Apap is hissing and pressure feels too low

Post by strawberryfields » Thu Sep 09, 2021 8:08 am

Update:
So after a month of waiting, Resmed sent me a backup machine (the regular Airense 10). I was so looking forward to finally get some sleep again, but when I went to sleep with the new machine, it had the exact same problem as the other two.
The pressure feels way too low, I put it on max settings (20 hPa) just to see if it would make any difference, and there seems to be a small difference but even then I still can't breathe well.
I am at a loss.

Basically, I have now tried 3 machines (For her, 2x regular Airsense 10), tried two different masks, 3 different hoses, 3 different water chambers. Nothing seems to help.
If anyone still has any ideas, anything at all, please let me know.

My mental health and physical health took a nosedive in this last month because I am barely getting any sleep due to this.
Airsense 10 For Her
F20 full face mask

User avatar
palerider
Posts: 32300
Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2009 5:43 pm
Location: Dallas(ish).

Re: Apap is hissing and pressure feels too low

Post by palerider » Thu Sep 09, 2021 9:14 am

Get someone else to look over the machines, preferably someone familiar with them.

The chances of three machines having the exact same problems is vanishingly low.

_________________
Mask: Bleep DreamPort CPAP Mask Solution
Additional Comments: S9 VPAP Auto
Get OSCAR

Accounts to put on the foe list: dataq1, clownbell, gearchange, lynninnj, mper!?, DreamDiver, Geer1, almostadoctor, sleepgeek, ajack, stom, mogy, D.H., They often post misleading, timewasting stuff.

User avatar
strawberryfields
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 7:10 am

Re: Apap is hissing and pressure feels too low

Post by strawberryfields » Thu Sep 09, 2021 9:56 am

palerider wrote:
Thu Sep 09, 2021 9:14 am
Get someone else to look over the machines, preferably someone familiar with them.

The chances of three machines having the exact same problems is vanishingly low.
I've been thinking the same thing, it seems really odd. I really don't understand what is happening.
I wanted to send the machines in for repair, but resmed said they will just replace the Airsense 10. I suppose I can call again and ask if I can bring the machines to my local resmed branch and have them take a look.
Airsense 10 For Her
F20 full face mask

User avatar
Jlfinkels
Posts: 468
Joined: Sun Jun 20, 2021 3:51 pm

Re: Apap is hissing and pressure feels too low

Post by Jlfinkels » Thu Sep 09, 2021 3:54 pm

strawberryfields wrote:
Thu Sep 09, 2021 9:56 am
palerider wrote:
Thu Sep 09, 2021 9:14 am
Get someone else to look over the machines, preferably someone familiar with them.

The chances of three machines having the exact same problems is vanishingly low.
I've been thinking the same thing, it seems really odd. I really don't understand what is happening.
I wanted to send the machines in for repair, but resmed said they will just replace the Airsense 10. I suppose I can call again and ask if I can bring the machines to my local resmed branch and have them take a look.
Palerider is spot on.

1. Machine 1 seemingly develops a new “hissing” sound after not having it for some period of time
2. Machine 2 with the same mask, hose, etc, emits the same sound
3. Machine 3 with the same mask, hose, etc, emits the same sound

So, we can conclude it is likely not the machine doing something new as it occurred with multiple machines. There has to be something else going on. Given that for each test the only common thread is the hose and mask, it likely is something there.

Any chance you have OSCAR set up and can show some a night or two data? Just want to be sure the machine is not sensing a major leak. Something else to consider is to take a piece of tissue paper and hold it near the machine, hose, and mask at different points to see where air may be escaping.

Pugsy’s manometer suggestion is a good one. If the machine shows it is producing x pressure (cmH2O or hPa), then it should be coming out the hose at the far end. I’ll throw out another one, make sure somehow the machine configuration has not been accidentally changed.

It’s a poser…
Sometimes it is the very people who no one imagines anything of who do the things that no one imagines

FelineFancy
Posts: 1
Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2021 2:01 pm

Re: Apap is hissing and pressure feels too low

Post by FelineFancy » Sat Sep 11, 2021 2:23 pm

This reminds me of things I experienced while getting used to my CPAP therapy. I want to share since I haven't seen anything similar discussed elsewhere.

While I was starting to get acclimated to my therapy, I was completely convinced that after hours of my machine running (so for me early in the morning just before getting out of bed), that it was not delivering enough pressure and making louder noises than it should me (whezing/whirling noises).

In an effort to confirm this, I used a calibrated digital manometer (one intended for HVAC work) and a digital audio reorder to monitor multiple nights of usage.

To my surprise, the manometer confirmed that the machine was in fact delivering the expected pressure the entire time, and the recordings from the audio recorder showed no difference in the intensity of the CPAP machine sound between the beginning and the end of the sessions.

Given those findings, I concluded that the pressure difference I was perceiving had been solely the result of my body becoming more acclimated to the increased pressure as the night progressed. And, I assume that after hours of near silence during the nigh, the machine just seemed louder to me towards the end of therapy when in reality nothing about it had actually changed.

Your situation could be completely different from mine. But since it does remind me a little of what I went thought, I thought this might be helpful.

User avatar
zonker
Posts: 11011
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2015 4:36 pm

Re: Apap is hissing and pressure feels too low

Post by zonker » Sat Sep 11, 2021 4:38 pm

FelineFancy wrote:
Sat Sep 11, 2021 2:23 pm

Given those findings, I concluded that the pressure difference I was perceiving had been solely the result of my body becoming more acclimated to the increased pressure as the night progressed. And, I assume that after hours of near silence during the nigh, the machine just seemed louder to me towards the end of therapy when in reality nothing about it had actually changed.
Image

very good, new user. you have confirmed, quite correctly, something that takes a newbie a long time to discern.

and you used science!!

welcome to the zoo and hope to hear more from you in the future.
people say i'm self absorbed.
but that's enough about them.
Oscar-Win
https://www.apneaboard.com/OSCAR/OSCAR-1.5.1-Win64.exe
Oscar-Mac
https://www.apneaboard.com/OSCAR/OSCAR-1.5.1.dmg

User avatar
strawberryfields
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 7:10 am

Re: Apap is hissing and pressure feels too low

Post by strawberryfields » Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:05 am

Jlfinkels wrote:
Thu Sep 09, 2021 3:54 pm
strawberryfields wrote:
Thu Sep 09, 2021 9:56 am
palerider wrote:
Thu Sep 09, 2021 9:14 am
Get someone else to look over the machines, preferably someone familiar with them.

The chances of three machines having the exact same problems is vanishingly low.
I've been thinking the same thing, it seems really odd. I really don't understand what is happening.
I wanted to send the machines in for repair, but resmed said they will just replace the Airsense 10. I suppose I can call again and ask if I can bring the machines to my local resmed branch and have them take a look.
Palerider is spot on.

1. Machine 1 seemingly develops a new “hissing” sound after not having it for some period of time
2. Machine 2 with the same mask, hose, etc, emits the same sound
3. Machine 3 with the same mask, hose, etc, emits the same sound

So, we can conclude it is likely not the machine doing something new as it occurred with multiple machines. There has to be something else going on. Given that for each test the only common thread is the hose and mask, it likely is something there.

Any chance you have OSCAR set up and can show some a night or two data? Just want to be sure the machine is not sensing a major leak. Something else to consider is to take a piece of tissue paper and hold it near the machine, hose, and mask at different points to see where air may be escaping.

Pugsy’s manometer suggestion is a good one. If the machine shows it is producing x pressure (cmH2O or hPa), then it should be coming out the hose at the far end. I’ll throw out another one, make sure somehow the machine configuration has not been accidentally changed.

It’s a poser…
Hi, thanks for your reply! And sorry for taking so long to respond.
I agree it's most likely not the machine(s) that is the issue.
I got a new hose with the new machine, and I also bought a new mask 2 weeks ago. Sometimes it randomly works properly again, and then later it doesn't.
I'll attach the OSCAR screenshots.
The DIY manometer seemed quite complicated to me (I'm not very talented with such things), I'll check amazon to see if they have one not too expensive.
The machine's configuration is fine, I checked.
Attachments
screenshot-20210921-150425.png
screenshot-20210921-150425.png (86.08 KiB) Viewed 2644 times
screenshot-20210921-150323.png
screenshot-20210921-150323.png (84.15 KiB) Viewed 2644 times
Airsense 10 For Her
F20 full face mask

User avatar
strawberryfields
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 7:10 am

Re: Apap is hissing and pressure feels too low

Post by strawberryfields » Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:10 am

FelineFancy wrote:
Sat Sep 11, 2021 2:23 pm
This reminds me of things I experienced while getting used to my CPAP therapy. I want to share since I haven't seen anything similar discussed elsewhere.

While I was starting to get acclimated to my therapy, I was completely convinced that after hours of my machine running (so for me early in the morning just before getting out of bed), that it was not delivering enough pressure and making louder noises than it should me (whezing/whirling noises).

In an effort to confirm this, I used a calibrated digital manometer (one intended for HVAC work) and a digital audio reorder to monitor multiple nights of usage.

To my surprise, the manometer confirmed that the machine was in fact delivering the expected pressure the entire time, and the recordings from the audio recorder showed no difference in the intensity of the CPAP machine sound between the beginning and the end of the sessions.

Given those findings, I concluded that the pressure difference I was perceiving had been solely the result of my body becoming more acclimated to the increased pressure as the night progressed. And, I assume that after hours of near silence during the nigh, the machine just seemed louder to me towards the end of therapy when in reality nothing about it had actually changed.

Your situation could be completely different from mine. But since it does remind me a little of what I went thought, I thought this might be helpful.
Hi, thanks for your reply!
Since several people mentioned it, I will look on amazon for a manometer.
I considered this for myself as well, though I have the pressure problem when falling asleep, it feels like not getting enough air, it takes more effort to breathe than it used to, which makes it hard to relax and fall asleep, and I feel shitty the next morning and most of the day as well.
I have been using Apap for over 2 years, never had this problem before.
Airsense 10 For Her
F20 full face mask

User avatar
palerider
Posts: 32300
Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2009 5:43 pm
Location: Dallas(ish).

Re: Apap is hissing and pressure feels too low

Post by palerider » Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:23 am

Replace the Pressure graph with the Mask Pressure and post a night where you're having problems please.

_________________
Mask: Bleep DreamPort CPAP Mask Solution
Additional Comments: S9 VPAP Auto
Get OSCAR

Accounts to put on the foe list: dataq1, clownbell, gearchange, lynninnj, mper!?, DreamDiver, Geer1, almostadoctor, sleepgeek, ajack, stom, mogy, D.H., They often post misleading, timewasting stuff.

User avatar
strawberryfields
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 7:10 am

Re: Apap is hissing and pressure feels too low

Post by strawberryfields » Wed Sep 22, 2021 4:44 am

palerider wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:23 am
Replace the Pressure graph with the Mask Pressure and post a night where you're having problems please.
Okay
Attachments
screenshot-20210922-124345.png
screenshot-20210922-124345.png (91.61 KiB) Viewed 2599 times
Airsense 10 For Her
F20 full face mask

User avatar
palerider
Posts: 32300
Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2009 5:43 pm
Location: Dallas(ish).

Re: Apap is hissing and pressure feels too low

Post by palerider » Wed Sep 22, 2021 12:14 pm

strawberryfields wrote:
Wed Sep 22, 2021 4:44 am
palerider wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:23 am
Replace the Pressure graph with the Mask Pressure and post a night where you're having problems please.
Okay
So, the mask pressure graph is a recording of the *measured* pressure, not just desired pressure, on a breath by breath basis, compensated for the pressure drop resistances that are incurred by the humidifier, hose, any antibacterial filter and the mask itself.

You'll note that with only a couple of exceptions near the start of the night, the pressure was measured as being what was desired. You can zoom in on those minor discrepancies with the arrow keys on the keyboard, or by clicking and highlighting just that section.

I can't see any legitimate problems.

I can't remember if anybody has asked if you have the tube type setting correct for the size tube/hose you're using? if you're not using a heated hose, the tube type needs to be set manually, and if it's set to 'regular' and you have a slim hose, the pressure will be wrong at the mask.

_________________
Mask: Bleep DreamPort CPAP Mask Solution
Additional Comments: S9 VPAP Auto
Get OSCAR

Accounts to put on the foe list: dataq1, clownbell, gearchange, lynninnj, mper!?, DreamDiver, Geer1, almostadoctor, sleepgeek, ajack, stom, mogy, D.H., They often post misleading, timewasting stuff.

User avatar
strawberryfields
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 7:10 am

Re: Apap is hissing and pressure feels too low

Post by strawberryfields » Wed Sep 22, 2021 3:49 pm

palerider wrote:
Wed Sep 22, 2021 12:14 pm
strawberryfields wrote:
Wed Sep 22, 2021 4:44 am
palerider wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:23 am
Replace the Pressure graph with the Mask Pressure and post a night where you're having problems please.
Okay
So, the mask pressure graph is a recording of the *measured* pressure, not just desired pressure, on a breath by breath basis, compensated for the pressure drop resistances that are incurred by the humidifier, hose, any antibacterial filter and the mask itself.

You'll note that with only a couple of exceptions near the start of the night, the pressure was measured as being what was desired. You can zoom in on those minor discrepancies with the arrow keys on the keyboard, or by clicking and highlighting just that section.

I can't see any legitimate problems.

I can't remember if anybody has asked if you have the tube type setting correct for the size tube/hose you're using? if you're not using a heated hose, the tube type needs to be set manually, and if it's set to 'regular' and you have a slim hose, the pressure will be wrong at the mask.
Okay, thank you. I will check about the tube settings.

edit: just checked the tube settings. They are correct.
Airsense 10 For Her
F20 full face mask

User avatar
strawberryfields
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2019 7:10 am

Re: Apap is hissing and pressure feels too low

Post by strawberryfields » Sat Nov 27, 2021 11:04 am

Update and question:

I had an appointment with Resmed in October, when I was there my apap worked normally, and the manometer test showed that the pressure was correctly delivered. I tried the apap out while I was there and the pressure felt normal, no strange noises either. The technician said the machine is working fine.

When I was back home, my apap was again making noise and the pressure kept feeling too low. I thought the problem might somehow be my house, so I tried sleeping elsewhere with the Apap, the problem appeared at the other house too.

What I did for now was just increasing the pressure so I am able to breathe, I currently have my min pressure at 19, but it felt more like 8 or so, definitely not like 19. Last night it felt even lower, the delivered air pressure feels so weak, I am finding it impossible to fall asleep like that.

I asked Resmed if they would send someone to my home to take a look at the Apap here, but unfortunately they didn't agree to it.

To my question: I decided that I want to buy a manometer to finally measure the delivered pressure at home, but I am unsure which manometer is compatible with the apap machine, and has the correct unit (the ones I looked at on amazon were mostly for much bigger pressure units). If someone knows of a compatible affordable manometer, could you please post a link? Thanks!
Airsense 10 For Her
F20 full face mask

User avatar
Julie
Posts: 19898
Joined: Tue Feb 28, 2006 12:58 pm

Re: Apap is hissing and pressure feels too low

Post by Julie » Sat Nov 27, 2021 12:05 pm

Ask You Tube "How to build a manometer?" and you can do it at home.