Is REM sleep generally a more-is-better kind of thing?

old dude · Post by **old dude** » Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:44 am

After moving 40 miles and going from a recliner to a memory foam adjustable bed (set to mimic the recliner) it appears that my successful sleep protocol has been set back to the beginning. AHIs that were consistently in the 0.0 to 0.6 range are now in the 2.0 to 4.0 range, with the hourly AHI chart sometimes showing short spikes to the 15 range. My pressures are 11-14 with EPR of 2, which is about as high as I can go without bad leak disturbances. My back dictates supine sleep only.

I do notice that I'm having longer and more frequent periods of what appear to be REM, and I'm guessing that may be due to the greater comfort level of the mew bed. The increased REM activity is where all the newfound AHI trouble is and is mostly all hypopneas with few to no OAs or centrals. Question is, is this increased REM activity good, bad or neither? I might add that in spite of this, I'm generally sleeping better and feeling better throughout the day than I was before.

I'll add that I'm guessing the answer would be to set the max pressure to 20 and let it sort things out as designed, but at 14 I'm about at the limit of being able to control leaks so they don't keep me awake.

Dog Slobber · Post by **Dog Slobber** » Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:50 am

A lot of us experience more Obstructive Apneas during REM, myself included.

Here's a link on sleep cycles.

https://www.tuck.com/stages/

I'm really not sure how important REM sleep is. I do know that Stage 3, just prior to REM is important for restorative and physical health.

zonker · Post by **zonker** » Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:57 am

old dude wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:44 am
After moving 40 miles and going from a recliner to a memory foam adjustable bed (set to mimic the recliner) it appears that my successful sleep protocol has been set back to the beginning. AHIs that were consistently in the 0.0 to 0.6 range are now in the 2.0 to 4.0 range, with the hourly AHI chart sometimes showing short spikes to the 15 range. My pressures are 11-14 with EPR of 2, which is about as high as I can go without bad leak disturbances. My back dictates supine sleep only.

I do notice that I'm having longer and more frequent periods of what appear to be REM, and I'm guessing that may be due to the greater comfort level of the mew bed. The increased REM activity is where all the newfound AHI trouble is and is mostly all hypopneas with few to no OAs or centrals. Question is, is this increased REM activity good, bad or neither? I might add that in spite of this, I'm generally sleeping better and feeling better throughout the day than I was before.

I'll add that I'm guessing the answer would be to set the max pressure to 20 and let it sort things out as designed, but at 14 I'm about at the limit of being able to control leaks so they don't keep me awake.

well, that sucks. i mean, you were doing so well, then you get knocked back. look, i'm no expert and you certainly have more years at this than i, but a couple of things spring to mind.

1. why not raise your minimum pressure rather than max? i think that might do more good in taming your hypopneas.

2. or, do nothing. if your sleep is good and you wake up refreshed, who cares about higher numbers?

jnk... · Post by **jnk...** » Mon Apr 29, 2019 11:07 am

It is counter-intuitive, but sometimes better overall sleep can mean slightly higher AHI. Especially if a night without much REM is the primary factor that results in low AHI reports.

REM is not yet well understood. But for most of us, it is helpful to wake up at the same time every morning if we want to allow our brains to schedule effectively the final long REM of the night.

old dude · Post by **old dude** » Mon Apr 29, 2019 11:12 am

zonker wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:57 am

old dude wrote: ↑
Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:44 am
After moving 40 miles and going from a recliner to a memory foam adjustable bed (set to mimic the recliner) it appears that my successful sleep protocol has been set back to the beginning. AHIs that were consistently in the 0.0 to 0.6 range are now in the 2.0 to 4.0 range, with the hourly AHI chart sometimes showing short spikes to the 15 range. My pressures are 11-14 with EPR of 2, which is about as high as I can go without bad leak disturbances. My back dictates supine sleep only.

I do notice that I'm having longer and more frequent periods of what appear to be REM, and I'm guessing that may be due to the greater comfort level of the mew bed. The increased REM activity is where all the newfound AHI trouble is and is mostly all hypopneas with few to no OAs or centrals. Question is, is this increased REM activity good, bad or neither? I might add that in spite of this, I'm generally sleeping better and feeling better throughout the day than I was before.

I'll add that I'm guessing the answer would be to set the max pressure to 20 and let it sort things out as designed, but at 14 I'm about at the limit of being able to control leaks so they don't keep me awake.
well, that sucks. i mean, you were doing so well, then you get knocked back. look, i'm no expert and you certainly have more years at this than i, but a couple of things spring to mind.

1. why not raise your minimum pressure rather than max? i think that might do more good in taming your hypopneas.

2. or, do nothing. if your sleep is good and you wake up refreshed, who cares about higher numbers?

Although on this board folks like to stay under 2-ish, every sleep doc I've ever seen says not to worry up to 5. So I wouldn't be too concerned about the overall AHI numbers I'm getting for the entire night, but when I see larger numbers (up to 15) pop up on the SH hourly graph for short times it does bother me. It would seem to be a little like Hemoglobin A1c numbers with us diabetics: you can have a good overall A1c number but still have dangerous situational spikes since the A1c number is an average. I'd assume that the AHI number works the same way.

jnk... · Post by **jnk...** » Mon Apr 29, 2019 11:15 am

Many of us need higher pressures during REM, which is why we allow the Max to be wide open at 20 so the auto can do what it needs to do when it needs to do it.

Is REM sleep generally a more-is-better kind of thing?

Is REM sleep generally a more-is-better kind of thing?

Re: Is REM sleep generally a more-is-better kind of thing?

Re: Is REM sleep generally a more-is-better kind of thing?

Re: Is REM sleep generally a more-is-better kind of thing?

Re: Is REM sleep generally a more-is-better kind of thing?

Re: Is REM sleep generally a more-is-better kind of thing?