CPAPtalk.com

Wulfman... wrote:If you'll reread my post, I was referring to how someone from the sleep-medical community MAY try to find a single, therapeutic pressure

your "MAY" theory isn't consistent with any of the titration guides, or titration equipment.

Wulfman... wrote:Or, more specifically, how they probably did it in the past......and how Kaiser, more recently probably did/does it, as a general rule.

from everything I've read (mostly here, admittedly) Kaiser uses a home test to see if one has apnea, then sends out an APAP for normal use. perhaps I'm mistaken.

Wulfman... wrote:

ChicagoGranny wrote:

wrote:Ideally, if the person directing the pressure search uses a method which increases the minimum pressure and reduces the maximum pressure, over a reasonably short period of time, they should be able to narrow it down to an optimum single pressure.

... completely oblivious to the fact that humans' pressure needs will vary as they change body positions, as they cycle through different stages of sleep and as their pressure needs even vary from night to night.

The big advantage of APAP is that it allows the patient to use a lower pressure when a lower pressure is sufficient for good therapy. Many will be able to sleep much of the night at lower pressures. Yet, the APAP will provide a higher pressure when needed.

Why do you think Pugsy is always telling people that the 95% pressure statistics doesn't mean much? Because people sleep comfortably at lower pressures much of the night and the higher pressures only come when needed.

There is nothing "ideal" or "optimum" about selecting a single pressure.

If you'll reread my post, I was referring to how someone from the sleep-medical community MAY try to find a single, therapeutic pressure for a person for whom they would be prescribing a straight-pressure CPAP. Or, more specifically, how they probably did it in the past......and how Kaiser, more recently probably did/does it, as a general rule. They didn't always give out APAPs and many still don't prescribe them at will. All you have to do is see how many "bricks" have been and still are being dispensed.


Den

.

Just FYI, I was just dispensed a Resmed S10 APAP by Kaiser 2 weeks ago. They tell me that's the minimum they dispense. This is for the Denver metro area. Other areas have reported APAPs as well, but Respironics I believe.

Kaiser seems to be interested in the efficacy of my treatment, because they recognize that they'll be spending a whale of a lot more down the road with ineffective treatment.

Kaiser can be frustrating at times, and have the Army herd mentality for health care, but they also have a vested financial interest in keeping me healthy. They can treat the most by having their group classes, taught by semi professional people, and use the expensive doctor teams for the more difficult few. If you need the additional expertise of the doctors, you can't be afraid of making some noise.

Bill

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

wm_hess wrote:

Wulfman... wrote:

ChicagoGranny wrote:

wrote:Ideally, if the person directing the pressure search uses a method which increases the minimum pressure and reduces the maximum pressure, over a reasonably short period of time, they should be able to narrow it down to an optimum single pressure.

... completely oblivious to the fact that humans' pressure needs will vary as they change body positions, as they cycle through different stages of sleep and as their pressure needs even vary from night to night.

The big advantage of APAP is that it allows the patient to use a lower pressure when a lower pressure is sufficient for good therapy. Many will be able to sleep much of the night at lower pressures. Yet, the APAP will provide a higher pressure when needed.

Why do you think Pugsy is always telling people that the 95% pressure statistics doesn't mean much? Because people sleep comfortably at lower pressures much of the night and the higher pressures only come when needed.

There is nothing "ideal" or "optimum" about selecting a single pressure.

If you'll reread my post, I was referring to how someone from the sleep-medical community MAY try to find a single, therapeutic pressure for a person for whom they would be prescribing a straight-pressure CPAP. Or, more specifically, how they probably did it in the past......and how Kaiser, more recently probably did/does it, as a general rule. They didn't always give out APAPs and many still don't prescribe them at will. All you have to do is see how many "bricks" have been and still are being dispensed.


Den

.

Just FYI, I was just dispensed a Resmed S10 APAP by Kaiser 2 weeks ago. They tell me that's the minimum they dispense. This is for the Denver metro area. Other areas have reported APAPs as well, but Respironics I believe.

Kaiser seems to be interested in the efficacy of my treatment, because they recognize that they'll be spending a whale of a lot more down the road with ineffective treatment.

Kaiser can be frustrating at times, and have the Army herd mentality for health care, but they also have a vested financial interest in keeping me healthy. They can treat the most by having their group classes, taught by semi professional people, and use the expensive doctor teams for the more difficult few. If you need the additional expertise of the doctors, you can't be afraid of making some noise.

Bill

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

Thanks for that information, Bill.
That's interesting about them dispensing ResMed machines. For years, we heard they were pretty tied to Respironics.
It was also reported for many years that the VA dispensed Respironics machines.......and mostly data-capable straight-pressure CPAPs. Sounds like some of them are now going the APAP route.

Anyway, I'm glad to hear some of those entities are (apparently) changing their protocols.

Unfortunately, the "big problem" remains.......the manufacturers are still making "bricks" and the DMEs are still putting their profit above the patients' therapy and health.


Den

.

wm_hess wrote:I was just dispensed a Resmed S10 APAP

What do you say, PaleRider?

ChicagoGranny wrote:

wm_hess wrote:I was just dispensed a Resmed S10 APAP

What do you say, PaleRider?

well, I had said

palerider wrote:from everything I've read (mostly here, admittedly) Kaiser uses a home test to see if one has apnea, then sends out an APAP for normal use. perhaps I'm mistaken.

so I guess I'd say "looks like I wasn't mistaken."

A didgeridoo does work, but it only helps mild apnea AND you have to keep doing it. Make sure your neighbors know or keep your windows shut. My BIL uses one and he actually enjoys playing it.

Listen to this and then decide if you want it. Obviously, this was an expensive or custom one featured in the video; BIL got his for about $40-50 with shipping. He learned to play it using the internet.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHSRv4Hsxn0

Why don't I try it? I don't just have mild apnea, so it isn't going to solve the problem for me.

I ordered mine from Australia, it cut my AHI in half, and all I did was blow on the package for 10 minutes, and put it in my closet, next to my XPAP.

Lead and Gold Standard side by side, in the dark. Jim

I'm a tuba player. Apnea still severe as hell.

We trust the machines because they work and that's what they're for.

Tubas are for entertainment.

Listen to your doctor.

Correct use:



Health benefits of Vibroacoustic Sound Therapy with the didgeridoo:

When played directly over the whole energetic being, it produces a wide range of low frequency ultra sound waves that effectively relieve muscle tension / pain, enhance recovery from injury or illness, clears chakras, promotes emotional and physical release, restore energetic balance and stimulate cellular rejuvenation. Its unique sound also enables us to experience deep meditation by achieving theta and delta brainwave states. During group meditations, I go around to each person, playing and channeling energy throughout their whole energetic being. For individual sessions I play for the whole hour giving direct Vibroacoustic Sound Therapy to the individual, in essence a "full body sound massage". Some common benefits people experience during or after a meditation or private individual session include: A positive sensation of tingling throughout the body (cellular and nerve stimulation), intestinal cleansing after session, deep emotional release, relief from pain caused by arthritis or bone injury, an infusion of energy within the body, a feeling of bliss, deep gratitude and peace.

One of the most amazing things aside from helping others with the didgeridoo, is the health benefits received from playing it. The energy, vitality, awareness and spiritual growth I have experienced through countless hours playing is beyond words priceless!

Some day, there will be a cure; but it will not be a hobby that makes your neighbors want to kill you.

chunkyfrog wrote:Some day, there will be a cure; but it will not be a hobby that makes your neighbors want to kill you.

Yes badly played it sounds like a bull smelling a cow in heat with no satisfaction.

palerider wrote:

Wulfman... wrote:Or, more specifically, how they probably did it in the past......and how Kaiser, more recently probably did/does it, as a general rule.

from everything I've read (mostly here, admittedly) Kaiser uses a home test to see if one has apnea, then sends out an APAP for normal use. perhaps I'm mistaken.

"Strolling" back through the archives........
It appears that Kaiser/Apria began changing their policies and philosophies on non-data-capable machines ( "bricks" ) and APAP machines somewhere around 2010 - 2011. Some got APAPs if they had asthma. BUT, prior to that period, they got tested on APAPs and were dispensed "bricks".


Den

.


February 2015

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=104102&p=981015&hil ... er#p981015

The tech told me that ResMed is not on their formulary and that Respronics are the only machines that they give out.


December 2014

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=102921&p=965592&hil ... er#p965592



July 2014

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=98838&p=918182&hili ... er#p918182

Kaiser sets the APAP wide open (4-20 cm) when they send the patient home for titration week and then the prescription settings are based on where the pressure went during the titration week. When we do it ourselves, the 95% number usually is our starting point for narrowing the pressure range.


October 2012

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=83072&p=753641&hili ... er#p753641

I asked my doctor for APAP (Long story but it’s the only way to get a data capable machine through Kaiser/Apria) and she freaked out that I could only have CPAP. Why!? Isn’t’ APAP just the same as CPAP but better? And you can set it to CPAP if you want?

I was originally given a brick and yelled and screamed and insisted on something with data capabilities so the doctor is making me jump through hoops to get it. I need to know what I need before I go in there demanding what I want.


September 2012 ( interesting thread......people discussing the "bricks" they previously received from Kaiser/Apria )

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=82079&p=745375&hili ... er#p745375


August 2011

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1005&p=627171&hilit=+Kaiser#p627171

My HMO (Kaiser) usually gives everyone a straight CPAP, but if (like me) you have a diagnosis of asthma they automatically give you an APAP. Some people need a BiPAP, depending on how they are doing with their asthma.


December 2009

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=47543&p=429907&hili ... er#p429907

The machine I was sent is the Respironics M Series Plus with C-Flex.

So, after all that, here’s my question… I know my machine isn’t fully data capable, but I don’t know what data is does or doesn’t display. What kind of useful data can I get from this machine and how do I get it?


.

OK. Here's your question for the day. (it's a multiple choice)
When was the first use of the term "brick" used to describe a non-data-capable CPAP machine?

Was it this one?

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=44017&p=391637&hilit=+brick#p391637

or this one?

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=46284&p=415542&hilit=+brick#p415542

or this one?

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=47665&p=431526&hilit=+brick#p431526

or.......this one?

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=52592&p=485820&hilit=+brick#p485820


.

Wulfman... wrote:

palerider wrote:

Wulfman... wrote:Or, more specifically, how they probably did it in the past......and how Kaiser, more recently probably did/does it, as a general rule.

from everything I've read (mostly here, admittedly) Kaiser uses a home test to see if one has apnea, then sends out an APAP for normal use. perhaps I'm mistaken.

"Strolling" back through the archives........

perhaps if you'd prefaced your stuff with "back in the irrelevant days of yore"...

palerider wrote:

Wulfman... wrote:

palerider wrote:

Wulfman... wrote:Or, more specifically, how they probably did it in the past......and how Kaiser, more recently probably did/does it, as a general rule.

from everything I've read (mostly here, admittedly) Kaiser uses a home test to see if one has apnea, then sends out an APAP for normal use. perhaps I'm mistaken.

"Strolling" back through the archives........

perhaps if you'd prefaced your stuff with "back in the irrelevant days of yore"...

No.
Because the information I was describing for the forum member who asked, was mainly from an historic perspective.

Good night!

Den

.

avi123 wrote:Correct use:

Yes, Avi, that's very good. If you can sleep with your neck thrown back and your hands on your heels, you will not have any apneas.