CPAPtalk.com

palerider wrote:

Wulfman... wrote: but in reality, Flow Limitations....don't have that much of a detrimental effect on a person's therapy, oxygen intake or other things. They're little, tiny hypopneas and aren't counted in the AHI numbers.

the people on the uars bandwagon would beg to disagree with you, if you've got a lot of FLs, then you're working harder at night to take a breath than if you've got an open airway, and they may be causing more unrest, and smaller arousals, thus disrupting restful sleep.

What makes you think that I'm not already ON that UARS wagon (never was in a "band") and haven't had FLs?
The week I used a range of pressures with my first Auto in July of 2006, my FLs ranged from 0.0 to 1.2.......Snore Indexes from 2.8 to 9.6.
As I found out more about this therapy and the human anatomy, I became angry that my original doctor(s) hadn't sent me to an ENT for evaluation. Nobody ever asked me "Can you breathe through your nose?" I've had nasal restrictions all my life but by tweaking my CPAP therapy, it has helped by doing nasal cleansing and using cool "passover" humidification.


Den

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tan wrote:

Wulfman... wrote:At what pressure does it "tame the FLs"? Maybe you could try setting your pressure at THAT setting and see how things go.

There may be more of them, but in reality, Flow Limitations......other than triggering pressure increases in Autos.....don't have that much of a detrimental effect on a person's therapy, oxygen intake or other things. They're little, tiny hypopneas and aren't counted in the AHI numbers.

Yes, also, sleep apnea hits only fat people, and... wait... what was it... ah, sleep apnea is a scam to help relieve you of your money.

Sooooo......tweak your therapy or see an ENT to find out what to do about it.


Den

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Wulfman... wrote:

tan wrote:

Wulfman... wrote:At what pressure does it "tame the FLs"? Maybe you could try setting your pressure at THAT setting and see how things go.

There may be more of them, but in reality, Flow Limitations......other than triggering pressure increases in Autos.....don't have that much of a detrimental effect on a person's therapy, oxygen intake or other things. They're little, tiny hypopneas and aren't counted in the AHI numbers.

Yes, also, sleep apnea hits only fat people, and... wait... what was it... ah, sleep apnea is a scam to help relieve you of your money.

Sooooo......tweak your therapy or see an ENT to find out what to do about it.

Surgery or BiPAP. I am on the latter at the moment.

tan wrote:

Wulfman... wrote:.don't have that much of a detrimental effect on a person's therapy, oxygen intake or other things. They're little, tiny hypopneas and aren't counted in the AHI numbers.

Yes, also, sleep apnea hits only fat people, and... wait... what was it... ah, sleep apnea is a scam to help relieve you of your money.

I'm glad you weren't waving the big sword at me

tan wrote:

Wulfman... wrote:

tan wrote:

Wulfman... wrote:At what pressure does it "tame the FLs"? Maybe you could try setting your pressure at THAT setting and see how things go.

There may be more of them, but in reality, Flow Limitations......other than triggering pressure increases in Autos.....don't have that much of a detrimental effect on a person's therapy, oxygen intake or other things. They're little, tiny hypopneas and aren't counted in the AHI numbers.

Yes, also, sleep apnea hits only fat people, and... wait... what was it... ah, sleep apnea is a scam to help relieve you of your money.

Sooooo......tweak your therapy or see an ENT to find out what to do about it.

Surgery or BiPAP. I am on the latter at the moment.

My "sleep doctor" (idiot) originally prescribed a fixed pressure of 18 cm. even though that was higher than the sleep study had gone. I asked about Bi-PAP and he looked at me like I shouldn't know about that technology. He looked in my mouth and sort of hinted that I may need to have my throat opened up to get more air in there (without actually mentioning UPPP). Never mentioned an ENT doctor.

But, I fooled him and reset my machine for 10 cm. and got great AHI numbers. It took some time to get the rest of the tweaking ironed out, but I did it.


Den

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tan wrote:Yet there are a few people (myself including) mentioned on several forums, who had to bring FLs significantly below 0.4 to feel better.

Undoubtedly PBE (Place Bow Effect).

Sludge wrote:

tan wrote:Yet there are a few people (myself including) mentioned on several forums, who had to bring FLs significantly below 0.4 to feel better.

Undoubtedly PBE (Place Bow Effect).

I know, i know, UARS is even a bigger scam than sleep apnea. No wonder insurances wont cover it

Sludge wrote:

tan wrote:Yet there are a few people (myself including) mentioned on several forums, who had to bring FLs significantly below 0.4 to feel better.

Undoubtedly PBE (Place Bow Effect).

gotta love google, helping me when my brain isn't quite awake yet:

"place bow effect" Did you mean: placebo effect

I Googled that also and came to the same conclusion. Sludge I think you have a new acronym.

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tan wrote:

Sludge wrote:

tan wrote:Yet there are a few people (myself including) mentioned on several forums, who had to bring FLs significantly below 0.4 to feel better.

Undoubtedly PBE (Place Bow Effect).

I know, i know, UARS is even a bigger scam than sleep apnea. No wonder insurances wont cover it

That is a Disqualified Syllogism ("A vendor therapeutic reference value cannot arbitrarily be used to diagnose disease, therefore UARS is a scam).

Sludge wrote:

tan wrote:

Sludge wrote:

tan wrote:Yet there are a few people (myself including) mentioned on several forums, who had to bring FLs significantly below 0.4 to feel better.

Undoubtedly PBE (Place Bow Effect).

I know, i know, UARS is even a bigger scam than sleep apnea. No wonder insurances wont cover it

That is a Disqualified Syllogism ("A vendor therapeutic reference value cannot arbitrarily be used to diagnose disease, therefore UARS is a scam).

ok, let us start with that 0.4 value of FL. What does it mean? Are FLs below 0.4 of no significance and can be ignored?

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tan wrote:

Sludge wrote:

tan wrote:

Sludge wrote:

tan wrote:Yet there are a few people (myself including) mentioned on several forums, who had to bring FLs significantly below 0.4 to feel better.

Undoubtedly PBE (Place Bow Effect).

I know, i know, UARS is even a bigger scam than sleep apnea. No wonder insurances wont cover it

That is a Disqualified Syllogism ("A vendor therapeutic reference value cannot arbitrarily be used to diagnose disease, therefore UARS is a scam).

ok, let us start with that 0.4 value of FL. What does it mean? Are FLs below 0.4 of no significance and can be ignored?

Where did you come up with that value of "0.4"? Any links?


Den

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princessbelle wrote:Okay took a nap today and decided to play a bit with the settings to see if I could get the flow limit to change. It looks the same but did stay under .5 mark. I tried straight cpap at a pressure of 13. The only events in the nap were RE's at 1.35.

Last night on the auto for her 12/20

Any thoughts or suggestions?

I dunno.......how about YOUR thoughts first.

I've always contended that flow limitations MAY BE worse when using a range of pressures because there MAY BE a tendency for the user to subconsciously react (with resistance) to pressure changes and consequently make the flow limitations worse.
In other words, it could result in a self-feeding frenzy. And, for someone who already has nasal restrictions, it can be a mess.


Den

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